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Featured Christianity vs Baha'i

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Nakosis, Nov 20, 2020.

  1. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
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    Which has the better beliefs about God?

    While I am familiar with Christian belief, please feel free to say while you feel Christianity is the correct belief to have.

    The little I know about the Baha'i religion comes mostly from these forums.

    However, I think I'm correct in thinking that according to Baha'i all should become Baha'i because it has the better understanding/knowledge of God.

    If you think this is true, why? What is better about your understanding? Why should Christians convert to Baha'i? Or do you see Christianity, the beliefs, the knowledge of God being equal to Baha'i? So there is nothing to be gained by a Christain converting to Baha'i?
     
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  2. KAT-KAT

    KAT-KAT Well-Known Member

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    The Baha'i faith will give you a broader definition of God.

    While the Christian faith tends to have really good theology.

    But going from Christian to Baha'i is kind of like saying "The Bible isn't the final word, but it had its merit, as does..." and going on from there.
     
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  3. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
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    Good theology? Better theology?

    I don't know much about Baha'i theology. Do they have a trinity for example?
     
  4. 74x12

    74x12 Well-Known Member

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    As a Christian it seems to me Baha'ullah is little different than the others who have made similar claims since Jesus came. Such as Mohammad or Joseph Smith.

    Baha'ullah wants people to believe that making one world government is the right thing to do. Whereas the scriptures from Genesis to Revelation inform us that it's a really bad idea. When Christ returns Himself then He'll make world peace but until then ... one world government is going to be disastrous.
     
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  5. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
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    I never really got that from Christianity, or maybe I did.

    What I got was that Christians should not be concerned with earthly governments. Christians should concern themselves with the Kingdom of Heaven.
     
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  6. 74x12

    74x12 Well-Known Member

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    In the Genesis story of the tower of Babel there was seemingly a one world government and God stopped it. In the book of Revelation one world government is pictured as a beast rising out of the sea that is empowered by the dragon Satan.
     
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  7. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
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    That would kind of imply that Baha'i is supporting the raising of this "beast" wouldn't it?
     
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  8. 74x12

    74x12 Well-Known Member

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    Yes, although I don't blame them. I think they're misguided. :)
     
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  9. stvdv

    stvdv Veteran Member

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    I rather stick to Teachings of Masters which have been proven correct then to visions people have, because I know that visions are mostly illusions

    Once a devotee asked a Master "How do I know the correct meaning of my dream or vision", and the Master gave a clear and simple answer

    Since then I don't keep myself busy with visions that are not very clear. Even Koran stresses the importance of verses with a literal meaning
     
  10. Vinayaka

    Vinayaka devotee
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    I dislike the word 'better' in any debate about the nature of God. Obviously the Christian version is better for Christians, and the Baha'i version is better for Baha'is. I'd go for explaining some of the differences, perhaps. That might be less confrontational.
     
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  11. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    I believe that the Bible has embedded within it an apt description of the one true God, but the problem as I see it is that Christians misinterpreted the Bible and created doctrines about God that do not represent who God really is, doctrines such as Jesus is God in the flesh and the Trinity doctrine, stating that God is three persons.

    As KIT-KAT said, the Baha'i Faith will give one a broader definition of God but it will also give one a clearer picture of God. That is not to say that the Bible does not reveal who God is, but the problem from a Baha'i perspective is that the Bible was written for another age in history so it was written to people who lived in that age, not for people who live in the present age.

    The Baha'i belief is that man evolves spiritually over time so man is able to comprehend more as he evolves. That is why what was revealed about God in the Writings if Baha'u'llah and it is straight to the point. Thus there is no question who God is if one reads the Writings of Baha'u'llah.

    So from a Baha’i perspective, it is not about whether Christianity or the Baha’i Faith is better, it is about which one is more current and thus suited to the times we live in.
    No, I do not think that is the primary reason one should become a Baha’i. The primary reason is because Baha’u’llah is the Messenger of God for the age we live in so He revealed a new message and social teachings and laws that are suited to this age.

    The basic message of Christianity is that Jesus died for our sins and thus conferred individual salvation upon those who believed in Him, but that has been accomplished and now humanity needs to move on to the next phase of their spiritual evolution, which involves salvation of the entire world. This is the age in which the Kingdom of God on earth will be built, and all the promises in the Bible will be fulfilled.
    Simply put, Baha’is believe that Christians should recognize Baha’u’llah because we believe He was the return of Christ promised by Jesus. Baha’is do not believe there is any competition between Jesus and Baha’u’llah because they are both the same Spirit of God. Thus to say they are in competition would be like saying that God is competing with Himself, which is illogical. As such, Baha’is do not believe that Baha’u’llah is better than Jesus, we believe they are equal in every way. Baha’u’llah just brought a message that is more current, the message that humanity needs to survive and thrive and continue to evolve in this new age.
     
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  12. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    Only according to one Christian understanding, but who is to say that understanding is correct? After all, Christians do not even agree on what the Bible means, so that tells us that it could mean any number of things. ;)

    What people believe all boils down to Bible interpretation, and despite what many Christians say the Bible does not interpret itself. People read it and assign meanings. That is why Christians do not agree among themselves and that is why there are so many sects of Christianity. Logically speaking, if there was only one possible correct interpretation of the Bible, all the Christians would agree.
     
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  13. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    If Christians interpreted the Bible correctly and understood what Jesus said, they would concern themselves with the Kingdom of Heaven and they would not believe that the same man Jesus is going to return and bring world peace, because Jesus never promised that He would do that. In fact Jesus said that His work was finished here and He was no more in the world.

    John 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.

    John 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

    John 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

    John 19:30 When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.

    John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

    John 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.


    These two verses in John 18 completely negate that Jesus is the King of this world or that Jesus will ever come to this world to rule it, and they fit perfectly together with John 17:4 and John 17:11. Jesus came into this world to bear witness unto the truth about God. He did that so there is no more reason for Jesus to come back to this world again. That is why Jesus said “I am no more in the world.”

    But of course Christians always have a way out of accepting what Jesus said, so they will continue to wait for Jesus to return till hell freezes over.
     
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  14. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    Baha'is have a Trinity belief, but it is very different from the Christian Trinity belief.

    Baha'is believe in the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit, so in that sense we believe in a Trinity; but we do not believe that these three are part of God. Rather, they are separate entities that work together. That is explained in this chapter: 27: THE TRINITY

    Some people get lost in that chapter, so I wrote up a brief encapsulation of it;

    There is only One God.

    The Holy Spirit is the Bounty of God, an emanation from God. God is like the sun and the Holy Spirit is like the rays of the sun. God remains in His own high place, and does not ever descend to earth.

    The Holy Spirit is the Bounty of God which became visible and evident in Jesus Christ.

    Jesus Christ was like a clear mirror, and God became visible in the mirror, but God did not descend into the mirror. This is why Christ said, “The Father is in the Son,” meaning that the God was visible and manifest in this mirror.

    The Comforter, Counselor, Helper, and Advocate are all descriptive terms or titles used for the Bounty of God that came to us through the Holy Spirit.
     
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  15. adrian009

    adrian009 Well-Known Member
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    Christianity is a diverse religion that arose two thousand years ago with a narrative that made sense back then and has resonated with many generations since. Over time schisms have taken place and there is no longer a consistent Christian message that represents Christianity as a whole. The message has also brought Christianity into major conflict with science and other religions/world beliefs. This is an inevitable aspect of making sense of Teachings that arose so long ago in a culture with social norms so different from today.

    The Baha’i message if it has any of these problems, doesn’t have them to nearly the same extent as Christianity.

    As above, it is difficult to agree on what the Christian message let alone whether or not it is correct.

    There should be complete freedom of belief and we each make choices about religious beliefs and affiliation for varied reasons. The Baha’i Faith teaches independent investigation of reality. If on searching for truth the Baha’i Faith makes more sense or you believe Bahá’u’lláh was a Prophet of God then consider becoming a Baha’i.

    Baha’is believe Bahá’u’lláh is the Manifestation of God for this day. The Manifestations are like Divine Physicians who in their unerring wisdom perceive the ills of humanity and prescribe the remedy. The remedy for humanity during the age of Christ was very different from what is required today.
     
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  16. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
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    Well, that's no fun. :p

    Of course better for them individually but why do they feel this? They get to choose but why the choice they make?
     
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  17. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
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    Was Baha’u’llah the last or will there be more. In which case will Baha'i then be replaced when a new age comes again?
     
  18. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    This is the new age so there will not be another new age, until the end of the present Universal Cycle of religion (see Table below).

    Baha'is believe that Messengers if God have been sent since the dawn of human history and that Messengers will continue to be sent by God for all of eternity.

    There will be more Messengers in the future, but not before the year 2863 AD, because Baha'u'llah wrote that no new Messengers would be sent for at least 1000 years (from the time of His declaration in 1863).

    When a new Messenger comes, there will be a new religion with a message and new social teachings and laws, but all Messengers within this religious cycle will be under the shadow of Baha'u'llah.

    There have been various Universal Cycles of religion since mankind was created. Within each Cycle there were many different Prophets and religions. The Universal Cycles that preceded Adam are too remote in history to know anything about. The Cycle of religion that began with Adam and culminated with Muhammad is called the Adamic Cycle, or the Prophetic Cycle, named as such because it was the Age of Prophecy.

    Muhammad was called the Seal of the Prophets because He was the last prophet in the Adamic Cycle and thus He sealed off the Adamic Cycle. In 1844 the Bab ushered in a new Cycle of religion called the Age of Fulfillment. All the “new age” movements and all the scientific discoveries we have seen since the last century are the result of the inception of this new Cycle. We are living in a new age of mankind.

    As you can see on the outline below, the present Universal Cycle of religion includes the Adamic Cycle (Prophetic Cycle) and the Baha’i Cycle (Cycle of Fulfillment). The Baha’i Cycle will last no less than 500,000 years and all the Messengers of God (Manifestations of God) that appear during the cycle will be under the shadow of Baha'u'llah.

    TABLE: BAHA'I SACRED HISTORY

    I. PREVIOUS UNIVERSAL CYCLES - of which no trace remains

    II. PRESENT UNIVERSAL CYCLE

    · A. ADAMIC CYCLE, CYCLE OF PROPHECY - lasted approximately 6,000 years

    1. Adam 1. Indian religious figures
    2. Noah - Krishna
    3. Abraham
    4. Moses 2. Zoroaster
    5. Jesus 3. Buddha
    6. Muhammad
    + Other unknown or unspecified prophets

    · B. BAHA'I CYCLE, CYCLE OF FULFILLMENT - to last 500,000 years

    1. The Bab
    2. Bahá'u'lláh - Universal Manifestation for this Universal Cycle

    a. Heroic, Primitive, or Apostolic Age - 1844-1921 (or 1932 - the death of Bahiyyih Khanum)

    i. Ministry of the Bab (1844-53)
    ii. Ministry of Bahá'u'lláh (1853-92)
    iii. Ministry of `Abdu'l-Bahá (1892-1921)

    b. Formative, Transitional, or Iron Age - 1921 -

    i. First Epoch (1921-44/46) - Erection of the Administrative Order
    ii. Second Epoch (1946-63) - spread of the Faith beyond the confines of the Western Hemisphere
    iii. Third Epoch (1963-86) - emergence of the Faith from obscurity and initiation of social and economic development plans
    iv. Fourth Epoch (1986- ) - national communities taking on the responsibility for their own development
    v. Successive further Epochs

    c. Golden Age
    Successive Epochs leading to the Most Great Peace

    3. Further Manifestations - under the shadow of Bahá'u'lláh

    · END OF PRESENT UNIVERSAL CYCLE

    III. FURTHER UNIVERSAL CYCLES

    Ages and Cycles
     
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  19. Neuropteron

    Neuropteron Active Member

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    It certainly is your right to choose your own belief.

    However why would a follower of Christ who is the son of God and is an unequaled representative of Jehovah decide to follow a person without any qualifications (apart from promoting himself) instead of the one send directly by God to instructs us in the truth ?

    John 5:43 "I have come in the name of my Father, but you do not receive me; if someone else arrives in his own name, you receive that one".
     
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  20. KenS

    KenS Veteran Member
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    That is a teaching from certain groups of Christianity. However, all Christian group (as far as I know) is when there is a final push for a one world government with shoutings of "peace - peace" that is the beginning of the end. The one world Government will be instituted with Jesus Christ - in the Christian understanding.
     
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