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Featured are the Koran the word of God????Call for dialogue

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by mahasn ebn sawresho, Nov 25, 2015.

  1. mahasn ebn sawresho

    mahasn ebn sawresho Well-Known Member

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    Muslims say that the Koran is the word of God ??
    But the evidence and the mind rejects this claim
    There is abundant evidence that it is writing Mohammed
    An open invitation to dialogue

    And the first evidence that it is not the Word of God
    Koran where many historical and linguistic mistakes
    Does God makes a mistake in his book
    Historical mistakes
    He did not know the difference between Christ and Mary, the mother of Mary, the sister of Aaron
     
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  2. Sirona

    Sirona Hindu Wannabe

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    Well, when I was 14 I read a German translation of the Koran. I made it to Surah 21, then I found it too repetitive and boring and read some of the short ones. I like Surah 100 about the running horses.

    Basically, the Christians re-interpreted the scripture of the Jews and later Mohammed or whoever wrote the Koran took the tales from the scriptures of the Jews and the Bible of the Christians and gave them his own interpretation, mixing them with Arabian tales.
     
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  3. mahasn ebn sawresho

    mahasn ebn sawresho Well-Known Member

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    Did you mean Al-Anbiya
    And al-adiyatSura of the Koran Antiquities
    Surat is a very short section of hair, it does not carry any meaning
    Even in the original Arabic language are meaningless
    But Al-Anbiya
    They fabrication and forgery to Jewish history written by Mohammed
    Yes Mohammed fabricated words of the law in line with its goal
    Moses was Mahrraly the children of Israel after Rahlehm to Pharaonic Egypt
    And Moses killed a man Fronaa
    Moses ran away and married and then returned for the Liberation of the sons of his people
    In their journey to the Promised Land and to Palestine
    But in spite of this acknowledgment and recognition that the Jews deported from Egypt to the Promised Land in Palestine
    He is in the verses that came down in Medina and refuses to copy this verse
    Especially when they curse the children of Israel, and they are called words are not worthy of literary
     
  4. Muffled

    Muffled Jesus in me

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    I believe that evidence doesn't exist but I am willing to listen to what you think it is.

    I believe minds often are confused and misinformed.

    I believe I found no such thing but maybe you could provide a verse.

    I believe I know the voice of God when I hear it and it is definitely there in the Qu'ran.
     
  5. Sirona

    Sirona Hindu Wannabe

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    I mean the chapters of the Koran, according to Wikipedia they are called Surah (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surah). Is that wrong?

    I read chapters 1-21 of the Koran (from Al-Fatiha to Al-Anbiya) and some chapters at the end. Chapter 100 (Al-Aadiyaat) is my favorite.

    I think you should try to learn about criticism of the Koran, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_the_Quran

    You may also want to learn what other religions or atheists think about the Koran.

    There is also a forum on pre-Islamic religions here: http://www.religiousforums.com/forums/middle-eastern-dir.115/


    Last but not least, people who have revelations (hearing voices, visions of angels), may suffer from mental problems, or, in very simple words, be “crazy”. You must find answers yourself to such questions. It is an interesting journey.
     
  6. Carlita

    Carlita The Unveiled Artist

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    God is not defined as a book. The Quran is the Word OF God. The Quran is not god nor is the Bibe and Torah. Inspired people arent perfect. To Abrahamics, God is.

    Think you're mixing inspired "by" god and from god "verbatum."

    If all three believers say their text is perfect; they are calling scripture god.

    That doesnt make sense from any point of view. Muslims are not singled out in this regard.
     
    #6 Carlita, Nov 25, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2015
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  7. Sirona

    Sirona Hindu Wannabe

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    @Muffled, do you know that the Koran states that Jesus is not the son of God, and that he was not crucified? You may lump together Bible and Koran if you please, but I think the essential part of Christianity would be missing. But then, maybe Christianity has changed a bit since I left it.


    Chapter 112 (At-Tawhid)
    1.
    Say (O Muhammad ([​IMG])): "He is Allah, (the) One.

    2. "Allah-us-Samad (The Self-Sufficient Master, Whom all creatures need, He neither eats nor drinks).

    3. "He begets not, nor was He begotten;


    4. "And there is none co-equal or comparable unto Him."

    Chapter 4:156 f. (An-Nisa)


    156. And because of their (Jews) disbelief and uttering against Maryam (Mary) a grave false charge (that she has committed illegal sexual intercourse);

    157.
    And because of their saying (in boast), "We killed Messiah 'Iesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary), the Messenger of Allah," - but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but the resemblance of 'Iesa (Jesus) was put over another man (and they killed that man), and those who differ therein are full of doubts. They have no (certain) knowledge, they follow nothing but conjecture. For surely; they killed him not [i.e. 'Iesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary) ]:
     
    #7 Sirona, Nov 25, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2015
  8. Sirona

    Sirona Hindu Wannabe

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    AFAIK most Muslims think the Quran is God's word verbatim. I read they believe there is a Quran prototype in heaven and that the angels check whether the Qurans on Earth are identical to that prototype.

    To my knowledge the Bible is mostly considered written by human authors "inspired by" God. The Koran is considered God's literal word. So there is a difference.
     
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  9. mahasn ebn sawresho

    mahasn ebn sawresho Well-Known Member

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    ]There is plenty of evidence to prove that the Quran is not the word of God
    But I which I will present to you in this dialogue
    Not only the oldest academically
     
  10. mahasn ebn sawresho

    mahasn ebn sawresho Well-Known Member

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    I do not mixing between God and the Word of God
    God's word has speciel defined
    And also DETAILS
    And the word of God belongs to God, but not God
     
  11. RAYYAN

    RAYYAN Proud Muslim

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    Can you clarify more please
     
  12. Sirona

    Sirona Hindu Wannabe

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    I don't understand this sentence. Could you explain your idea? Are you trying to suggest God is not bound to his own word?
     
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  13. Sirona

    Sirona Hindu Wannabe

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    In the Koran (and in the Bible) for that sake, there are two women called Maryam. Maryam the sister of Aaron, who (is said to) have lived in Moses' time, and Mary the mother of Jesus, who (is said to) have lived much later.
     
  14. mahasn ebn sawresho

    mahasn ebn sawresho Well-Known Member

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    you are right
    Yeah --
    Muslims say it came down in one night
    And called the night Akadddr
    They say he saved in one plate hanging in the sky

    (It is a glorious Quran)
    ( In a written board)
    This is the meaning of the board of the books of Muslims


    The board: each plate petition sheets of wood.

    Azhari said: Gypsum plate of wood and shoulder sheets if reading called for a writing tablet.

    And the board who writes it.

    And the board: Saved the board, and in the download {in} board Mahfouz means: God Msheeiat warehouse.

    Every wide bone plate.

    And the combination of them: panels.

    And Olaoih: Collect combination. "San Arabs" (2/584).

    2. Ibn Kathir may God have mercy on him, said:

    Mahfouz in any board: Mullah top is in an archive of the increase and shortages and distortion switch. "Tafsir Ibn Kathir" (4/497, 498).
    I want to ask Muslims what is the nature of the saved board
    Is it the mud
    Or is of metals

    Or is made of wood

    Does God writes his words on the plates
    I think that this speech did not exceed the boundaries of knowledge in the era of Muhammad
    Offer you this rationale
    God saves your information on the boards
    Panels in the Arabic language made of wood or metal
    And the transfer of Mohammed wrote the Koran is also on the boards
    1400 years ago
    But today we humans use technology and information technology to save the finest and the best of wood
    Which is better in keeping information
    Man or God? Do not get angry from this question, O Muslims
    It is a question of mind
    1400 years ago, God used wood panels notation of his information about the creature and it also came KoranIt is a question of mind
    But we humans use today means the finest of wood to save the information
    ???
    I wish you to know the meaning of my questions Statistics
    Even them know that the Quran is not the word of God
     
  15. Carlita

    Carlita The Unveiled Artist

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    I guess I would have to ask a Muslim. I only know from a Christian perspective, that most don't see the Bible written by God verbatim but inspired people wrote the Bible inspired by God. Some Christians see it as because it was by God and not verbatim, there are room for cultural errors and "so called" contradictions. However, God doesn't lie about the message the written word says.

    With the Quran and Torah, I'm mostly aware of the Bible still being inspired by which is different than written by.

    For example, I am inspired by the spirits to write a book to tell about their lives and traditions so my children and children's children will follow. So, the inspiration is, indeed, true and legit. It's not a lie. However, since I am human (as many in the Bible are), I may make mistakes in what I write not the message behind it. Most of my children knows this and that does not mean the spirits did not write it. It just means that mama has a little twist of telling what the spirits what they should know. That twist comes from different generational background than my children. It also comes from age and different experiences.

    Likewise with spiritual text. Just replace spirits with God. Children as believers. Traditions as the sacred text itself. Mama as the writers of the text.

    It's not a lie (from the believers view) that sacred text is not from God. I just think you're mixing inspired by with written verbatim.

    Can't know without confirmations from actual Muslims, though.

    :leafwind:
    What is AFAIK?
     
  16. mahasn ebn sawresho

    mahasn ebn sawresho Well-Known Member

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    O sister of Aaron, your father was not bad and your mother was a prostitute) Mary / 27The difference here is clear proof that it is not the Word of God
    Does God does not know the difference between Mary, the Mother of Christ and Mary Joachim girl girl Jacob and the sister of Moses and the difference between the two characters almost two thousand years BC ????
     
  17. mahasn ebn sawresho

    mahasn ebn sawresho Well-Known Member

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    This is true in Christianity and we agree that the Bible is inspired by God
    But it is written in the language and methods of human beings
    In other words, the content of one idea with multiple methods in
    But the Koran is different from the concept
    Download it directly from a book written in the sky
    This is a big problem
     
  18. Carlita

    Carlita The Unveiled Artist

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    I'd have to ask a Muslim. If you're a Christian or someone of a different faith, your views maybe colored differently even by what you read. It is not because you may be right or wrong; it just means, from a believers point of view, you may not have the right point of view that a Muslim would have concerning his sacred text and his god and his point of knowledge that non-believers should ask of him not judge the validity for ourselves.

    In other words, for example, I have no right to say the Quran is right or wrong. All I can say is I disagree with X and I am used to Y; however, I can see why, believer Z you would see it that way hence why you'd say is sacred. From your view not mine, I agree.
     
  19. morphesium

    morphesium Active Member

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    Quran is not for the thinking mind.
     
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  20. Sirona

    Sirona Hindu Wannabe

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    @Carlita you just repeated my argument.

    Sure.

    @mahasn ebn sawresho are you a Muslim?

    As far as I know.



    @mahasn ebn sawresho seems to support the view that the Koran is God’s literal word “downloaded” straight from the sky. A “download” creates a copy identical to the prototype.
     
    #20 Sirona, Nov 25, 2015
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2015
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