@sooda @oldbadger The condition for posting in this thread is to argue only from the Christian Bible. Also, the topic is not archaeology and Paul’s Christianity. It’s the baptisms of John and Jesus.
Indeed.
And in order to reassure you that I used the Christian bible, with quotes from Hosea, Mark and Matthew with my personal interpretation of what they were all about, please may I show that again, and maybe you would be kind enough nto make comments about it?
Also, the Christian bible is full of Paul's Christianity, Jim, and to refuise its mention here would be strange.
Here we go...... just to show you that I posted within your rules;-
For this was all about the Jews.
There was no middle class within Palestine.
The working people struggled to make ends meet each year and on their visits to be redeemed and cleansed at the Great Temple they were cheated by the citizens of Jerusalem and surrounding towns for every meal and bed. At the Temple they were cheated when converting their own coin for Temple coin, and the Temple coin was desecrated with graven images, the Head of Baal and even Caesar's abbreviated name, which every man could not avoid touching. If they brought sacrificial lambs with them then these could be condemned as imperfect and the Temple lambs cost so much!
And when they went home they were 'penniless' once again, just for the sake of feeling redeemed and cleansed, because they knew that sin led to sickness.
The Temple and its priests were corrupted, greedy hypocrites, and fed well upon the fears of the working people. And they did not bother with the poor laws any more.
But there was a man who lived out in the wastelands on self subsistence, the sends of the seasons and the surges of the migrations and he was at one with his God. And he knew that this had all happened before.
The Baptist's feelings
Mark {3:7} But when he saw many of the Pharisees and
Sadducees come to his baptism, he said unto them, O
generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the
wrath to come? ...........
And he offered mercy and redemption for nothing! Simply by immersion in the Jordan, so that the people could turn around and go home, cleansed, and with their hard earned money in their possession still. And they flocked to him, just as folks would flock to him today! And he called out the chant of Hosea......
Hosea's call:-
Hosea {6:6} For I desired mercy, and
not sacrifice; and the knowledge of God more than burnt
offerings. {6:7} But they like men have transgressed the
covenant: there have they dealt treacherously against me.
Mark {1:4} John did baptize in the wilderness, and
preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.
{1:5} And there went out unto him all the land of Judaea,
and they of Jerusalem, and were all baptized of him in the
river of Jordan, confessing their sins.
And the Temple takings, the cruel citizen's earnings and the priest's back-handers fell away. And this caused a crisis, and Antipas was ordered to break up the Baprist's mission and bring him in.
But Jesus got away, out in to the wastelands with other disciples, and he continued on with the Baptist's mission until he himself was captured about a year later on.
Until then, Jesus continued on with Hosea's ancient call:-
Jesus..........Matthew {9:13} But go ye and learn what [that] meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.
And there it is, and was, before Paul had his ideas for a religion.