Anti-Bullying Speaker Curses Christian Teens

[Falvlun]

When people are walking out of a talk...he's gone a little too far as far as those folks were concerned. To them, it was hurtful or angering.

I think the vast majority of those kids walked out because they thought it would be cool to make a stand like that, and their friends were doing it too, not because they were hurt or scared or even angry. It is often exhilarating to feel like you are standing up for an unpopular cause.

The fact of the matter is that the Bible-- and the interpretation certain Christians have given it-- is the main reason many people are anti-homosexual. Should we ignore a root source of a problem simply because it is part of a religion, and criticizing religion can be hurtful?

The part regarding the Bible, the part the kids walked out on, was rather benign and honest. Savage did not say that Christianity was BS or that the entire Bible was BS or that all Christians were intolerant bullies. He simply pointed out that other morally questionable or morally irrelevant things in the Bible were happily ignored, or relegated to "the past", while this one thing has continued to hang on. He provided a perspective and a path for kids who want to remain true to their faith, but think that means they must be anti-gay.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

Does anyone else find it ironic that a gay activist delivering a speech against homophobia used the term "pansy"?

 

[A Troubled Man]

Does anyone else find it ironic that a gay activist delivering a speech against homophobia used the term "pansy"?

It seemed to me to be well placed wit on the part of Savage.

 

[jarofthoughts]

OK, so I watched the video.
Where's the problem? :sarcastic

Everything Savage said about the Bible is true, and if some of the Christian students in the audience found that appalling, then perhaps they should read the book that is the basis of their faith.

I mean, if this had been an elementary school, I'd find the speech ill-suited and inappropriate, but this was a high school, so I really don't see what the fuzz is about.

 

[Revoltingest]

Does anyone else find it ironic that a gay activist delivering a speech against homophobia used the term "pansy"?

Yup....it was weird.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

Yup....it was weird.

It would have been cooler if he told them this:

"Walking out is soooo gay! You guys are acting like a bunch of ***s!"

 

[Desert Snake]

OK, so I watched the video.
Where's the problem? :sarcastic

The problem is that it's a public school, and there is supposedly "separation of church and state". You can't just start criticizing one religion or Holy Book in a public school, it's innapropriate.
That being said I don't think it was malicious, rather just a poor choice of speech content.

 

[A Troubled Man]

The problem is that it's a public school, and there is supposedly "separation of church and state". You can't just start criticizing one religion or Holy Book in a public school, it's innapropriate.

If religious myths and superstitions are taught in school, they are open for criticism, which is one of the basic fundamentals of critical thinking.

 

[Me Myself]

The problem is that it's a public school, and there is supposedly "separation of church and state". You can't just start criticizing one religion or Holy Book in a public school, it's innapropriate.
That being said I don't think it was malicious, rather just a poor choice of speech content.

Nonsense. A public school is separated from Mc Donald establishments, tghat doesn´t mean they can´t teach you nutrition and tell you what´s good and what´s bad for you.

We are talking about a book that promotes slavery and gay killing, being critisized about exactly those arts of the book.

 

[jarofthoughts]

The problem is that it's a public school, and there is supposedly "separation of church and state". You can't just start criticizing one religion or Holy Book in a public school, it's innapropriate.

As I saw it he mainly explained what the Bible said and that even those who call themselves Christians do not follow many of the rules laid out in it. Sure, he did express an opinion on the matter, which from a pedagogical point of view is not a good practice, but he was not there as a teacher.
Facts are facts after all.
I have myself been asked in Science class by my students whether Adam and Eve actually existed and in those cases I have no qualms about telling them that, no, they did not.
Some might take offence to that and consider it meddling in the students' potential religions, but those are simply the facts.
Now, somewhat more caution should be considered when teaching, say, elementary school, but again this was a high-school.
If he had told the students that Christianity is nonsense or something to that effect, then I might understand it, but he didn't.

 

[Desert Snake]

As I saw it he mainly explained what the Bible said and that even those who call themselves Christians do not follow many of the rules laid out in it. Sure, he did express an opinion on the matter, which from a pedagogical point of view is not a good practice, but he was not there as a teacher.
Facts are facts after all.
I have myself been asked in Science class by my students whether Adam and Eve actually existed and in those cases I have no qualms about telling them that, no, they did not.
Some might take offence to that and consider it meddling in the students' potential religions, but those are simply the facts.
Now, somewhat more caution should be considered when teaching, say, elementary school, but again this was a high-school.
If he had told the students that Christianity is nonsense or something to that effect, then I might understand it, but he didn't.

I don't agree with those Judaic laws either, however shouldn't the speaker have known that it was going to cause a problem by bringing them up?
Anyways, whether he's allowed to do something or not doesn't change my opinion that it was a poor choice in references. He could have said people were influenced against gays because of 'religion' or something, no need to single out the Bible IMO.

 

[jarofthoughts]

I don't agree with those Judaic laws either, however shouldn't the speaker have known that it was going to cause a problem by bringing them up?

If (some) Christians have problems with parts of the Bible and people bringing them up, perhaps they should have these discussions themselves.
Maybe it is time to edit the Bible somewhat to update it to modern times.
It's not as if it hasn't happened before...

Anyways, whether he's allowed to do something or not doesn't change my opinion that it was a poor choice in references. He could have said people were influenced against gays because of 'religion' or something, no need to single out the Bible IMO.

Considering that he was holding the speech in the US, a country that is predominantly Christian, which means that the anti-gay sentiments he was addressing very often stems from Christianity and the Bible, I don't think it would be fair to lump Hindus and Buddhists into this.

 

[HerDotness]

I don't agree with those Judaic laws either, however shouldn't the speaker have known that it was going to cause a problem by bringing them up?

You grossly underestimate Savage's intelligence if you think that he didn't know precisely what the impact of what he said was likely to be.

I expect that criticizing the Bible and how it's used to bash gay people and keep them in the closet by so many Christians was his precisely his intent, perhaps because he thought it's about time we put the blame where it lies--on how too many Christians claim that the sacrifice of Jesus supersedes OT law but yet cite the portions of that very law that aid their bigotry against gays.

Anyways, whether he's allowed to do something or not doesn't change my opinion that it was a poor choice in references. He could have said people were influenced against gays because of 'religion' or something, no need to single out the Bible IMO.

Yeah, he should make nice-nice because it's pleasant to hear all your life that your deepest longings for sexual and emotional intimacy are a hateful sin..."Oh, but don't think we don't love you. It's just that God says you have to be celibate all your life if you can't/won't get right and be heterosexual."

At some point, a gay person has blankety-blank well had ENOUGH.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

Here's an example of bullying -

The state has been considering passing a law restricting schools from even mentioning homosexuality except in very rare instances.

First, what kind of bat-**** crazy law is this? How will it be enforced? What are the consequences for just talking about being gay?

Second, anyone who thinks Savage's foot-in-mouth speech is anywhere near as bad as this legislative atrocity has got all kinds of priorities mixed up.

Third, i see no discussions (again) that are impassioned about the state passing bullcrap ordinances such as this while people can become so enraged over a speech. A speech.

One more time, tell me, who are the one's that are really getting bullied here?

 

[Revoltingest]

Third, i see no discussions (again) that are impassioned about the state passing bullcrap ordinances such as this while people can become so enraged over a speech. A speech.

The speech attracted more attention because of the drama associated with the speaker's hypocrisy.
The proposed legislation is just plain old oppression, & milder than some, which attracts less attention.
I ain't say'n it's right, just that this is how things usually play out.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

The speech attracted more attention because of the drama associated with the speaker's hypocrisy.
The proposed legislation is just plain old oppression, & milder than some, which attracts less attention.
I ain't say'n it's right, just that this is how things usually play out.

*throws shoe against the wall*

Dang it. The truth freaking hurts.

 

[Revoltingest]

*throws shoe against the wall*
Dang it. The truth freaking hurts.

That's an advantage of my not believing in "truth".
I'm just at war with my foes. Tis less personal that way.
And I lose fewer shoes.

 

[Revoltingest]

Hey, Mystic....here's something to cheer you up.
Instead of God bullying gays, watch a guy bully a god.....silent movie style.

Caution! Spoiler Alert!
A portion of The Avengers movie awaits.
[youtube]ZjK9CSZwx4w[/youtube]
Hulk Smash Loki: The Avengers Epic Battle (Silent Movie Parody) - YouTube

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I think the vast majority of those kids walked out because they thought it would be cool to make a stand like that, and their friends were doing it too, not because they were hurt or scared or even angry. It is often exhilarating to feel like you are standing up for an unpopular cause.

The fact of the matter is that the Bible-- and the interpretation certain Christians have given it-- is the main reason many people are anti-homosexual. Should we ignore a root source of a problem simply because it is part of a religion, and criticizing religion can be hurtful?

The part regarding the Bible, the part the kids walked out on, was rather benign and honest. Savage did not say that Christianity was BS or that the entire Bible was BS or that all Christians were intolerant bullies. He simply pointed out that other morally questionable or morally irrelevant things in the Bible were happily ignored, or relegated to "the past", while this one thing has continued to hang on. He provided a perspective and a path for kids who want to remain true to their faith, but think that means they must be anti-gay.

I can't help wondering if any of the kids from the Christian schools were coached: "if he says anything against God or the Bible, just get up and leave."

 

[CynthiaCypher]

I can't help wondering if any of the kids from the Christian schools were coached: "if he says anything against God or the Bible, just get up and leave."

I read some reports that it was staged and orchestrated by NOM and Focus on the Family. Savage has given similar speeches before, so it could have been staged.