Fact, Belief, and Faith

[Skwim]

Several definitions I put together tonight while bored and watching Frasier. ... (Put in the Science Religion forum because facts are the operational basis of science whereas faith is the operational basis of religion.)

Fact: A thing that is indisputably the case.

Fact is rooted in conviction that a thing is confirmed to such a degree that it would be perverse to withhold acceptance* The core of science and day-to-day living.

​

Belief: The acceptance that a non-factual thing exists or is true.

An occasional encouragement in our day-to-day musings. It serves as the basis of faith.

​

Faith: Trust in a belief.

For some, the balm of everyday concerns. Most notably, the trust put in the supernatural and some religious writings. For others, it's simply the confidence that the other guy at the intersection isn't going to T-bone you as you proceed.​

Okay, it's bedtime, any deletions, revisions, or ?



* With a nod to Stephen Jay Gould

.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

Works for me.

 

[Lyndon]

Bunch of nonsense, beliefs can often be facts, scientists believe a lot of things, they believe some things are facts, and as time has told, they're not always right.

Science is mostly based on theories, if a theories seems valid enough with a great probability of being true it starts getting labeled a fact, but even then facts have turned out not to be true, many times.

 

[Curious George]

Several definitions I put together tonight while watching Frasier. ... (Put in the Science Religion forum because facts are the operational basis of science whereas the operational basis of religion is faith.)

Fact: A thing that is indisputably the case.

Fact is rooted in conviction that a thing is confirmed to such a degree that it would be perverse to withhold acceptance* The core of science and day-to-day living.

​

Belief: The acceptance that a non-factual thing exists or is true.

An occasional encouragement in our day-to-day musings. It serves as the basis of faith.

​

Faith: Trust in a belief.

For some, the balm of everyday concerns. Most notably, the trust put in the supernatural and some religious writings. For others, it's simply the confidence that the other guy at the intersection isn't going to T-bone you as you proceed.​

Okay, it's bedtime, any deletions, revisions, or ?



* With a nod to Stephen Jay Gould

.

I love it. The most ardent determinist on RF posts something that defines freewill as a fact.

Though I would agree with others that beliefs too can be facts

 

[joe1776]

Fact: A thing that is indisputably the case.​

.

Claimed facts might be true or false so, on matters of any importance, we should expect such claims to be supported by a persuasive reasoned argument.

Useful facts: Providing useful facts to students should be the goal of education.

Useless facts: A fact can be true but knowing it might serve no useful purpose. Our educators offer too many of these.

Exaggerated facts: A fact can be true but the claim of its size, worth, or importance can be exaggerated.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Several definitions I put together tonight while bored and watching Frasier. ... (Put in the Science Religion forum because facts are the operational basis of science whereas the operational basis of religion is faith.)

Fact: A thing that is indisputably the case.

Fact is rooted in conviction that a thing is confirmed to such a degree that it would be perverse to withhold acceptance* The core of science and day-to-day living.

​

Belief: The acceptance that a non-factual thing exists or is true.

An occasional encouragement in our day-to-day musings. It serves as the basis of faith.

​

Faith: Trust in a belief.

For some, the balm of everyday concerns. Most notably, the trust put in the supernatural and some religious writings. For others, it's simply the confidence that the other guy at the intersection isn't going to T-bone you as you proceed.​

Okay, it's bedtime, any deletions, revisions, or ?



* With a nod to Stephen Jay Gould

.

I would suggest this overstates how commonly we operate on facts and underplays how often we operate by belief (in the broad sense).

Simple example is that I plan my day around a belief that the morning train will turn upon time.

 

[Lyndon]

unknown facts, facts that are true but cannot be proven

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Bunch of nonsense, beliefs can often be facts, scientists believe a lot of things, they believe some things are facts, and as time has told, they're not always right.

Science is mostly based on theories, if a theories seems valid enough with a great probability of being true it starts getting labeled a fact, but even then facts have turned out not to be true, many times.

What we label it as, and what it is are different though. I daresay some thought the world was flat, others that it's a sphere. Neither are facts, although the latter has utility.

 

[shunyadragon]

Bunch of nonsense, beliefs can often be facts, scientists believe a lot of things, they believe some things are facts, and as time has told, they're not always right.

Not correct nor real in the use of the terminology defined. Yes, beliefs can be facts in a vague sense, but in science and everyday life 'facts' are specific things or events that can be documented by objective verifiable evidence. A 'fact' determined to be true ten years ago remains a 'fact' today. What changes in science, and in everyday facts, over time, is the conclusions of science, and everyday life, as our knowledge based on facts increases.

Science is mostly based on theories, if a theories seems valid enough with a great probability of being true it starts getting labeled a fact, but even then facts have turned out not to be true, many times.

False, Science is based on scientific methods, which depend on objective verifiable evidence, 'facts', to develop theories and hypothesis.

There is an unfortunate layman misconception, a misuse of the English language, and a misuse of the word 'fact' in describing theories and hypothesis such as the science of evolution, but this is not reality of what is a 'fact' in science. The unfortunate misuse of the word 'fact' is a misguided effort to assert the certainty of the science of evolution. Theories and hypothesis, as well as knowledge, changes and evolves over time, but 'facts' do not.

Example: It is best to say that the science of evolution is falsified and supported by scientific methods 'beyond any reasonable doubt,' and not a 'fact.'

 

[Lyndon]

nonsense

 

[shunyadragon]

nonsense

Self-described adjective. A coherent response using coherent sensible English would be appreciated.

 

[Lyndon]

you're not making any sense, my original statement was accurate

 

[LuisDantas]

you're not making any sense, my original statement was accurate

Uh, no, not at all.

 

[shunyadragon]

you're not making any sense, my original statement was accurate

Actually no based simply on the proper use of basic elementary English language, and the reality of how science, and everyday use of the word 'fact.'

Still waiting for a coherent response instead 'Twitter*' responses.'

*Twit - A person with a limited attention span of 140 characters who Tweets and Twiters. Example: Donald Trump.

 

[Lyndon]

If I believe in God, and that God is real, then that God is a fact, and my belief is a fact, you can't just make up some bs definition of facts only referring to science. A fact is something that is true, that is real.100%of the time. Most science is based on theories, not facts, when a theory is 100% true then it is a fact.

 

[shunyadragon]

If I believe in God, and that God is real, then that God is a fact, and my belief is a fact, you can't just make up some bs definition of facts only referring to science. A fact is something that is true, that is real.100%of the time. Most science is based on theories, not facts, when a theory is 100% true then it is a fact.

I noticed you used the conditional qualifier 'IF' in your statement. People of many diverse conflicting beliefs consider their beliefs as 'factual' and absolutely 'true.' This reveals a problem of the certainty of the many different beliefs asserted as 'fact.' On the other hand in science there is almost universal acceptance (98%+) of all the theories and hypothesis of science including the science of evolution, and all of which are subject to change pending the discovery of further 'facts.'

You are free to define the nature and certainty of your own religious beliefs, but it is unethical, and self-imposed ignorance to assert false concepts on science, and what science is based on and how science considers 'facts,' theories, hypothesis, and objective verifiable evidence.

 

[sayak83]

Several definitions I put together tonight while bored and watching Frasier. ... (Put in the Science Religion forum because facts are the operational basis of science whereas the operational basis of religion is faith.)

Fact: A thing that is indisputably the case.

Fact is rooted in conviction that a thing is confirmed to such a degree that it would be perverse to withhold acceptance* The core of science and day-to-day living.

​

Belief: The acceptance that a non-factual thing exists or is true.

An occasional encouragement in our day-to-day musings. It serves as the basis of faith.

​

Faith: Trust in a belief.

For some, the balm of everyday concerns. Most notably, the trust put in the supernatural and some religious writings. For others, it's simply the confidence that the other guy at the intersection isn't going to T-bone you as you proceed.​

Okay, it's bedtime, any deletions, revisions, or ?



* With a nod to Stephen Jay Gould

.

Disagree.
Anything whatsoever that is held to be true by a living organism about themselves or the world is a Belief.
A Fact is an extremely well justified belief.
Faith is the degree of confidence one has regarding the truth of a specific claim or set of claims. Ranges from complete faith (an individual considers it a fact) to complete lack of faith (an individual considers it to be false with extreme certainty)

 

[Revoltingest]

Several definitions I put together tonight while bored and watching Frasier. ... (Put in the Science Religion forum because facts are the operational basis of science whereas the operational basis of religion is faith.)

Fact: A thing that is indisputably the case.

Fact is rooted in conviction that a thing is confirmed to such a degree that it would be perverse to withhold acceptance* The core of science and day-to-day living.

​

Belief: The acceptance that a non-factual thing exists or is true.

An occasional encouragement in our day-to-day musings. It serves as the basis of faith.

​

Faith: Trust in a belief.

For some, the balm of everyday concerns. Most notably, the trust put in the supernatural and some religious writings. For others, it's simply the confidence that the other guy at the intersection isn't going to T-bone you as you proceed.​

Okay, it's bedtime, any deletions, revisions, or ?



* With a nod to Stephen Jay Gould

.

I like your definition of "fact".
Now, when we all disagree about things supposedly factual, we can call each other "Pervert!".

I practice, a fact is really just a really popular opinion with delusions of grandeur.
There's a subset which I like though....the objectively verifiable kind, eg, the
speed of light in a vacuum. (But even that one is rightfully regularly reconsidered.)

 

[Curious George]

Bunch of nonsense, beliefs can often be facts, scientists believe a lot of things, they believe some things are facts, and as time has told, they're not always right.

Not correct nor real in the use of the terminology defined. Yes, beliefs can be facts in a vague sense, but in science and everyday life 'facts' are specific things or events that can be documented by objective verifiable evidence. A 'fact' determined to be true ten years ago remains a 'fact' today. What changes in science, and in everyday facts, over time, is the conclusions of science, and everyday life, as our knowledge based on facts increases.

Anything whatsoever that is held to be true by a living organism about themselves or the world is a Belief.
A Fact is an extremely well justified belief.
Faith is the degree of confidence one has regarding the truth of a specific claim or set of claims. Ranges from complete faith (an individual considers it a fact) to complete lack of faith (an individual considers it to be false with extreme certainty)

Turns out Sayak replied for Lyndon.

 

[shunyadragon]

Disagree.
Anything whatsoever that is held to be true by a living organism about themselves or the world is a Belief.
A Fact is an extremely well justified belief.
Faith is the degree of confidence one has regarding the truth of a specific claim or set of claims. Ranges from complete faith (an individual considers it a fact) to complete lack of faith (an individual considers it to be false with extreme certainty)

I agree conditionally, but the problem with the words 'belief and faith' is that it has too broad and at times vague use and definition. I will not agree that 'A Fact is an extremely well justified belief.', because this opens the barn door to interpretation that is not functional as to what is a 'fact.'

I definitely distinguish between the use of 'faith and belief' in the consideration science, and objectively verified evidence or 'facts.' Generalizations of having 'belief and faith' concerning a philosophical certainty for science should not be interpreted as descriptive of the view of 'facts and evidence within science.