Hey !, he did it, dropping the big mother.

[averageJOE]

How many innocents were killed?

Honestly?...We will probably never know. Because the story of this bomb, including the number of ISIS killed, is the story the military gave the media to run with. They most likely had the number of casualties decided before the bomb was even dropped.

I know this because when I was in Iraq we were given classes on what to say to the media.

 

[omega2xx]

The only problem with that theory is that it is RW media telling you to not trust ANY media that isn't conservative media. I wouldn't trust them if I were you.

Get real. do you think we are so stupid that we can't recognize the biased reporting of the drive by liberal media? The stupid ones are the ones who can't recognize it.

You think Trump is better now? You're not disgusted with voting for someone who lied over and over and has flip-flopped on nearly every position?

Evidently you have forgotten Clinton lying to the parents over the casket of their son killed at Bengazzi. How about Obama lying over his "red line" warning. You seem to have a very convenient lack of memory.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

There's little sense of soverienty within "tribal" units.

Whatever word or phrase you want to do it, it is respecting them as people enough to let them make their own decisions.

If we "outsiders" didn't do anything, these psychopaths hence isis will,

ISIS only exists because outsiders cleared the way for them. Saddam was brutal, yes, but just look at what unfolded without him. Something far, far worse. And when ISIS is gone, these alliances will break up and the warring will go on.

I can't defend Isis like it's some poor country of misunderstood people who just want to live out their lives.

I don't support them either. Nor do I support actions and agendas that create festering breeding pools of extremism. What do you suppose Russia and China will do when this Crusade for Democracy effects their interests?

 

[omega2xx]

But you did change your mind. Trump originally said that interfering in Syria would be a bad idea, and tried to characterize Hillary as a "warmonger", claiming that she would do what Trump is doing now, presenting it as a reason to elect him over her. So for conservatives, it's not about what is done, but who is the one doing it? Just another example of yokels placing blind partisanship loyalty before principles.

Fortunately Trump is willing to change his positions if the conditions warrant it. I think it has been shown that most American and our allies approve of what he did.

 

[Vinayaka]

So what do you suggest we do? Bomb everyone and anyone who has access to the nuclear trigger? Yeah, at least we will kill somebody.

Reopen SALT talks for everyone, I suppose. I don't think anyone has any definitive solutions.

 

[BSM1]

Please tell us how many more American troops coming home in body bags were you willing to expend? We have lost many more American lives in two nutso wars there than were killed on 9-11.

Point taken. That's why you should be first in line to condone dropping these big *** bombs on our enemies so fewer troops will have to be placed in harm's way. BTW, most of us that joined the military understood the ramifications.

 

[tytlyf]

Perhaps there should have been.

Why? You like wasting money?

 

[Stevicus]

Historian checking in! Gotta throw a flag here for some clarification. It is important.

ISIS represents an ideology or a very abstract band of militants, at best. Hitler, on the other hand, represented a nation. A nation has a system of government, a populace, an army, an economy, assets, foreign policy, advisors, etc etc etc. Isis does not have these things. To compare fighting a nation that has declared traditional war to the struggle against ISIS is not a good one. ISIS does not have to answer to anything outside of their own circle. Germany did. They had to balance and maintain things that ISIS does not. Germany operated under what we generally like to call rules of war. (To be clear: this is not including the Holocaust, this is discussing formal war as a nation and why comparing the two is not always accurate.) ISIS does not operate under these rules and their tactics are much more difficult to predict because they don't have an "army" or "generals" or "presidents/chancellors, etc". There is no diplomacy, no lines of communication, no representatives, nothing, nada, zip.

Summary: It is much easier to fight a nation. You can defeat a nation. It is much harder to defeat an ideology.

For these reasons (and a few more if I wanted to dedicate more time to it), the comparison between the two is a faulty one.

Okay, but just to clarify, my point was related to the examples of Korea and Vietnam, not ISIS specifically. Otherwise, well said.

 

[BSM1]

Why?

Because you care about white soldiers more than innocents who live in the spaces that are cluster bombed and dstriked?

Okay...sure...

 

[Father Heathen]

Why?

Because you care about white soldiers more than innocents who live in the spaces that are cluster bombed and dstriked?

You forgot white, strait, male soldiers, so you paint him as a homophobe and a misogynist as well as a racist.

 

[Notanumber]

Why? You like wasting money?

Better that wasting Western lives.

 

[Alison Wonderland]

This OP is absolutely repulsive.

Cheering about actual gore and describing it as beautiful.

 

[BSM1]

You forgot white, strait, male soldiers, so you paint him as a homophobe and a misogynist as well as a racist.

Well played, sir...

 

[psychoslice]

The matter is more complicated than you think, these people are every where, it's easier to eliminate a mafia
than the people of the IS, their aim is to destroy the west by long term wars and as their leaders said and announced that we aren't in Mosul, we aren't in Afghanistan, we aren't in Libya, we're everywhere.

They aren't easy and they're even smart.

True but you have to start from somewhere, we need to eliminate these evil people from our planet so we all can live in peace.

 

[psychoslice]

Absolutely not, he might have killed a few. but it will have caused far more disciples to join their fight.
That is the way it has always been. They are very dangerous "maggots" indeed.
You do not win the battle of hearts and minds with Bombs

Think how far Christianity was spread by killing one man,
His followers are still celebrating his death 2000 years later, and millions have died in his name.
Easter is every year.
There is no such thing as good killing.

When it comes to ISIS, any killing is good.

 

[psychoslice]

You know if you are trying to separate yourself from your Nazi tattoo you aren't doing a good job.

Let it go for Christ sake, and wake up to reality.

 

[shunyadragon]

Because the bomb was made years ago, so there was plenty of opportunity for him to give the OK to use it if he had felt a need to-- but he didn't.

Contingency plans always are made well in advance. Just because we have contingency plans for an all out nuclear war doesn't mean that the president plans on starting one.

What "facts"? Just because I may have something doesn't mean I intend to use it. Many here at RF have a gun in their home, but that doesn't mean they intend to shoot someone.

BTW, Trump just giving the green light to use such a weapon without authorization from his administration is scary. I live in a country-- the U.S.-- that puts civilian control over the military, and to trust the military to the point that he did is dangerous for our democracy.

It was only recently placed in Afghanistan with specific plans on how it was to be used. This was done soon before the end of the Obama administration.

 

[psychoslice]

I'm tentatively in favor of this use of the bomb. It sounds like it's purpose was to eliminate the safe havens and transport routes that ISIS (and probably tons of previous terrorist groups) were using to operate. It was also in a relatively remote area so hopefully few civilian casualties. Maybe this will cripple them, for the time being.

But in general, I do think we need a radically different plan of dealing with the Middle East and terrorism because bombing the crap out of countries and deposing leaders is obviously not working.

And I wholeheartedly disagree with @psychoslice regarding his dehumanization of these people. That's exactly the mindset that creates terrorists in the first place. These are misguided and horrible people but they likely got that way through childhood indoctrination and decades of their lives being destabilized and destroyed by the meddling of outside forces. We need to, ultimately, kill the ideology with kindness (humanitarian aid and general leaving them alone) rather than bombs.

Kindness can never work with people like ISIS, what are we going to offer them flowers lol.

 

[psychoslice]

Well, tell that to the South Koreans, especially the ones living in Seoul, whereas millions of them could die in an exchange even if nukes are not used. And also the 30,000 American troops there. Wishing for war is, frankly, morally bankrupt.

Still i feel he needs to be taken out for the good of the world, I may sound harsh but some times we need to fight for our freedom.

 

[Alison Wonderland]

Let it go for Christ sake, and wake up to reality.

That people getting blown apart and that death and conflict are things of beauty as you said repeatedly in this thread?