Gay and Atheist?

[MSizer]

I'm a lesbian who grew up in a Christian setting, though I can honestly say that I was on my way to secularism long before I even figured out what my feelings towards women meant.

The actual reason for dropping religion was simply that as I learned more about science and philosophy I started to discover how truly indefensible (and in retrospect, ridiculous) my beliefs at the time were.

I'm sure there are a lot of people, though, who do have some kind of struggle between their religious and sexual inclination. I can only hope that their loyalty to bronze age mythology doesn't prevent them from persuing happiness with a person whom they can love.

hear hear! Frubals for the newbie.

 

[Meow Mix]

hear hear! Frubals for the newbie.

Ha ha! Thank you. What are these frubals? You have a ton! I went from having almost none to several thousand somehow.

EDIT: PS, that's a super cute ferret!

 

[MSizer]

Ha ha! Thank you. What are these frubals? You have a ton! I went from having almost none to several thousand somehow.

EDIT: PS, that's a super cute ferret!

Please excuse the sidestep guys, I'm not trying to derail, but I'd like to quickly answer her question.

A frubal is a gift you offer someone when you think they've posted something good. You do it by clicking on the little silver scale icon at the top right of the person's post. When you click on it, a text box will appear to grant you a chance to add a brief msg, something perhaps to explain why you're awarding the frubal. Each frubal is worth several thousand - I don't remember exactly how many. There is an FAQ which explains it in more detail.

Sorry guys, back to the OP.

 

[Rhizomatic]

Okay, this is not a debate. Got that? I don't care what you believe or don't believe. I don't care who you want to sleep with. I've just made an observation and would like to get your comments.

I have noticed that there seem to be more homosexuals who profess to be atheists than there are homosexuals who profess to be theists. If this is the case, do you see a cause and effect thing at work here? It strikes me that people "decide" not to believe in God when the religion they may have been raised with (I'm thinking primarily Christianity) tells them that their affection for a loved-one of the same sex is sinful. Some seem to be able to continue to believe in God, even if they no longer consider themselves to be religious, but it seems to me that most address the conflict by deciding not to believe in God at all. If you are gay or lesbian and are also an atheist, did what you may have been told about your sexual preference in church influence your decision not to believe in God? Or was the "decision" no more of a decision than your sexual orientation?

I knew that I didn't believe in deities before I knew what homosexuality was, let alone that some interpretations of some theistic religions oppose it.

 

[Autodidact]

Please excuse the sidestep guys, I'm not trying to derail, but I'd like to quickly answer her question.

A frubal is a gift you offer someone when you think they've posted something good. You do it by clicking on the little silver scale icon at the top right of the person's post. When you click on it, a text box will appear to grant you a chance to add a brief msg, something perhaps to explain why you're awarding the frubal. Each frubal is worth several thousand - I don't remember exactly how many. There is an FAQ which explains it in more detail.

Sorry guys, back to the OP.

And then you click user CP to see what nice things other people said about your brilliant posts.

 

[filthy tugboat]

To be honest, I wouldn't be surprised if homosexuality does effect ones theistic position, especially if the position opposes homosexuality. The reason I think this is because if you are naturally attracted to members of the same sex and you have been indoctrinated into following a religion that opposes such an attraction then you would come to question that religion a lot sooner and with a lot more passion than someone who is not. It basically adds motive to question the religion and for many to doubt the religion.

This is the most common argument against theism from homosexuals that I've spoken with about it. "If God opposes homosexuality then why does he make homosexuals?"

I realise there is a lot of stigmatizm from some religious people about whether people are naturally homosexual or not but from my understanding many homosexuals are attracted to members of the same sex in the same way many heterosexuals are attracted to members of the opposite sex. It's no more of a choice than it is for heterosexuals.

 

[Penumbra]

I'm an atheist, but not gay, so I can only make conclusions based on my observations and similarities with my own experience. Firstly, I haven't noticed any statistical difference among homosexuals regarding belief in god, but the sample size available to me is not nearly enough to make any significant conclusions.

If a gay person, who realizes that they felt like this all along, and that their love is just as real and passionate as a heterosexual's, reads in an old book the hateful and violent things said towards her, she may realize how incorrect and hateful the author of that text was. When they see so many organized religions calling homosexuality a sin, and yet they experience it first hand and see that there isn't anything wrong with it, they see how wrong so many people can be about something they haven't experienced first hand and have no legitimate argument against.

I think there's a bit of a chain reaction involved. That's how it worked for me at least. Once I concluded that the god I believed in was certainly not the god of the Bible, the next logical question was, "Well, where did this belief in god come from then?" Sparks of disagreement can open up a wide door of critical analysis, which leads one to realize how many assumptions they once made.

 

[Where Is God]

I'm an atheist, but not gay, so I can only make conclusions based on my observations and similarities with my own experience. Firstly, I haven't noticed any statistical difference among homosexuals regarding belief in god, but the sample size available to me is not nearly enough to make any significant conclusions.

If a gay person, who realizes that they felt like this all along, and that their love is just as real and passionate as a heterosexual's, reads in an old book the hateful and violent things said towards her, she may realize how incorrect and hateful the author of that text was. When they see so many organized religions calling homosexuality a sin, and yet they experience it first hand and see that there isn't anything wrong with it, they see how wrong so many people can be about something they haven't experienced first hand and have no legitimate argument against.

I think there's a bit of a chain reaction involved. That's how it worked for me at least. Once I concluded that the god I believed in was certainly not the god of the Bible, the next logical question was, "Well, where did this belief in god come from then?" Sparks of disagreement can open up a wide door of critical analysis, which leads one to realize how many assumptions they once made.

Win! I am atheist but not gay! There is absolutely ZERO things wrong with being homosexual.

 

[Ungrateful]

....It strikes me that people "decide" not to believe in God when the religion they may have been raised with (I'm thinking primarily Christianity) tells them that their affection for a loved-one of the same sex is sinful. Some seem to be able to continue to believe in God, even if they no longer consider themselves to be religious, but it seems to me that most address the conflict by deciding not to believe in God at all. If you are gay or lesbian and are also an atheist, did what you may have been told about your sexual preference in church influence your decision not to believe in God? Or was the "decision" no more of a decision than your sexual orientation?

Interesting post, which points at something that I've always struggled with. I never saw belief as a choice I could consciously make. Something either seemed true from the evidence there or it didn't, if the evidence changed, my belief might change. Anything else felt like lying to myself. Do we perhaps sometimes talk of our beliefs when we mean our hopes or wishes? I could see those being far more of a choice.

I am a little bi, I'm sometimes attracted to women, occassionally I've been attracted to the odd man, but more usually I'm not sexually attracted to anyone at all. My bi-ness only made itself apparant a few years ago and was quite a surprise to me. I was a non-believer decades before then, and have often wondered how people within the church manage to deal with this, it must be difficult.

 

[Revoltingest]

Interesting post, which points at something that I've always struggled with. I never saw belief as a choice I could consciously make. Something either seemed true from the evidence there or it didn't, if the evidence changed, my belief might change.

True dat.

 

[Katzpur]

Interesting post, which points at something that I've always struggled with. I never saw belief as a choice I could consciously make. Something either seemed true from the evidence there or it didn't, if the evidence changed, my belief might change. Anything else felt like lying to myself. Do we perhaps sometimes talk of our beliefs when we mean our hopes or wishes? I could see those being far more of a choice.

I'm totally with you on this -- at least as if we're talking about a choice in a Higher Power. I don't see myself as "choosing to believe in God" any more than I see myself "choosing to be attracted to men." On the other hand, I see my choice of specific religion to be more of a choice, based on doctrines I can see as providing answers to some of life's questions. Theoretically speaking, I might be able to reject my religious beliefs as false, but it would be almost impossible for me to reject the spiritual sense I have that there is a God.

 

[Falvlun]

In my case, I left Christianity precisely because of the way Christianity treats LGBTs and women, but at that point I was still a theist. I didn't make a conscious decision to become an atheist; but not too long after I renounced Christianity, I realized that I no longer believed in God.

Beware of the zombie thread!

Katzpur, I thought Smoke made a good observation here. While I am not gay-- so that was not a factor in me leaving Christianity--, once I left Christianity, I slowly realized that I really had no reason to believe that God existed either. In other words, the religion provided the framework for my belief in God and without the framework, the God concept just didn't hold up anymore.

So, it does make sense to me why people becoming disillusioned with a religion are more likely to end up rejecting God as well.

 

[Wills191]

I can only speak for me, I'm gay and Christian.

In my own view my sexuality and religion arn't in conflict as I believe God is not only tolerant of homosexuality but created it himself for good purposes. I also believe if god were to take human form he (or it) would be bisexual.

Therefore I see my religion and sexuality as 100% compatible with each other, being gay hasn't made a difference to my relationship with god.

Hope that makes sense...

 

[Gaura Priya]

Interesting post, which points at something that I've always struggled with. I never saw belief as a choice I could consciously make. Something either seemed true from the evidence there or it didn't, if the evidence changed, my belief might change. Anything else felt like lying to myself. Do we perhaps sometimes talk of our beliefs when we mean our hopes or wishes? I could see those being far more of a choice.

I am a little bi, I'm sometimes attracted to women, occassionally I've been attracted to the odd man, but more usually I'm not sexually attracted to anyone at all. My bi-ness only made itself apparant a few years ago and was quite a surprise to me. I was a non-believer decades before then, and have often wondered how people within the church manage to deal with this, it must be difficult.

Ungrateful, have you ever thought that you may be an asexual? You can check out AVEN, Asexual Visibility and Education Network for more information.

Gay and atheist? Gaytheist?

 

[Ungrateful]

Ungrateful, have you ever thought that you may be an asexual? You can check out AVEN, Asexual Visibility and Education Network for more information.

Gay and atheist? Gaytheist?

I'm not asexual, attraction still does happen for me sometimes. I prefer not to have all that goes along with it in my life, so don't persue it even if it does. Indeed I will talk myself out of it. That has probably fed back into the tendancy.

I've gained an awful lot of freedom and happiness with that. The more I left it behind, the more I could see just how manipulative and scheming people were being to each other over it. It wasn't until I started cutting the strings that I noticed the puppeteers.

 

[LaurasaurusRex]

I'm not saying that's not possible. I'm just asking because I see so many more gay atheists around here than gay theists.

That's because the church supresses who they are cos they think its 'gross' . I imagine that this would be a wakeup call to anyone who is on the receiving end (no pun intended) of the discrimination. I'm sure it would drive someone to question the beliefs they hold.

 

[LaurasaurusRex]

I can only speak for me, I'm gay and Christian.

In my own view my sexuality and religion arn't in conflict as I believe God is not only tolerant of homosexuality but created it himself for good purposes. I also believe if god were to take human form he (or it) would be bisexual.

Therefore I see my religion and sexuality as 100% compatible with each other, being gay hasn't made a difference to my relationship with god.

Hope that makes sense...

You making your own conclusions and associating them with the church. I do not think this is fair because your are twisting the church's teachings to make them sound what they are genuinely not, in other words you are redefining the church's philosophy to sound ethical. And the fact is that the church is NOT ethical. To really reach awareness you have to accept what the church ACTUALLY teaches and not add to it your own little happy ending, you must ask yourself: is this right?*

*Is it right what the church teaches about homosexuality?

Short answer : NO

 

[dgirl1986]

I can only speak for me, I'm gay and Christian.

In my own view my sexuality and religion arn't in conflict as I believe God is not only tolerant of homosexuality but created it himself for good purposes. I also believe if god were to take human form he (or it) would be bisexual.

Therefore I see my religion and sexuality as 100% compatible with each other, being gay hasn't made a difference to my relationship with god.

Hope that makes sense...

:clap2:

Gay and atheist? Gaytheist?

Teehee

 

[dgirl1986]

My own personal two cents worth...I know plenty of gay and bi pagans. I know only 1 gay atheist. I also know 1 gay christian.

Conclusion? Religion has nothing to do with sexuality.

 

[SteveGrayFTW]

Okay, this is not a debate. Got that? I don't care what you believe or don't believe. I don't care who you want to sleep with. I've just made an observation and would like to get your comments.

I have noticed that there seem to be more homosexuals who profess to be atheists than there are homosexuals who profess to be theists. If this is the case, do you see a cause and effect thing at work here? It strikes me that people "decide" not to believe in God when the religion they may have been raised with (I'm thinking primarily Christianity) tells them that their affection for a loved-one of the same sex is sinful. Some seem to be able to continue to believe in God, even if they no longer consider themselves to be religious, but it seems to me that most address the conflict by deciding not to believe in God at all. If you are gay or lesbian and are also an atheist, did what you may have been told about your sexual preference in church influence your decision not to believe in God? Or was the "decision" no more of a decision than your sexual orientation?

I'm gay, was raised Catholic, but now consider myself an Agnostic Theist.

My sexual orientation didn't really have anything to do with pulling away from Christianity though. I never really thought I was going to hell for being gay, and I pretty much dismissed those who said or thought I was.

I was aware of gay-friendly Christian churches (a lesbian friend of mine was married in a Metropolitan Community Church), but I just never really felt that strong of a connection with Christianity in general. I was found myself questioning whether or not Christianity was "correct," and if we should in fact be worshipping Zeus, or Ra, or whatever...

I do wholeheartedly believe there is something more out there though, be it "God" or whatever, even though I can't say I know what it is...so atheism was never really an option for me.