And another.....Texas anti-mask movement leader dies of COVID-19

[Revoltingest]

I doubt it. I've talked to many who actually believe every death gets covid listed as the cause of death even if the deceased didn't have covid.
Some will say he died of something else.
I have strong doubts about that many more coming to reason.

I temper my hope with low expectations.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

It's no different than an HIV/AIDs denier swapping drug needles and having lots of unprotected, high risk sex and being surprised this person died from AIDs.
Or people who downplay food safety getting food poisoning.
Or someone who downplays seatbelts who gets bashed through the windshield.
When you increase your risks and exposure to a deadly virus you are more likely to get it and suffer the consequences.

It's not an increase. Vaxxers lowered their risk so it seems like an increase relative to the unvax.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

It's not an increase. Vaxxers lowered their risk so it seems like an increase relative to the unvax.

It is an increase when you do thinks that increase your exposure and risk. Like not distancing or wearing a mask. That does increase the odds of getting covid.

 

[1213]

It's no different than an HIV/AIDs denier swapping drug needles and having lots of unprotected, high risk sex and being surprised this person died from AIDs.
Or people who downplay food safety getting food poisoning.
Or someone who downplays seatbelts who gets bashed through the windshield.
When you increase your risks and exposure to a deadly virus you are more likely to get it and suffer the consequences.

My point is, if there are two people who have Covid, it seems of those the one who has been against the Covid Tyranny publicly dies more probably. In this case it does not matter did they use protection, because they both have the virus.

Or what do you think, if there are two persons who have food poisoning, is it more probably that the one who got it even when he didn't downplay safety, survives more likely when he has that poisoning?

I understand that in principle, person who is more cautious, could avoid the problem, but when we are speaking of people who got it anyway, it really does not matter in this, did they obey.

 

[1213]

Okay, let's drop the prejudicial terms. I could just as well refer to opposition to vaccinations as "anti-science stupidity". The facts are that the evidence shows that vaccinations work. I can link sources that will tell you with this latest outbreak that the unvaccinated are getting ill at a much higher rate than the vaccinated. And if the vaccinated do get ill the odds of dying are much much lower for the vaccinated....

I don't think there is any real data to support that.

...It is a mistake to think that vaccinations are 100% effective. I would be willing to wager that they are more than 90% effective against dying ...

Doesn't sound very impressive, when the chance to survive it without vaccine is over 97 %.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I don't think there is any real data to support that.



Doesn't sound very impressive, when the chance to survive it without vaccine is over 97 %.

Then you have not studied this at all. It appears that you are only believing what you want to believe. The AP, as reliable news source that there is did a study of CDC firgures:

Nearly all COVID deaths in US are now among unvaccinated

"An Associated Press analysis of available government data from May shows that “breakthrough” infections in fully vaccinated people accounted for fewer than 1,200 of more than 107,000 COVID-19 hospitalizations. That’s about 1.1%.

And only about 150 of the more than 18,000 COVID-19 deaths in May were in fully vaccinated people. That translates to about 0.8%, or five deaths per day on average."'

The answer is simple, if you do not want to die of Covid, get vaccinated. It is dang close to 100% effective at that.

Your usage of statistics is improper. Your odds of dying if you get Corona virus varies greatly. The vaccine lowers it by a factor of over 100.

Lastly you claim to be a Christian. Then you should look at this problem as a Christian. That means you should not be putting yourself first. You may be at low risk. That does not mean that you do not need to get vaccinated. The problem with a pandemic is that people keep passing it on. People that have it can be contagious for up to a week before they realize that they are ill. You are more apt to catch it and pass it on if you are unvaccinated. As a Christian your first thought should be about others and not yourself. It is people that resist measures such as masking, social distancing, and getting vaccinated that has kept this virus a problem in this country.

 

[1213]

...
Nearly all COVID deaths in US are now among unvaccinated
...

By what I know, even vaccinated can be counted unvaccinated, if they got it not a long time ago.

...The answer is simple, if you do not want to die of Covid, get vaccinated. It is dang close to 100% effective at that.

Data from Israel seems to disagree with you. The vaccine doesn't prevent death and in a bad case it can cause death. But, I am not against vaccines, I am against medical tyranny and fascism. I think all people should be free to decide do they want that experimental drug or not. I think it is utterly evil how governments are pushing it like totalitarian fascists.

...Lastly you claim to be a Christian. Then you should look at this problem as a Christian. That means you should not be putting yourself first.

I agree, my loyalty is for Jesus, not for you. He is the one who determines to me what is to be a Christian (= a disciple of Jesus), and by his teachings I want to live. So, I am not putting my self first, that is why I give my vaccines for others.

I think it is a good idea to think, what Jesus would have said in this situation. One thing that comes to my mind is:

Therefore whatever you desire for men to do to you, you shall also do to them; for this is the law and the prophets.
Matt. 7:12

I like human rights and freedom, that is why I want to help also others to have them and don’t want to force Covid tyranny to anyone, even though even I have had the virus. I don't blame other people for that I got it. It is normal risk in the life. All though in this case it seems that Fauci was funding the development of this virus and it was intentionally released to cause problems.

...That does not mean that you do not need to get vaccinated. The problem with a pandemic is that people keep passing it on. People that have it can be contagious for up to a week before they realize that they are ill.

The problem with that is, also vaccinated can pass it on. The vaccine doesn't really prevent it, as you can see in countries that have almost all vaccinated and it still goes on (like in Israel). Or why do you think even US government wants vaccinated to use masks also?

...As a Christian your first thought should be about others and not yourself. It is people that resist measures such as masking, social distancing, and getting vaccinated that has kept this virus a problem in this country.

What I speak here is really for others nor for me, I can stay in my basement all the time, it is not a problem.

I think people should be free to decide by themselves do they get the vaccine. People should be free to live normally, without Covid fascism. This doesn't mean that the virus can't be bad. I just think the correct way to handle this situation is not to revoke human rights. I think correct way is that people understand that there are always risks in normal life. If they want to avoid them, they are free to stay in their basement, or use masks and vaccines. But those who want to live, should be allowed to live normally. If people stop living because of fear, they are already dead.

As Jesus said:

...fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell...
Matt. 10:28

...Therefore I tell you, don't be anxious for your life, what you will eat, nor yet for your body, what you will wear. Life is more than food, and the body is more than clothing. ...
Luke 12:22-31

For whoever desires to save his life will lose it...
Matt. 16:25

This is why I hope people are not ruled by fear of death.

 

[Subduction Zone]

By what I know, even vaccinated can be counted unvaccinated, if they got it not a long time ago.

I am not sure of that, but that would be a group that is rather small number since the time is only two weeks from one's second vaccine to be fully immunized. You are now grasping at straws.

Data from Israel seems to disagree with you. The vaccine doesn't prevent death and in a bad case it can cause death. But, I am not against vaccines, I am against medical tyranny and fascism. I think all people should be free to decide do they want that experimental drug or not. I think it is utterly evil how governments are pushing it like totalitarian fascists.

You need to supply a reliable source when making such a claim. You may have either misunderstood a reliable source or are listening to a dishonest one. That is why I provided a source for a claim.

I agree, my loyalty is for Jesus, not for you. He is the one who determines to me what is to be a Christian (= a disciple of Jesus), and by his teachings I want to live. So, I am not putting my self first, that is why I give my vaccines for others.

I think it is a good idea to think, what Jesus would have said in this situation. One thing that comes to my mind is:

Therefore whatever you desire for men to do to you, you shall also do to them; for this is the law and the prophets.
Matt. 7:12

I like human rights and freedom, that is why I want to help also others to have them and don’t want to force Covid tyranny to anyone, even though even I have had the virus. I don't blame other people for that I got it. It is normal risk in the life. All though in this case it seems that Fauci was funding the development of this virus and it was intentionally released to cause problems.

But you are putting yourself first and not acting as Jesus would have you act. You are making yourself more dangerous to other people. Do you understand that this disease keeps getting passed on because a person can be contagious for up to a week before he or she realizes that he or she is infected? The vast majority of people do not want to infect others, but people still do so because they cannot know that they are ill.

The problem with that is, also vaccinated can pass it on. The vaccine doesn't really prevent it, as you can see in countries that have almost all vaccinated and it still goes on (like in Israel). Or why do you think even US government wants vaccinated to use masks also?

I never denied it. But again, one is much less likely to do that if one is vaccinated. Now you are trying to use a black and white fallacy as an excuse. The vaccination reduces the odds that one will get ill and be able to pass it on. No one has claimed that it is perfect. Please quit using this false argument. The question is does it lower the rate of transmission. Using masks along with a vaccination drops the odds of transmission even further. When it comes to the Delta virus if no actions are taken the average person will transmit it to 5 to 8 different people. It should be able to understand that without any preventive actions that it would not be long before almost everyone got the disease with those numbers. The goal is to lower the R value from 5 to 8 to a number that is less than 1. That is what is needed to get rid of the virus. Please note, we do not need a value of 0 to get rid of the virus:

https://states.aarp.org/west-virgin...#:~:text=While the initial COVID-19,R0 of 5-8.

What I speak here is really for others nor for me, I can stay in my basement all the time, it is not a problem.

Do you? Do you stay in the basement? How would you get food? How would you do all of the things that you need to do? The problem is that the unvaccinated are not locking themselves up in the basement. They are trying to live their life as it was before the pandemic, and that cannot be done right now.

I think people should be free to decide by themselves do they get the vaccine. People should be free to live normally, without Covid fascism. This doesn't mean that the virus can't be bad. I just think the correct way to handle this situation is not to revoke human rights. I think correct way is that people understand that there are always risks in normal life. If they want to avoid them, they are free to stay in their basement, or use masks and vaccines. But those who want to live, should be allowed to live normally. If people stop living because of fear, they are already dead.

As Jesus said:

...fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell...
Matt. 10:28

...Therefore I tell you, don't be anxious for your life, what you will eat, nor yet for your body, what you will wear. Life is more than food, and the body is more than clothing. ...
Luke 12:22-31

For whoever desires to save his life will lose it...
Matt. 16:25

This is why I hope people are not ruled by fear of death.

Yes, Jesus was far from perfect and preached a bit of what would be obvious ignorant idiocy today. You should be concentrating on what he got right and not where he screwed up.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Is there any real proof that the virus was the reason really?

I find it suspicious that the virus targets and kills especially those who are against the Covid tyranny and fascism.

You find it suspicious that during a global pandemic, the people who are unvaccinated and/or refuse to wear masks and social distance to protect themselves and others have died in large numbers?
Seriously?
That sounds like exactly what we should expect to happen.

 

[SkepticThinker]

True, it kills also other people. But, it seems the odds are higher, if person has been publicly against the Covid tyranny. If for example the percentage to die for it is generally 0,3 % for under 60 year old, it seems that for those who publicly have questioned Covid tyranny, the probability to die is much higher. But maybe it is just an illusion that comes from how the issue is presented in media.

Odd, how? What are you suggesting?

 

[SkepticThinker]

By what I know, even vaccinated can be counted unvaccinated, if they got it not a long time ago.



Data from Israel seems to disagree with you. The vaccine doesn't prevent death and in a bad case it can cause death. But, I am not against vaccines, I am against medical tyranny and fascism. I think all people should be free to decide do they want that experimental drug or not. I think it is utterly evil how governments are pushing it like totalitarian fascists.



I agree, my loyalty is for Jesus, not for you. He is the one who determines to me what is to be a Christian (= a disciple of Jesus), and by his teachings I want to live. So, I am not putting my self first, that is why I give my vaccines for others.

I think it is a good idea to think, what Jesus would have said in this situation. One thing that comes to my mind is:

Therefore whatever you desire for men to do to you, you shall also do to them; for this is the law and the prophets.
Matt. 7:12

I like human rights and freedom, that is why I want to help also others to have them and don’t want to force Covid tyranny to anyone, even though even I have had the virus. I don't blame other people for that I got it. It is normal risk in the life. All though in this case it seems that Fauci was funding the development of this virus and it was intentionally released to cause problems.



The problem with that is, also vaccinated can pass it on. The vaccine doesn't really prevent it, as you can see in countries that have almost all vaccinated and it still goes on (like in Israel). Or why do you think even US government wants vaccinated to use masks also?



What I speak here is really for others nor for me, I can stay in my basement all the time, it is not a problem.

I think people should be free to decide by themselves do they get the vaccine. People should be free to live normally, without Covid fascism. This doesn't mean that the virus can't be bad. I just think the correct way to handle this situation is not to revoke human rights. I think correct way is that people understand that there are always risks in normal life. If they want to avoid them, they are free to stay in their basement, or use masks and vaccines. But those who want to live, should be allowed to live normally. If people stop living because of fear, they are already dead.

As Jesus said:

...fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell...
Matt. 10:28

...Therefore I tell you, don't be anxious for your life, what you will eat, nor yet for your body, what you will wear. Life is more than food, and the body is more than clothing. ...
Luke 12:22-31

For whoever desires to save his life will lose it...
Matt. 16:25

This is why I hope people are not ruled by fear of death.

I don't agree that people should be able to live "normally" if that puts other people at risk.
Living in a society comes with some responsibility.

 

[1213]

I don't agree that people should be able to live "normally" if that puts other people at risk...

There will always be risks as long as people live.

 

[1213]

You find it suspicious that during a global pandemic, the people who are unvaccinated and/or refuse to wear masks and social distance to protect themselves and others have died in large numbers?
Seriously?
That sounds like exactly what we should expect to happen.

Sorry, if I have been unclear to you. It may be that the person who is against Covid fascism gets easier the virus. However, that is not the situation I was speaking of. The point is, if there are two people who have the virus already, both should have same probability to die for it, when they are as old and healthy. If then the one who has been publicly against Covid tyranny dies more often, it is weird, because the probability should be the same.

 

[SkepticThinker]

There will always be risks as long as people live.

Yes, of course.
But there are certain actions we can carry out that can help to minimize certain risks.

Weird how you left this line out of my post:
"I don't agree that people should be able to live "normally" if that puts other people at risk.
Living in a society comes with some responsibility."

Why is that?

 

[SkepticThinker]

Sorry, if I have been unclear to you. It may be that the person who is against Covid fascism gets easier the virus. However, that is not the situation I was speaking of. The point is, if there are two people who have the virus already, both should have same probability to die for it, when they are as old and healthy. If then the one who has been publicly against Covid tyranny dies more often, it is weird, because the probability should be the same.

I'm sorry but that doesn't make any sense.

 

[1213]

Yes, of course.
But there are certain actions we can carry out that can help to minimize certain risks.

Weird how you left this line out of my post:
"I don't agree that people should be able to live "normally" if that puts other people at risk.
Living in a society comes with some responsibility."

Why is that?

We seem to agree that there is always risks. That is why I think correct way is that people are allowed to be free and live normally, if someone doesn't want to take risks, he is free to stay at his home, or use protective gear. I think it is utterly evil to deny normal life because some people fear and don't want to accept risks in normal life. It is very sad that today world is led by control freak fascists.

 

[SkepticThinker]

We seem to agree that there is always risks. That is why I think correct way is that people are allowed to be free and live normally, if someone doesn't want to take risks, he is free to stay at his home, or use protective gear. I think it is utterly evil to deny normal life because some people fear and don't want to accept risks in normal life. It is very sad that today world is led by control freak fascists.

So you're not into minimizing risks?
Do you think drunk driving laws are fascist?


Sorry, you've lost me. I don't want to live in the world you want to live in. It sounds like a terrible place where nobody cares about anybody else and nobody is interested in being a responsible and contributing member of the society they want to live in.

 

[1213]

So you're not into minimizing risks?
Do you think drunk driving laws are fascist?

When the minimizing risk means basically that we could as well be dead, I don’t like it. I think people should be free to live normally. I don’t think drunk driving is normal life, if you think it is, I am sorry for you. Reason why I have no problem with forbidding drunk driving is that it is not essential to anyone, it is very probably harmful for the person and others. But, perhaps it would not be needed to restrict. If person does so and causes damage, he should be fully responsible of all that.

Sorry, you've lost me. I don't want to live in the world you want to live in. It sounds like a terrible place where nobody cares about anybody else and nobody is interested in being a responsible and contributing member of the society they want to live in.

You think people care now? I don't see any evidence for that. On the contrary, I think people are very evil and selfish in how they want to destroy freedom and human rights. I don’t like the fascistic dystopia Covid tyrants are pushing to all.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

You think people care now? I don't see any evidence for that. On the contrary, I think people are very evil and selfish in how they want to destroy freedom and human rights. I don’t like the fascistic dystopia Covid tyrants are pushing to all.

You seriously have no idea what tyranny and fascism is if you think covid restrictions are that. This is a natural disaster. Those usually do come with restrictions when they are severe enough.
Now, how about addressing the point of how responsiblity and freedom go hand in hand and are inseparable for a healthy society to not descend into chaos.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

True, it kills also other people. But, it seems the odds are higher, if person has been publicly against the Covid tyranny. If for example the percentage to die for it is generally 0,3 % for under 60 year old, it seems that for those who publicly have questioned Covid tyranny, the probability to die is much higher. But maybe it is just an illusion that comes from how the issue is presented in media.

Yeeeees... the odds ARE higher of dying of Covid if you're unvaccinated. People against the vaccine are unvaccinated, thus have higher odds of dying of Covid. There's no conspiracy here, just basic maths.

People who swim in the ocean are more likely to drown than people who never go near water. That doesn't require a conspiracy against swimmers to explain.