Believers should not feel intimidated by so called experts on religion

[Secret Chief]

Have you read all of this?

Do you think I'm mad?!

 

[Spirit of Light]

Could you elaborate on what you mean by "expert" in this context? Do you mean somebody who is very knowledgeable about a religious tradition?
I think you can learn a lot from such people, though it much depends on their attitude, and yours.

The expert i speak of here is one who think he/she know everything within the spiritual teaching becausethey know every single word in a holy book by etymology, and then going around "correcting everyone else" but does not practice it very well them selves, or don't even believe in the teaching they try to correct others in.

 

[Spirit of Light]

I don't think that is what he means. a mulla is just a religious leader of some sort and a shaykh is also referred to as a religious leader in Islam....but it is also meaning, one entitled like a prez or someone like that

Yes if the word is mulla, then I agree with you.

 

[Martin]

The expert i speak of here is one who think he/she know everything within the spiritual teaching becausethey know every single word in a holy book by etymology, and then going around "correcting everyone else" but does not practice it very well them selves, or don't even believe in the teaching they try to correct others in.

That kind of "expert" is infuriating. Though they aren't all like that.

 

[Spirit of Light]

That kind of "expert" is infuriating. Though they aren't all like that.

No, not everyone are like that some "experts" share from their hears without trying to change other people.
The change happens from within.

 

[firedragon]

Do you think I'm mad?!

Err. No.

 

[loverofhumanity]

Studied them all "in-depth"? Thats pretty amazing. I mean you are probably the only one I can think of who has studied them all in depth. Even Hindu scholars do not claim they have studied their own scripture in depth. Because it is so vast. But most of them actually have studied but their own scripture only. Still they have the humility to say that they have not. In Islam, the general reality is that just to give an opinion in theology, the person studies for about 10 years. It is so vast. I mean this is just to give a theological opinion. that's it. YOU on the other hand is miraculous. You have studied "everything".

In the time of Muhammad it took about 23 years for the Quran to be revealed so no man alive was fully knowledgeable regarding it. Yet countless Muslims attained the station of martyrdom in the Cause of Islam. They knew it was truth without having to read the entire Quran, yet their knowledge of its truth was complete enough to sacrifice their lives. This is true knowledge, to know Muhammad was a Prophet of God.

Knowledge is not academic learning but understanding. I do not know the Quran by heart but I know that Muhammad is a Prophet and the Quran, the Word of God. How many billions still do not accept the truth of Islam even though experts appear daily attacking it?

Yet my study has led me to recognise the truth. Is that not knowledgeable enough that if a knife were held to my throat to recant my belief in the Prophet I would refuse? The popes and priests have studied their Holy Book for centuries yet why cannot they accept Ahmad mentioned in the Bible? Length of study and amount of time doesn’t necessarily bestow true understanding.

It’s the same with the other Prophets, Teachers and Educators. Krishna, Buddha, Muhammad, Christ, Moses, Zoroaster, the Bab and Baha’u’llah. My study has led me to recognise that They all taught truth and so I believe in all of Them.

The Pharisees and Sadducees were the most learned High Priests yet they denounced the Spirit, Jesus. What good was all their learning and knowledge that it caused them to turn away from the truth?

Understanding is most important and I have done enough in depth study to ‘understand, accept and recognise ‘ the truth of all the Prophets.

I do not know every verse of every religion but I know enough to know they are all true.

True knowledge is the knowledge of God, and this is none other than the recognition of His Manifestation in each Dispensation (The Bab)

 

[firedragon]

In the time of Muhammad it took about 23 years for the Quran to be revealed so no man alive was fully knowledgeable regarding it. Yet countless Muslims attained the station of martyrdom in the Cause of Islam. They knew it was truth without having to read the entire Quran, yet their knowledge of its truth was complete enough to sacrifice their lives. This is true knowledge, to know Muhammad was a Prophet of God.

Knowledge is not academic learning but understanding. I do not know the Quran by heart but I know that Muhammad is a Prophet and the Quran, the Word of God. How many billions still do not accept the truth of Islam even though experts appear daily attacking it?

Yet my study has led me to recognise the truth. Is that not knowledgeable enough that if a knife were held to my throat to recant my belief in the Prophet I would refuse? The popes and priests have studied their Holy Book for centuries yet why cannot they accept Ahmad mentioned in the Bible? Length of study and amount of time doesn’t necessarily bestow true understanding.

It’s the same with the other Prophets, Teachers and Educators. Krishna, Buddha, Muhammad, Christ, Moses, Zoroaster, the Bab and Baha’u’llah. My study has led me to recognise that They all taught truth and so I believe in all of Them.

The Pharisees and Sadducees were the most learned High Priests yet they denounced the Spirit, Jesus. What good was all their learning and knowledge that it caused them to turn away from the truth?

Understanding is most important and I have done enough in depth study to ‘understand, accept and recognise ‘ the truth of all the Prophets.

I do not know every verse of every religion but I know enough to know they are all true.

True knowledge is the knowledge of God, and this is none other than the recognition of His Manifestation in each Dispensation (The Bab)

So bottomline is you have not studied any of them "in depth" as you claimed right? Its alright if you have not. This is not about dying for a cause. Hope you understand.

 

[Martin]

No, not everyone are like that some "experts" share from their hears without trying to change other people.
The change happens from within.

I agree, and it's good to trust your intuition about where people are coming from. On the other hand, I try not to dismiss what people say just because it challenges my current view. The truth can be uncomfortable at times.

 

[Spirit of Light]

I agree, and it's good to trust your intuition about where people are coming from. On the other hand, I try not to dismiss what people say just because it challenges my current view. The truth can be uncomfortable at times.

Yes, I dont dismiss people in the beginning either but when the same pattern is occuring time after time as in example
" You got it wrong, the texts says this, and anything other than the text is correct" so they dismiss any other persons understanding of the same text as wrong or nonsense.

 

[oldbadger]

A religious person who hold a personal belief in any religion or spiritual teaching, has no reason to feel intimidated by a socalled expert on religion....there is not one answer fits all when it comes to spiritual practice.

An expert has an opinion, thats all.
Let them have their opinion, and the best part, just leave them alone
They try to tell you "you don't know your own personal belief" that is hilerious.

Don't worry about anybody who claims to be an expert.
Such people are impostors all.

 

[loverofhumanity]

So bottomline is you have not studied any of them "in depth" as you claimed right? Its alright if you have not. This is not about dying for a cause. Hope you understand.

No. I have been thorough. I arrived at the conclusion I have after extensive research.

 

[firedragon]

No. I have been thorough. I arrived at the conclusion I have after extensive research.

What conclusion? Please explain.

 

[F1fan]

Spiritual practice is a personal path/way of life.

This is true, and personal paths are not always relevant to others, so we should be careful in how far our personal path is used in debate about truth.

If you disagree with any religious scripture that is not my concern. To know each word as word, but never practice the word that does not lead to wisdom.

interpretations are open to debate quite often. Of course, how can we know what words lead to wisdom UNTIL we are wise enough to know the difference? Is it wise to think ourselves wise?

There are some very wise Spiritual people who never read a word, but when you checkhow they live, they live according to the book. They have it naturarly within them.

A book is only a tool.

This can be the case. Some don't need gurus and books to teach them anything. Some are atheists.

 

[F1fan]

Or, vice versa, the believer telling a non-believer that they will burn in hell. Of the two, I've heard more talk about hell.

This illustrates a real flaw in how some theists debate. Some will assume their dogma is true and make claims based on them, like non-Christians are going to hell. This includes liberal Christians who are not conservative enough who are judged and condemned to hell by the casual Fundamentalist. I suspect some of these folks read religious websites on how to debate as we see a similar flawed pattern in debate, most of which is easy to invalidate.

Theists need to have thick skin to debate other theists and non-theists. The brutal honesty can sting the ego for those unprepared for criticisms that feel personal.

 

[F1fan]

God sent prophets to war us not to attack Iraq (that is what Revelation is all about, in the Christian bible). Modern prophets agree with Revelation. These prophets were ordered by God. Therefore, they certainly know the word of God. Badly or not, God wants the world warned not to attack Iraq.

Why didn't God send a more convincing message?

And you really think Revelations had to do with the Iraq war? Scholars assess this book to be about Nero and the contemporary times when it was written.

 

[loverofhumanity]

What conclusion? Please explain.

The all the Revelations from God are true.

 

[F1fan]

The all the Revelations from God are true.

How much tolerance did you allow yourself to be mistaken in your conclusion? You are just a fallible mortal yourself, yes?

 

[firedragon]

The all the Revelations from God are true.

Do you think the long ending of Mark is Gods true word?

 

[loverofhumanity]

How much tolerance did you allow yourself to be mistaken in your conclusion? You are just a fallible mortal yourself, yes?

I am a fallible human just like everyone else. But my Source of information is God and His Prophets.