Female Muslims... please explain

[Aquitaine]

She is still a beurifull human being. A simple piece of cloth elavated her, her diginity, honour, personality, self respect immensely.

Considering you view Women who wear revealing clothes to be immodest and unpure, are you telling us then that you don't mind an "unpure" Woman wearing "immodest" clothing, so long as she occasionally wears a headscarf? As if that suddenly transforms her, even if the headscarf is Photoshopped on?

:biglaugh:

 

[Engyo]

Considering you view Women who wear revealing clothes to be immodest and unpure, are you telling us then that you don't mind an "unpure" Woman wearing "immodest" clothing, so long as she occasionally wears a headscarf? As if that suddenly transforms her, even if the headscarf is Photoshopped on?

:biglaugh:

Well, we certainly wouldn't want to conclude that males in that culture are incapable of controlling themselves when in the presence of an uncovered woman, now would we?

 

[301ouncer]

I'm not calling you a liar, I just think it's funny how you objectified one Woman for wearing revealing clothes as being basically, immodest and unpure - but then the very Woman whom you objectify as the "good" one and the pure and modest one is a Lebanese pop singer and Model who frequently wears revealing outfits.

You make me laugh so much! :biglaugh:

Nah man I am not accusing you of calling me a liar. I am just making fun of the whole thing. It just tony montana added his take on things muwhahahha.

Good and honest spotting by you. :yes:

You welcome enjoy the clip. out for now.

 

[Aquitaine]

Well, we certainly wouldn't want to conclude that males in that culture are incapable of controlling themselves when in the presence of an uncovered woman, now would we?

Hehehe!

Oddly enough one thing I don't understand is how the "Westerners" are always ignorantly accussed of (just like I was in this thread by Abu) objectifying Women as sex-objects/pieces of meat. Yet it seems that the viewpoint of "Women must be covered in order to be modest/pure" is implying that they are fundamentally nothing more than sexual temptresses who need t be restrained by cloth - and thus, objectify Women as sex-objects.

 

[fatima_bintu_islam]

hehehehee.

Is this why you emailed for?

She is still a beurifull human being. A simple piece of cloth elavated her, her diginity, honour, personality, self respect immensely.

Anyways I heard on aljazeerah english that many labanies models christian/muslims and actresses as well as eygeption woman give up their secular oppresssive entertainment for Islam.

My respected brother, I was just trying to defend the fact that you did not know she was a pop singer , i.e only twisted man know her ==> You're not a twisted man

I understand now why the angry tone on your reply

 

[Abu Rashid]

Out of curiosity, how do you explain all the straight women who do the same?

That's the point, very few do. The "quest" is undoubtedly led by Western men.

As an immoral, licentious bi woman, I expect I'm lumped in with the straight men. In Abu's mind, I can only be thinking of my own unrequited lust.

Glad you know my way of thinking.

As you demonstrate below though, it's not the case.

Please don't accuse me of misjudging you if I didn't.

It just so happens that I live right across the street from a Muslim Community Center. I regularly see women in hijab, and it always makes me smile. Aside from the loveliness of the garments themselves, I think it's wonderful that these women flaunt their faith.

Well that's a great attitude and I'm impressed. But just like to point out though that hijab has nothing to do with "flaunting faith" at all, this is one of the most common misconceptions propagated. Hijab is merely a level of public decency as most Western societies for instance have a certain level of public decency, usually based on some Christian concept of modesty originally. Does that mean Western women who cover their breasts are "flaunting their Christianity"? Not really, they may not even be Christians.

In contrast, when I see an Arabic woman in a burqa, my gut reaction is quite different: utter revulsion...

How do you know they're Arabic? As I've pointed out before, "Burqa" is an Afghani term, and the garment is most commonly worn in Afghanistan, not in the Arabic world.

Anyway, I find it completely bizarre that a few cm's less cloth and you find it quite acceptable, even admirable, but just go a few cm's more and cover half the face, and it's revolting?

I pity the woman whose government trusts her so little that they legislate her very clothing

As far as I know the only government that does this is the excessively pro-American Saudi government... Strange that isn't it? A government which was specifically formed by the British to replace the government of the Hashemite family (who now rule in Jordan, with a queen that gets around in bikinis). A King that strolls gayly hand in hand with President Bush and is one of the U.S most loyal and deepest allies.

Nah nothing strange about that.. is there?

The key difference is choice, freedom. In America, Muslim women CHOOSE to be faithful. They show true devotion, and I love them for it. In certain other countries, that simple, beautiful expression of faith is robbed of all meaning by being forced on the unwilling.

My guess is you probably don't even know a single woman who wears niqab to even know anything about her circumstances.

I'll give you a bit of a breakdown of the kind of women I know of that wear niqab.

1) Most of the ones I know are Australian (Anglo) converts to Islam or Pakistanis who have grown up in Western society and are strong advocates of the niqab. Not Arabs.

2) The few women I know of in Arab countries that wear niqab, do so against the wishes of their family members, and in some cases against their government as well.

This is the complete opposite of the stereotype you've been trying to peddle here. All thatI can conclude is that you've based your views on misinformation.

 

[fatima_bintu_islam]

Tunisia is a good example for that. In my country, ladies with niqab are not allowed to enter dar al Quran ( house of Quran ) to learn Quran in some days. So, I guess the idea about who is the opressor is the whole opposite of what the stereotypes state.

 

[Storm]

That's the point, very few do. The "quest" is undoubtedly led by Western men.

Several do on this very forum, and it's female leaders in the feminist movement who generally call it to the public's attention. It's not led by men.

Glad you know my way of thinking.

As you demonstrate below though, it's not the case.

Please don't accuse me of misjudging you if I didn't.

You're right, that was uncharitable. That said, I'm familiar with your posts, and they leave very little doubt for you to benefit from.

Well that's a great attitude and I'm impressed. But just like to point out though that hijab has nothing to do with "flaunting faith" at all, this is one of the most common misconceptions propagated. Hijab is merely a level of public decency as most Western societies for instance have a certain level of public decency, usually based on some Christian concept of modesty originally. Does that mean Western women who cover their breasts are "flaunting their Christianity"? Not really, they may not even be Christians.

Whether you acknowledge it or not, the hijab is a sign that the wearer is Muslim.

As for Western women covering their breasts, that's not a sign one is Christian (as you point out yourself). I would, however, consider wearing a cross to be flaunting one's Christianity.

How do you know they're Arabic?

I was referring to women living in Arabic, Muslim nations. I could have been more clear, though.

As I've pointed out before, "Burqa" is an Afghani term, and the garment is most commonly worn in Afghanistan, not in the Arabic world.

I missed that. Thank you for the information.

Anyway, I find it completely bizarre that a few cm's less cloth and you find it quite acceptable, even admirable, but just go a few cm's more and cover half the face, and it's revolting?

It's not the garment, it's the circumstances. I used hijab in the first example because it's familiar to me. I've only seen one woman here veil her face (less than an hour ago, in fact), but it didn't offend me.

What I find offensive is legislation requiring a woman to wear "modest" clothing.

As far as I know the only government that does this is the excessively pro-American Saudi government... Strange that isn't it? A government which was specifically formed by the British to replace the government of the Hashemite family (who now rule in Jordan, with a queen that gets around in bikinis). A King that strolls gayly hand in hand with President Bush and is one of the U.S most loyal and deepest allies.

Nah nothing strange about that.. is there?

The warped relationship between Saudi Arabia and the US is a subject for a whole 'nother thread.

It's my understanding that Iran also legislates women's clothing. First one to spring to mind... too lazy to go searching for a list of countries that do.

Did you mean to imply that such legislation is the result of Western influence?

My guess is you probably don't even know a single woman who wears niqab to even know anything about her circumstances.

You're right, but I know that certain laws strip certain freedoms.

This is the complete opposite of the stereotype you've been trying to peddle here. All thatI can conclude is that you've based your views on misinformation.

And what stereotype am I peddling?

 

[fatima_bintu_islam]

Brother 301ouncer ?

Do you understand that I was defending you? Please tell me if its yes, since Im very sad to see that you had such a bad assumption in me, and I apologise if it sounded as you thought it was.

Barakallahu feek wa shakaralak, and my PM was sincere please reread it after I explained my position to you.

JzkALlah khayr

 

[GabrielWithoutWings]

OMG it's Haifa Wehbe, she's a singer and a model!

LOL. Wow.

The first pic is of fairly ordinary Muslim way to dress. The second is a pic of a prostitute and it's being set beside the 'ordinary' Muslim way to dress for comparative purposes.

Fail.

 

[The Voice of Reason]

My respected brother... You're not a twisted man ...

So much for your ability to judge character.

 

[301ouncer]

Brother 301ouncer ?

Do you understand that I was defending you? Please tell me if its yes, since Im very sad to see that you had such a bad assumption in me, and I apologise if it sounded as you thought it was.

Barakallahu feek wa shakaralak, and my PM was sincere please reread it after I explained my position to you.

JzkALlah khayr

Wasalam alikum my good sister,

SubhanAllah I know you was defending me ofcourse I just did not understand your email to me. Now I do understand. YES ofcourse.

I was not angry as I have been laughing about it . I only get angry at lies not at personal issues or get accused or slandered.

Be at ease. Even if you through a shoe at me I will still smile sister. ONLY true muslims may apply.

That really showed I have no clue who is who anymore in the dark and sexualised treatment of woman.

My wife must really be proud of me for being brainwashed FROM this sex driven multi billion money secular industry all in the name of persuit of happiness. :flirt:

 

[Kerr]

That's the point, very few do. The "quest" is undoubtedly led by Western men.

Not in my experience. Over here there are many women who are a part of "leading the quest".

 

[301ouncer]

Not in my experience. Over here there are many women who are a part of "leading the quest".

The secular system will eventually filter through.

Once the mother/woman is corrupt then the whole family for the exception of the odd soul will be corrupted too. Mother corrupt family corrupt. The odd exception will be greatly tinted with different shades of corruption.

Once the foundation of the secular system is corrupt then the whole socity and its childeren will also be corrupt for the exception of few odd souls. The few odd exceptions will be greatly tinted with different shades of corruption.

The ultimate aim and objectives of the secular satanica is to corrupt the mother/woman.

Thereafter everything else will be much easier from there onwards.

 

[Aquitaine]

The secular system will eventually filter through.

Once the mother/woman is corrupt then the whole family for the exception of the odd soul will be corrupted too. Mother corrupt family corrupt. The odd exception will be greatly tinted with different shades of corruption.

Once the foundation of the secular system is corrupt then the whole socity and its childeren will also be corrupt for the exception of few odd souls. The few odd exceptions will be greatly tinted with different shades of corruption.

The ultimate aim and objectives of the secular satanica is to corrupt the mother/woman.

Thereafter everything else will be much easier from there onwards.

I thought the ultimate objective of the Secular Satanica was the acceptence and spreading of the WMD Destructive Sex that's corrupting Humanity? Oh wait....... you mean there's more than one objective for taking over and corrupting the Earth?!

 

[Kerr]

The secular system will eventually filter through.

Once the mother/woman is corrupt then the whole family for the exception of the odd soul will be corrupted too. Mother corrupt family corrupt. The odd exception will be greatly tinted with different shades of corruption.

Once the foundation of the secular system is corrupt then the whole socity and its childeren will also be corrupt for the exception of few odd souls. The few odd exceptions will be greatly tinted with different shades of corruption.

The ultimate aim and objectives of the secular satanica is to corrupt the mother/woman.

Thereafter everything else will be much easier from there onwards.

And then there is the real world... sorry to say so, but it sounds far to much like a conspiracy theory to be taken seriously. It would be like if I said all Muslims just wanted to convert the entire world to a belief in an evil God so that they will never ever have to look into the face of what is different again, since they hate it.

Seriously, I have grown up i n a very left oriented family of atheists who believe in a secular and feministic society, and all I have seen and learned is that you are wrong.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

The secular system will eventually filter through.

Once the mother/woman is corrupt then the whole family for the exception of the odd soul will be corrupted too. Mother corrupt family corrupt. The odd exception will be greatly tinted with different shades of corruption.

Once the foundation of the secular system is corrupt then the whole socity and its childeren will also be corrupt for the exception of few odd souls. The few odd exceptions will be greatly tinted with different shades of corruption.

The ultimate aim and objectives of the secular satanica is to corrupt the mother/woman.

Thereafter everything else will be much easier from there onwards.

I agree on one point in your argument. Women and mothers offer some of the greatest influence on our societies.

My response: don't shackle them. Let them be free to shine. To love. To counsel. And to lead.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

The ultimate aim and objectives of the secular satanica is to corrupt the mother/woman.

What is the "secular satanica"? I'm secular, and right now my "ultimate aim" is to make my future wife and the future mother of my children happy.

 

[301ouncer]

And then there is the real world... sorry to say so, but it sounds far to much like a conspiracy theory to be taken seriously.

This is the reality.

Its only been just over 240 years of secularisim. Give it more time and you find me of the paitiant.

It would be like if I said all Muslims just wanted to convert the entire world to a belief in an evil God so that they will never ever have to look into the face of what is different again, since they hate it.

This is your fallacy.

Its secular media propagandaa to make you believe so and islam critics. Everyone entitled to his own faith. For us only to convey the messege.

Seriously, I have grown up i n a very left oriented family of atheists who believe in a secular and feministic society, and all I have seen and learned is that you are wrong.

Majority are. the rest of few good men are tinted with all different colours and shades of corruption.

 

[Kerr]

This is the reality.

Its only been just over 240 years of secularisim. Give it more time and you find me of the paitiant.

It may be reality as you see it, that does not make it so.

This is your fallacy.

Its secular media propagandaa to make you believe so and islam critics. Everyone entitled to his own faith. For us only to convey the messege.

It is not my fallacy, I mentioned it to illustrate my view on your words, not as something I believe in (which I don´t).

Majority are. the rest of few good men are tinted with all different colours and shades of corruption.

In my experience most people are good and no man is perfect.