His Eminence, The Pope.

[metis]

As I understand it the word church means 'the called out people"

"Church" in English is "ecclesia" in the Koine Greek that's found in the NT, and it means "community".

Again, the gospels and epistles refer to it as an actual body with many local bodies, and Jesus, then the apostles, appointed people to oversee and manage these local churches, and then the appointees did likewise. The "mark" of the very early church was not the Bible (which this "one body" chose the canon of three centuries later), but was whether your leadership was appointed by others going all the way back to Jesus. One can rather clearly see that process in play in Acts and also the epistles.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

"Church" in English is "ecclesia" in the Koine Greek that's found in the NT, and it means "community".

Apparently, their best bet is that the English word "church" is derived (via proto-Germanic and Gothic) from a Greek word meaning "of the Lord:"

from Proto-Germanic *kirika (source also of Old Saxon kirika, Old Norse kirkja, Old Frisian zerke, Middle Dutch kerke, Dutch kerk, Old High German kirihha, German Kirche).

This is probably [see extensive note in OED] borrowed via an unrecorded Gothic word from Greek kyriake (oikia), kyriakon doma "the Lord's (house)," from kyrios "ruler, lord," from PIE root *keue- "to swell" ("swollen," hence "strong, powerful").

Greek kyriakon (adj.) "of the Lord" was used of houses of Christian worship since c.300, especially in the East, though it was less common in this sense than ekklesia or basilike.

church | Origin and meaning of church by Online Etymology Dictionary

 

[metis]

Apparently, their best bet is that the English word "church" is derived (via proto-Germanic and Gothic) from a Greek word meaning "of the Lord:"

Much of what we read in English as found in the English scriptures involved moving through a short chain of languages. "God", for example, comes also from the German, not the Hebrew nor the Greek, and I believe they got it from the Latin but tailored it to reflect their own language.

Fortunately, over the last half century there has been an insistence of trying to use more direct translations even though they may read rather clumbsily, and the one I use the most is the Revised Standard Version (RSV), which be found online here: Bible: Revised Standard Version It's also rather easy to use as a search engine of sorts.

 

[Furchizedek]

I think the Catholics say that the Pope is a stand-in for God.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I think the Catholics say that the Pope is a stand-in for God.

Definitely not! The Pope basically helps to provide a point of unity for the Church and settles disputes over dogma.

 

[Furchizedek]

Definitely not! The Pope basically helps to provide a point of unity for the Church and settles disputes over dogma.

LOL! Do you know anything about Catholicism? Really?

Here are some statements from a Catholic on another discussion group. This is what Catholics believe. Enjoy:

God has appointed the pope to be His Vicar here on earth. When we reject the pope, we reject Jesus, and when we reject Jesus, we reject God.
The pope is not God but stands in for God.
Jesus is speaking to His apostles here, the first bishops of the Catholic Church. He is also speaking to Peter, the first pope. If someone rejects them it's the same as rejecting Jesus.
...and the dogmatic encyclical Humanae Vitae, issued by Pope Paul VI in 1968, says no birth control. And that goes for everyone in the human race, not just Catholics.
According to Our Lady of Fatima, when the pope consecrates Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary in union with all the bishops of the world, Russia will be converted and the world will enjoy a prolonged period of peace.
The pope is a sinner like you and me. But the Holy Spirit makes the pope an infallible teacher on matters of faith and morals.
Part of loving God with all of one's soul, strength, and mind is belonging to the Church God founded and obeying the pope God appointed.
Proclaiming that the pope is Christ's vicar in no way detracts from Christ's supremecy. The pope is Christ's VICAR, His stand-in, His vice president, His executive officer so to speak.
You disobey God if you reject the pope.
The Church is not a loose fellowship of all believers. It is the visible organization founded by Christ, with a pope, bishops, priests, monks, and nuns. In the New Testament, from Acts through Revelation, this is unmistakeably clear. Defiance of God, you say? Whenever anyone defies the Church they are defy God.
That's why we need to humbly submit ourselves to the pope and the Church.
...we need to keep in mind that believing in Jesus means believing in everything He taught, including the Church He founded and the pope He appointed.
The Church speaks for God.
Catholic assertions are the assertions of Jesus Christ.
To reject the pope is to reject God.
Confession, Communion, prayers to Mary and other saints, and obedience to the pope do lead to sanctity.
Believing on Jesus includes believing in the Church He founded and the Pope He appointed.
Q. Who has authority over the baptized?
A. The bishops and priests of the Catholic Church, especially the bishop of Rome, the pope, the Vicar of Christ on earth.
Q. What does God do with those who wittingly and knowingly reject the authority figures He has set up?
A. He sends them to Hell forever.
O dearest Holy Mother Mary, I pray that the next pope will crack down on liberal priests and seninarians, and priests and seminarians with homosexual tendencies, so that our children will be safe. I also pray for the return of all fallen-away Catholics, and the conversion of every man, woman, and child in the planet to Catholicism. Amen.

 

[metis]

LOL! Do you know anything about Catholicism? Really?

Here are some statements from a Catholic on another discussion group. This is what Catholics believe. Enjoy:

God has appointed the pope to be His Vicar here on earth. When we reject the pope, we reject Jesus, and when we reject Jesus, we reject God.
The pope is not God but stands in for God.
Jesus is speaking to His apostles here, the first bishops of the Catholic Church. He is also speaking to Peter, the first pope. If someone rejects them it's the same as rejecting Jesus.
...and the dogmatic encyclical Humanae Vitae, issued by Pope Paul VI in 1968, says no birth control. And that goes for everyone in the human race, not just Catholics.
According to Our Lady of Fatima, when the pope consecrates Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary in union with all the bishops of the world, Russia will be converted and the world will enjoy a prolonged period of peace.
The pope is a sinner like you and me. But the Holy Spirit makes the pope an infallible teacher on matters of faith and morals.
Part of loving God with all of one's soul, strength, and mind is belonging to the Church God founded and obeying the pope God appointed.
Proclaiming that the pope is Christ's vicar in no way detracts from Christ's supremecy. The pope is Christ's VICAR, His stand-in, His vice president, His executive officer so to speak.
You disobey God if you reject the pope.
The Church is not a loose fellowship of all believers. It is the visible organization founded by Christ, with a pope, bishops, priests, monks, and nuns. In the New Testament, from Acts through Revelation, this is unmistakeably clear. Defiance of God, you say? Whenever anyone defies the Church they are defy God.
That's why we need to humbly submit ourselves to the pope and the Church.
...we need to keep in mind that believing in Jesus means believing in everything He taught, including the Church He founded and the pope He appointed.
The Church speaks for God.
Catholic assertions are the assertions of Jesus Christ.
To reject the pope is to reject God.
Confession, Communion, prayers to Mary and other saints, and obedience to the pope do lead to sanctity.
Believing on Jesus includes believing in the Church He founded and the Pope He appointed.
Q. Who has authority over the baptized?
A. The bishops and priests of the Catholic Church, especially the bishop of Rome, the pope, the Vicar of Christ on earth.
Q. What does God do with those who wittingly and knowingly reject the authority figures He has set up?
A. He sends them to Hell forever.
O dearest Holy Mother Mary, I pray that the next pope will crack down on liberal priests and seninarians, and priests and seminarians with homosexual tendencies, so that our children will be safe. I also pray for the return of all fallen-away Catholics, and the conversion of every man, woman, and child in the planet to Catholicism. Amen.

Can I ask, where did you get this from? It's way too over the top in part, thus not really reflecting Catholic theology at times.

 

[Furchizedek]

Can I ask, where did you get this from?

Yes, of course you can ask, but I already said: "on another discussion group." It's from the collected sayings of a Catholic there over a period of a couple of years. And that's just some of it, the part I culled out for you.

Are you Catholic? I was raised Catholic and went to a Catholic grade school for 6 years. I know what they believe, and while this guy might seem extreme to you, I'm pretty sure it's basically right as far as they're concerned. Print out that bit and take it to a priest and ask him.

It's way too over the top in part, thus not really reflecting Catholic theology at times.

What exactly do you think is "over the top"? Can you be more specific? What is not reflecting Catholic theology? Be specific. Here's some more. Ask a priest if he has any issues with any of this:

The perpetual virginity of Mary, is an article of faith. To reject this doctrine would be the same as rejecting all the doctrines of the Church. To reject even one infallible doctrine of the Catholic Church sends the soul to Hell forever.
Catholicism may not be the only Christianity but it is the only true Christianity.
What is the New Testament, except a history of the early days of the Catholic Church?
The New Testament was written by eight Catholic bishops, namely Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Peter, Paul, James, and Jude.
The gospel is the whole package of Jesus' teaching, including Holy Eucharist, the founding of the Church, the divinity of Christ, devotion to the Blessed Mother, Heaven, Hell, Purgatory, and indulgences.
"The Catholic Church, [is] the sole authentic interpreter of scripture."
All Christians are not the same. Only Catholics are true Christians---the rest are either heretics or schismatics.
The Kingdom of God is the Catholic Church.
All is darkness outside the Catholic Church.
The Catholic Church speaks for God.
Prayers to Mary Are Mandatory for Salvation

By all means, ask a priest which of these sayings are wrong. (Hope I haven't included any duplicates from the last posting.) The Catholic church tries to stay under the radar with some of this stuff, but this is what they believe. Their basic attitudes haven't changed since the days of torture and burning at the stake for not believing what they say you must believe. Their intransigent "our way or the highway" attitude hasn't changed in a thousand years. They just can't get away with what they used to get away with, in the modern world.

 

[Furchizedek]

Sorry, metis, I didn't realize the last post was not from Saint Frankenstein. I'll try to pay more attention. Nothing really changes, but still, I need to watch who a post is from. Anyway, I wanted to ask St. Frankenstein what "progressive Catholicism" is, as he shows himself to be. I don't know. I mean, I know Francis is certainly more progressive, but still, their underlying philosophy is that there is no salvation outside of the Catholic church, as far as I know. I think during the Dark Ages when they were burning people at the stake, they figured that since there is no salvation outside of the church, anyone who refused to be in the church might as well be dead anyway so no harm was done in killing them. True? Not true?

 

[sandy whitelinger]

I think you have to be Catholic...

I hear they can even be Polish.

 

[BSM1]

I hear they can even be Polish.

How shiny would you want them?

 

[Furchizedek]

How shiny would you want them?

Polish, not polish.

 

[BSM1]

Polish, not polish.

Ohh...never mind...

 

[sandy whitelinger]

How shiny would you want them?

Silly boy.

 

[JayToka]

I think you have to be Catholic...

The Pope is a Jesuit.

 

[JayToka]

unnecessary.

Ahhh.. the penny drops.. your correct, if you mean what I think you mean.

 

[JayToka]

Who wrote the math book you studied in the ninth grade?

Indeed.

 

[JayToka]

That is a stupid definition of insanity.

Nothing you've thought of is rarely your own.

Do some people follow mindlessly? Yes of course, but you don't have to be catholic or even religious to do this. No one is immune from this.

You see, what you are failing to grasp is that people are naturally dogmatic........whether it's their own creation or someone else's.

Believing something that is not your own shouldn't even be a point of contention or debate really. Either an argument holds weight or it doesn't.

Your issue may be more with authority, which is another objection entirely.

Maybe your right. There are worse forms of insanity. But that definition ranks high on the list.

 

[pearl]

I was raised Catholic and went to a Catholic grade school for 6 years.

Then your education in Catholicism has been stunted. Compare this with quitting public school in the 6th grade and attempting to converse with graduates.

The perpetual virginity of Mary, is an article of faith.

There are 12 articles of faith;
Article 1: I believe in God, the Father Almighty, Creator of heaven and earth.

Article 2: And in Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord.

Article 3: Who was conceived by the power of the Holy Spirit and born of the Virgin Mary.

Article 4: He suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, died, and was buried.

Article 5: He descended into hell. The third day he arose again from the dead.

Article 6: He ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of God the Father Almighty.

Article 7: He will come again to judge the living and the dead.

Article 8: I believe in the Holy Spirit,

Article 9: the holy catholic Church, the Communion of Saints,

Article 10: the forgiveness of sins,

Article 11: the resurrection of the body,

Article 12: And in life everlasting.

The perpetual virginity of Mary, is an article of faith.

The perpetual virginity of Mary is from the Protecangelium of James, 2nd cent and is acknowledged as primarily a work of 'fantastic fiction' and is not an article of faith.

The perpetual virginity of Mary, is an article of faith.

The New Testament was written by eight Catholic bishops, namely Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Peter, Paul, James, and Jude.

The NT was written by 2nd generation evangelists, anonymously. Most of the rest of your post simply reflects your lack of knowledge of the Catholic Church.

 

[Furchizedek]

Qualifier: Everything I say below is my opinion and/or my beliefs.

Then your education in Catholicism has been stunted.

Oh no! Not that! Sorry, but I disagree. And even if it was true, it would be a good thing. I think you don't understand the nature of Catholicism.

Compare this with quitting public school in the 6th grade and attempting to converse with graduates.

No. You compare it. Knock yourself out.

There are 12 articles of faith;

snippped (I don't care how many there are.)

The perpetual virginity of Mary is from the Protecangelium of James, 2nd cent and is acknowledged as primarily a work of 'fantastic fiction' and is not an article of faith.

I don't care. Your argument is not with me. It's with the Catholic who made all the statements I posted here. You'll have to find him and straighten him out. I suggest you stop every Catholic you meet and question him or her until you find the right one and you can get them on the right Catholic track, your track, the one true track of the one true religion outside of which there is no salvation, they say.

The NT was written by 2nd generation evangelists, anonymously. Most of the rest of your post simply reflects your lack of knowledge of the Catholic Church.

I'm getting tired of your ad hominem attacks on me, my education has been stunted you said, and now you say I have a lack of knowledge of the Catholic church. Sorry, but I disagree.

Your argument is not with me. It's with the Catholic who made all the statements I posted here. According to him, "The NT was written by eight Catholic bishops, namely Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Peter, Paul, James, and Jude."

Find a Catholic to argue your Catholic stuff with. I'm not it.