Trailblazer
Veteran Member
By complex subject, I meant this -- ʻAbdu'l-Bahá states that humans are a distinct species, and not an animal, and that in every stage of evolution through which humans progressed, they were potentially humans.
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Assuming God Loves, How do We Know God Loves?
- Thread starter Sunstone
- Start date
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
I believe they all evolved, but I am no scientist.
ppp
Well-Known Member
What does "potentially humans" mean? Like the fact that we are here in retrospect means that our microbe ancestors were potentially human?
God creates. Evolution creates. God creates through evolution. Stated differently, evolution is how God creates, or best stated, Evolution is God creating.
Yerda
Veteran Member
Ok. Sorry to labour over the matter, but I'm both puzzled and curious. Humans were created by God (like post #3) but also evolved? However, viruses (and presumably other lineages) evolved and weren't also made by God?
I'm reading your linked wiki article, but I seem to be getting further befuddled.
What it is... some peeps reckon their god made the universe and all it contains, except the bits they don't like
you are that thing that you see from afar. but the observer that places a boundary, a distance, between self and otherness is controlling the image of god. come closer and on that day when there is no distance between you and that, I AM. john 14:20
it in your eyes angel
Luke 11 :: King James Version (KJV)
Yerda
Veteran Member
Less puzzled now.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
What does it say?
halbhh
The wonder and awe of "all things".
Ebola is an example of how people are mortal, though not a better example than just other things like cancer, tsunamis and so on... So, if one asks about whatever cause of death being permitted by God, the topic isn't really that one way people die only, but that people die.
The full consideration is only to be addressing death in general. (Or should we only address pneumonia or ebola or floods alone?)
It says all life of earth evolved from a single common ancestor
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
The best I can say is that God did not literally create humans from the dust, as it says in Genesis, but rather God set the process of evolution in motion; so in that sense God is the Creator as it says in Post #3, since God is responsible for evolution.
Windwalker stated it very well:
God creates. Evolution creates. God creates through evolution. Stated differently, evolution is how God creates, or best stated, Evolution is God creating.
#46 Windwalker, Today at 12:32 PM
Last edited:
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Okay thanks, I prefer to stay off this subject since I do not know enough about it.
As I said, the Baha'i belief about human evolution is complicated.
And incorrect
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
My own understanding is "potentially human" is that we always had the potential to be human, which means that we have a rational soul, which differentiates humans from the animal species from which we evolved. Somewhere along the line of evolution, humans were instilled by God with a rational soul and that is when they became human.
As I said to Christiane, the Baha'i view of evolution is complicated and since I am not proficient in scientific subjects I try to stay away from discussing it. Below is a synopsis, but more is written elsewhere.
Evolution
In regards to evolution and the origin of man, `Abdu'l-Bahá gave extensive comments on the subject when he addressed western audiences in the beginning of the 20th century. Transcripts of these talks can be found in Some Answered Questions, Paris Talks and the Promulgation of Universal Peace. `Abdu'l-Bahá describes the human species as evolving from a primitive form to modern man, but that the capacity to form human intelligence was always in existence.[citation needed]
`Abdu'l-Bahá's comments seem to differ from the standard evolutionary picture of human development, where Homo sapiens as one species along with the great apes evolved from a common ancestor living in Africa millions of years ago.
While `Abdu'l-Bahá states that man progressed through many stages before reaching this present form, `Abdu'l-Bahá states that humans are a distinct species, and not an animal, and that in every stage of evolution through which humans progressed, they were potentially humans.
But at all times, even when the embryo resembled a worm, it was human in potentiality and character, not animal. The forms assumed by the human embryo in its successive changes do not prove that it is animal in its essential character. Throughout this progression there has been transference of type, a conservation of species or kind. Realizing this we may acknowledge the fact that at one time man was an inmate of the sea, at another period an invertebrate, then a vertebrate and finally a human being standing erect. Though we admit these changes, we cannot say man is an animal. In each one of these stages are signs and evidences of his human existence and destination.[21]
Mehanian and Friberg wrote a 2003 article describing their belief that `Abdu'l-Bahá's statements can be entirely reconciled with modern science. Mehanian and Friberg state that `Abdu'l-Bahá's departures from the conventional interpretation of evolution are likely due "to disagreements with the metaphysical, philosophical, and ideological aspects of those interpretations, not with scientific findings."[5] And to this end `Abdu'l-Bahá suggested that a missing link between human and apes would not be found.[22] The idea of a missing link per se was abandoned by science in favor of the idea of evolutionary transitions.[23][24]
There are some differences between `Abdu'l-Bahá's statements and current scientific thought. The Bahá’í perspective that religion must be in accordance with science seems to suggest that religion must accept current scientific knowledge as authoritative; but, according to Mehanian and Friberg, this is not necessarily always the case as in their view the present scientific point of view is not always correct, nor truth only limited to what science can explain.[5]
Oskooi chose the subject of evolution and Bahá'í belief for his 2009 thesis, and in doing so reviewed other Bahá'í authors' works on the subject. He concluded that, "The problem of disharmony between scripture and science is rooted in an unwarranted misattribution of scriptural inerrancy."[25] In other words, he believes that `Abdu'l-Bahá made statements about biology that were later proved wrong, and that `Abdu'l-Bahá's infallibility should not be applied to scientific matters.
Several authors have written on the subject of evolution and Bahá'í belief.
- Craig Loehle (1990), On Human Origins: A Bahá’í Perspective
- Eberhard von Kitzing (1997), Is the Bahá'í view of evolution compatible with modern science?
- Courosh Mehanian and Stephan Friberg (2003), Religion and Evolution Reconciled: ‘Abdu’l-Bahá’s Comments on Evolution
- Bahman Nadimi, Do the Baha’i Writings on evolution allow for mutation of species within kingdoms but not across kingdoms?
- Keven Brown (2001), Evolution and Bahá'í Belief: 'Abdu'l-Bahá's Response to Nineteenth-Century Darwinism
- Fariborz Alan Davoodi, MD, Human Evolution: Directed?
- Salman Oskooi (2009), When Science and Religion Merge: A Modern Case Study
stvdv
Veteran Member: I Share (not Debate) my POV
I know that God loves me. But even if I told you, you still would not know, at best believe. All have to find out themselves.
For example by this:
But I tell you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who mistreat you and persecute you, that you may be children of your Father who is in heaven. For he makes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the just and the unjust.
Mat. 5:44-45
Also, I am here to answer to your questions because of God and His love, I think it also shows God loves.