Dutch Government censors David Icke (not allowed to come to Holland)

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Neither do I.
I have never believed in aliens.
I do believe we are the only intelligent beings in the universe...
But I do respect those who think otherwise. I will let them speak.

This thread isn't about anyone's right to speak; this thread is about the right of people who aren't refugees to enter countries where they aren't citizens or permanent residents.

You never did give a straight answer when I asked your position on this before. Are you advocating for open borders generally, or do you just think that David Icke falls into some category of non-resident alien (no pun intended) who should be entitled to enter the Netherlands?

If the latter: please tell us more about this category.

 

[Nakosis]

Because evidently the Dutch government considers its own citizens to be handicapped, and handicapped people need to be protected from words and messages that may harm them.

I suspect the government is actually trying to protect itself more.
Icke seems a person that can get people to question government authority.
Makes him more dangerous to the government than anything else.

 

[Subduction Zone]

May I give an explicit example? There was an incredibly brave magistrate, a district attorney that fought organized crime and he was considered a braggart, a loudmouth, a visionary by some politicians.
There is even a video on YT of one politician who insults him on live TV, from the nineties.

It turns out this politician was arrested and jailed for organized crime.

So...I am very suspicious whenever someone wants to censor Icke.
And I am really curious about how personal the motivations of this censorship is.

You forgot a very important detail. Was he guilty of being associated with organized crime or not? In fact there can be reasonable evidence that leads to jail but is not enough to convict. At least here. People are at times put in jail. Bond is set unless they are an active threat, and they can usually get out of jail until the trial. I do not know how it works in Italy.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I suspect the government is actually trying to protect itself more.
Icke seems a person that can get people to question government authority.
Makes him more dangerous to the government than anything else.

Really? A loon is a threat to the Government? Oh wait, Donald Trump. Hmm, I have to put some more thought into this.

 

[Estro Felino]

You forgot a very important detail. Was he guilty of being associated with organized crime or not? In fact there can be reasonable evidence that leads to jail but is not enough to convict. At least here. People are at times put in jail. Bond is set unless they are an active threat, and they can usually get out of jail until the trial. I do not know how it works in Italy.

Yes, he was.
Bribery.

 

[Estro Felino]

This thread isn't about anyone's right to speak; this thread is about the right of people who aren't refugees to enter countries where they aren't citizens or permanent residents.

You never did give a straight answer when I asked your position on this before. Are you advocating for open borders generally, or do you just think that David Icke falls into some category of non-resident alien (no pun intended) who should be entitled to enter the Netherlands?

If the latter: please tell us more about this category.

Aristotelian logic:
if someone is member of some criminal organization, isn't it logical they will do anything to censor, silence or exile those who try to uncover, expose or disclose things related to that organization?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Aristotelian logic:
if someone is member of some criminal organization, isn't it logical they will do anything to censor, silence or exile those who try to uncover, expose or disclose things related to that organization?

A straight answer to my question, please.

 

[Estro Felino]

A straight answer to my question, please.

My answer is that you are right.
But that doesn't change that it's very suspicious to censor someone.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

My answer is that you are right.

That you're advocating for open borders?

But that doesn't change that it's very suspicious to censor someone.

Who's being censored? @stvdv is himself evidence that David Icke's message has made it to the Netherlands.

His ideas are free to enter the country even if he isn't physically admissible himself.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Yes, he was.
Bribery.

So the accusation does not appear to have been baseless.

Were you trying to make a point?

 

[beenherebeforeagain]

perhaps only tangentially related, but perhaps it could be argued that these are people trying to enter Italy who are having their right to free speech censored...

Standoff as Italy stops male migrants from disembarking rescue ship

Is it okay for Italy to deny them entry? If not, why not? And how does that differ from Ickes being denied entry?

 

[Nakosis]

Really? A loon is a threat to the Government? Oh wait, Donald Trump. Hmm, I have to put some more thought into this.

In Donald Trump's case, a loon was the government. Think about that.

 

[Twilight Hue]

It's their "house," so why should they let in a guest who would divide that house?

Excellent. Build a wall to keep Ike at bay.

 

[rational experiences]

You'd do a review he's just a human and just a man who thinks.

He uses scientific references themes yet doesn't know how to place the advice in a correct acceptable formatted thinking status.

So he's living proof human theists on man humans science topics own incorrect thinking. By causes mind changed.

As 5G is a man's science choice. Doesn't make it correct.
So is theorising humans were aliens by a sun machines reaction. Alien a sun out of space God travelling in star mass...men human theories as man as man scientists.

Uses two titles as if one causes him self superiority. Which Theists use and identify behaviour via.

Dinosaurs life destroyed huge atmospheric attack yet men science theists use cold blooded reptile advice. Involve iron red warm blooded genetics microbes in the evolution of genetics from reptilian theories lying....warm blood not even changing now.

As science is one man by many men. Reborn baby. Who keeps repeating his own conscious mans mistakes.

Humans who use technology to kill of living microbiology not red blood in waters microbial spaces. To cause germ invasive human lifes cell attack.

So by history its ancient about man of human science. Now.

In a lot of themes he isn't correctly explaining as he just doesn't know how to format the advice. As it's ancient history plus new but same old technology choices. The human man science cause.

Some humans believe in verbalising any advice as life is in danger ...is known and advised. Otherwise humans wouldn't need to act radically.

 

[Truthseeker]

I think that 1984 is their Bible.
Thought police...what a wonderful word...

That's a pretty out there comment, but good to know that people besides me read that book. I loved it. I read it when I was in high school. I gave a review for it, and it was one of the few times I got a good grade for a review of a book. The other good grade was when I compared two biographies for Einstein.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Dutch Government censors David Icke (not allowed to come to Holland to give a speech)

Big Brother is getting implemented more and more. Holland used to be democratic, but not allowing David Icke to come to Holland to give a speech is 1 step further towards censorship

What do you believe?
It's good to censor freedom of speech?
All humans are equal, but some are more equal than others?

I believe that dangerous conspiracy nutcases should not be given public platforms.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

I agree, but Holland lacks our freedom of speech.
So censoring this loony there makes sense...for them.

Freedom is not absolute.

There is freedom of speech, sure.
That doesn't mean you get to spew whatever you want, like hate speech or just blatant lies about people.
Why should that go without consequence?

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

You fail to see what really happens here in the Netherlands

Why don't you tell us?
What is, according to you, happening to my neighbors in the north?

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Free speech is gradually taken away

Governments lies and twists facts

How is your government "lying and twisting facts" by not allowing a conspiratory, anti-semetic nutjob into the country to spew his nonsense at a public event?

 

[Revoltingest]

Freedom is not absolute.

There is freedom of speech, sure.
That doesn't mean you get to spew whatever you want, like hate speech or just blatant lies about people.
Why should that go without consequence?

We might differ on proscriptions & consequences
regarding different kinds of speech. What works
in Holland might not here.