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Faith & War

Vee

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
What, in your religious opinion, is a justification for war? What does your religion say about it, has it any prescribed 'rules' so to speak for when you should go to war, who can be killed, keeping slaves, who is eligible to fight &c.? What is your opinion? Are you warlike or a pacifist?

This is in debates so feel free to tell other posters why their reasons suck and yours are obviously better.

I think war is the best example of human stupidity that has ever existed, especially when people use religion as an excuse. One side prays so that God will bless their army, the other side also prays to God to bless their army. In the end lots of people die and get buried in the same land. All could have lived a much longer and joyful life... humans!
 

Rival

se Dex me saut.
Staff member
Premium Member
I think war is the best example of human stupidity that has ever existed, especially when people use religion as an excuse. One side prays so that God will bless their army, the other side also prays to God to bless their army. In the end lots of people die and get buried in the same land. All could have lived a much longer and joyful life... humans!
But if war is inevitable, has your faith anything to say about how it should be carried out?
 

Hawkins

Well-Known Member
What, in your religious opinion, is a justification for war? What does your religion say about it, has it any prescribed 'rules' so to speak for when you should go to war, who can be killed, keeping slaves, who is eligible to fight &c.? What is your opinion? Are you warlike or a pacifist?

This is in debates so feel free to tell other posters why their reasons suck and yours are obviously better.

In Christianity, God's job is to save souls. While killing humans mean shorten their life to make a right choice (i.e., to believe in Jesus Christ), wars in general are not what God wants in today's world. On the other hand, if humans stand in God's way of salvation (this happened at the time when God's salvation was initially established through the Jews), God has no choice but to remove them (the Canaanites). That's part of the reason why God needs a "chosen people" to do His will.

Slavery is a human establishment, by the most decent people on earth (thus including those God intend to save). God thus has to stand neutral, in a sense, such that His covenant can save those "good" people but practicing slavery at the time that it's considered moral by all mankind. God on the other hand, sets an example through His "chosen people" the Jews that "Hebrews enslaving Hebrews" is never allowed.


Leviticus 25:42 (NIV2011)
Because the Israelites are my servants, whom I brought out of Egypt, they must not be sold as slaves.

The Jews' slavery system is thus a labor system to help out those Hebrews who have to sell themselves as slaves, or else they may have to sell themselves to the gentile masters.
 

1213

Well-Known Member
What, in your religious opinion, is a justification for war?

Therefore whatever you desire for men to do to you, you shall also do to them; for this is the law and the prophets.
Matt. 7:12

So, if people from other nation come and try to shoot me, I have to assume they want to be shot.

On the other hand:

Then Jesus said to him, "Put your sword back into its place, for all those who take the sword will die by the sword.
Matt. 26:52

'You shall love your neighbor as yourself.'
Matt. 22:39

But I tell you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who mistreat you and persecute you, that you may be children of your Father who is in heaven. For he makes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the just and the unjust.
Mat. 5:44-45

I think it would be best not to go to a war, but I can forgive if people defend themselves. :)
 

Hockeycowboy

Witness for Jehovah
Premium Member
How did I miss this thread?!


John 13:34-35 is for Christ’s disciples to follow (of course). The ID mark is love..and genuine love has no barriers, be it national, racial, or political.

How’re they doin’?

I know of very few international Christian groups that are neutral in war.
 

anubhuti

New Member
What, in your religious opinion, is a justification for war? What does your religion say about it, has it any prescribed 'rules' so to speak for when you should go to war, who can be killed, keeping slaves, who is eligible to fight &c.? What is your opinion? Are you warlike or a pacifist?

This is in debates so feel free to tell other posters why their reasons suck and yours are obviously better.

Well, War according to my religion should be last resort. If it is inevitable it becomes duty(Dharma). Majority of my Gods carry weapons. Almost majority of our festivals are actually celeberations of defeat of rakshasas(demons) in the hands of Gods and Godesses. Sometimes the defeat of enemy is quite brutual. For ex : Lord Krishna beheaded shishupala(a rakshasa king after tolerating 100 sins). Lord Narasimha after killing hiranyakashipaa(rakshasa father who tortures his own child for worshipping vishnu) tore his stomach apart and wore those intestines as necklaces. Mother Godess Mahishasura mardini beheaded Mahishasura(rakshasa). Mother Kali smashed heads of pervert rakshasas Chanda and Munda. There are innumerable accounts of our gods burning rakshasas alive, cursing them to leprosy and other ancient gory diseases. less said about punishments they suffer in hell for persecuting people who follow dharma. Lord Rama destroyed Ravana because of ravana's lust for another married woman.

Now let us look at human view of war. Ancient Mahabharata clealry reflects this aspect. Arjuna after seeing his own cousins on enemy side decides to give up war. Then Lord Krishna(who has been killing many rakshasas since birth and in many previous avataras) teaches him Bhagavat Gita solely to motivate him to slaughter his own cousins who are adharmiks(evil). Ironically Mahabharata also states that ahimsa(non violence) is supreme dharma! Non violence is logical conclusion of war. That is violence for the sake of Non violence is non violence.

According to ancient Indian scholar Chanakya , war should be avoided if goals can be achieved through discussions and other non violent methods. There are many rules for war and during war. Wars can only be waged if there is danger to dharma. Avoid harming women, children and old. Again there are exceptions to every "avoid" statement.
 
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Nakosis

Non-Binary Physicalist
Premium Member
Self defense....although it's a preference not based upon religion.
Does this disqualify me?
Even if so, posters may tell me that my reasons suck.

Sure self defense. What about humanitarian reasons?

Kind of on the fence being that I suspect many times humanitarian reasons are manufactured as an excuse to go to war.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Sure self defense. What about humanitarian reasons?

Kind of on the fence being that I suspect many times humanitarian reasons are manufactured as an excuse to go to war.
I too am skeptical of that reason to go to war.
A compelling hypothetical scenario could be composed, I suppose.
 

Rival

se Dex me saut.
Staff member
Premium Member
I too am skeptical of that reason to go to war.
A compelling hypothetical scenario could be composed, I suppose.
If anyone really went to war for humanitarian reasons, North Korea would have been invaded decades ago.

It doesn't happen.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
If anyone really went to war for humanitarian reasons, North Korea would have been invaded decades ago.

It doesn't happen.
Well, there would be humanitarian wars which could have
a reliable & significant net benefit. And then there would
be humanitarian wars which would screw pooches.
Attacking N Korea would very likely result in more misery
than leaving them to their own devices.
 

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
What, in your religious opinion, is a justification for war? What does your religion say about it, has it any prescribed 'rules' so to speak for when you should go to war, who can be killed, keeping slaves, who is eligible to fight &c.? What is your opinion? Are you warlike or a pacifist?

This is in debates so feel free to tell other posters why their reasons suck and yours are obviously better.
There are exceptions to my rule of thumb, most notably if God orders a war. However, one should note that even in such cases as God ordering a war, like with the Amelekites, there are plenty of human reasons for self defense.

The most common reason for instigating a war is to gain land, followed by gaining resources. I consider this immoral--it is not loving your neighbor as yourself. It is, at face value, incredibly horribly self serving at the expense of others. I would consider the deaths of others for these reasons to be a form of murder, even. Although honestly, something can be said for the fact that the poor shmoes actually doing the fighting are usually not there of their own free will, but have been forced or snookered into it. I would add to this category those who are using violence to spread an ideology such as communism. ISIS comes to mind, whose intent was to come into world domination and set up a worldwide caliphate in order to enslave people to Sharia Law and take away their free will choice to be other than Muslim.

It is perfectly moral, on the other hand, to defend again such vampires. Look, if you are living peacefully in your village, and barbarians ride over the hill, and their intent is to kill you, rape your wife and daughters, take your children as slaves, and take your land, it would actually be immoral of you NOT to fight to protect your family and the families of your neighbors. An example of this would be those who fought back against ISIS.
 
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