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Abortion: Are you pro-life or pro-choice?

Discussion in 'General Debates' started by Saw11_2000, Feb 18, 2005.

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  1. A woman should be allowed to get an abortion at any time for any reason.

    27.4%
  2. Abortions should be allowed, but it should not be used as birth control.

    32.7%
  3. Abortion should be allowed, but only for extreme situations, such as rape.

    16.8%
  4. Abortions should be 100% illegal. Period.

    23.0%
  1. Ðanisty

    Ðanisty Well-Known Member

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    I'm pro-choice and I feel abortion should be allowed for any reason, however I don't think people should use if for birth control. The decision is up to them, but I personally think it's very irresponsible. People should have to put forth at least a little effort to keep from getting pregnant if that is what they want. Birth control does fail though and in those cases, I fully support abortion. When abortion becomes a habit, there is something seriously wrong.
     
  2. Jayhawker Soule

    Jayhawker Soule <yawn> ignore </yawn>
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    Scientific purpose?
     
  3. Smoke

    Smoke Done here.

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    My parents are staunch opponents of abortion. During one discussion Mom declared that she would gladly have sacrificed her own life if it meant the difference in being able to bring a pregnancy to term. So I asked my dad whether he would have agreed with that decision. (Uncomfortable silence.)
     
  4. Popeyesays

    Popeyesays Well-Known Member

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    I do not think the law can legislate morality.
    abortion is a sober decision to be reached only after an individual consults with family and medical care specialists. As a method of birth control it is reprehensible. A woman should be aware it is a somber decision that results in the death of a human being, and her reasons for doing so should outweigh that fact. Other than that the law can butt the hell out.

    Regards,
    Scott
     
  5. Smoke

    Smoke Done here.

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    A subtle shift. You've been talking about the "scientific" purpose of sex being reproduction, and you could obviously make a case for reproduction as a biological function of sex. However, there's nothing about rape that changes that, so you're forced to concede that the intention of rape is not reproduction. But I think you could safely say that in most cases that's not the intent of consensual sexual intercourse, either.

    If abortion is wrong because the purpose of sexual intercourse is reproduction, does it follow that it's wrong to practice contraception? To have sexual intercourse with a spouse who is sterile or who is already pregnant? To have sexual intercourse after menopause?

    Isn't it possible that sexual intercourse has other purposes besides reproduction? Isn't it even possible that orgasm, specifically, may have purposes distinct from reproduction?
     
  6. MysticSang'ha

    MysticSang'ha Big Squishy Hugger
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    I stand with most conservatives on this issue, because it goes against my religious beliefs. Abortion goes against one of the Five Precepts, which is the act of taking a life, and a human life, at that - no matter at what stage of development.

    The taking of precious human life results in an enormous amount of bad karma. I cannot in good conscience be comfortable with that.



    That being said........



    It's a tricky issue because it's easy to champion the rights of an unborn baby, and at the same time ignore the quality of life of the mother who is carrying that child. Putting abortion, in legal terms, in the same light as first degree murder is a very "pie-in-the-sky" kind of idea, simply because a certain vocal segment of pro-lifers are still envisioning the pregnant mother as nothing more than a "vessel" to house the baby until it comes to term.


    Society still has a long way to go, IMO. I say continue to change people's hearts toward eliminating even the slightest subjugation of women with the same passion as protecting the unborn.



    I did not read through the whole thread, so if I have somehow accidentally parroted someone else's thoughts, then carry on to the next post. :)





    Peace,
    Mystic
     
  7. Abram

    Abram Abraham

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    Let me tell you a story of a man by the name of Dr. Bernard Nathanson. In 1970 he started the nation's largest abortion clinic called CRASH (Center for Reproductive and Sexual Health.) In fact he even performed an abortion on his own girlfriend. In 1973 when Roe vs. Wade made it legal across the country he left there and went on to other things but still doing abortions.

    A little time later a new gadget came out called the ultrasound machine, which literally opened a new window to fetal development. He was in the dark room watching a demo of the machine. The screen pulled in to view as the technician showed the heart, then up to the head, you could see everything. Zooming in and out and down to the little toes. A baby tossing and turning like he knew he was being watched.

    It hit Dr. Nathanson like a ton of bricks. This is not just a fetus but a life. He realized that he has dismembered small children like this many times in his life. In this realization he knew he had to show the world what is really happening. He had a abortion filmed on the ultrasound machine to show what happens.

    Up till I saw this video I never wanted the burden of even a choice in this matter. Especially being that I have never had to make a yes or no decision on this subject. But watching this little 11 week old baby try to run and hide from what was happening I formed a opinion real quick on this subject.


    WARNING: This video contains graphic images which some may find disturbing. If you are a young person and have any doubts about viewing these videos, please check with your parents before proceeding any further

    http://silentscream.org/video1.htm
     
  8. Ðanisty

    Ðanisty Well-Known Member

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    I've watched your video and my opinion has not changed. I am not convinced in any way that a fetus has equal value to any person who has been born. It was a rather interesting and educational film though.

    I would like to point out that it's obvious the reason there was a major increase in abortions after it was legalized is because women felt they could do it safely. I have no doubt whatsoever that many more women would have had illegal abortions if they hadn't been afraid for their own lives.
     
  9. standing_on_one_foot

    standing_on_one_foot Well-Known Member

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    Just because I like to say this, it's against my religion that abortion should not be allowed under any circumstances. The mother's life always has priority over potential life (once it's born, of course, the situation changes).

    No, I do not think people should use abortion as birth control. I think people should use things like condoms for birth control. But, if a woman needs an abortion, it needs to be an option.

    Plus, I happen to think that abortion is more moral the sooner it's done, if it's going to be done at all, because it's not as though potential life has no value. So, abortion needs to be easily available so that if a woman is going to do it, she'll do it sooner rather than later (and most abortions do take place early on already).
     
  10. Buttons*

    Buttons* Glass half Panda'd

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    I watched the video, but i still feel that abortions should be legal, and like most people have said, i dont think it should be simply for birth control.

    However, no one has the right to make me go through a pregnancy i dont want.
     
  11. Ardhanariswar

    Ardhanariswar I'm back!

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    How old is that video? Its so full of bias it was unbearable to watch.

    anyway. Yeah its violent. Killing something isnt going to be fun. Nowadays Im sure they use chemcials to dispose of the embryo in its early stages.

    I think abortion should be legal so long as the fetus cannot function without the female. In other words, if the fetus can live without being dependant on its mom, it should be considered to be a human and have its own rights and such.

    But as long as it gathers nutrients and blood from its mom, the fetus is more like a parasite.

    Its the woman's body, she has the right to cut her arm off, and she should have the right to cut her potential baby off. the key word is potential. meaning its not a human yet. its not human. therefore it has no rights.

    The world is over populated anyway. if you wanted a child that bad, adopt (not just those blond haired, blue eyed males). I wish the government would pay more attention to the hideous adoption system in america. its so horrid and corrupt. Before that can happen, I think abortion should be anyone's right.
     
  12. Ormiston

    Ormiston Well-Known Member

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    I have to agree with this to some degree. A developing fetus is a part of the woman's body the same as her arm. Although, some measure of sanity has to be applied. Any woman who tried to cut her arm off in public would be institutionalized. I think we're on the right course with legal abortions mingled with legal restrictions on term.
     
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  13. Quiddity

    Quiddity UndertheInfluenceofGiants

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    Umm...pro-life.
     
  14. Daniel Burbank

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    Not to take anything away from your view, but aren't newborn babies like parasites as well? Newborn babies can't live by themselves. They are solely dependent on others. So does that make a newborn baby not human? What, then, separates a newborn baby from being the same as a fetus other than that it is a parasite outside the body, not inside?
     
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  15. emetib47

    emetib47 New Member

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    i watched the video, and it did change my point of view. i used to think that the woman should just get an abortion if she wanted one but now i think that if she just wants one because she made a mistake she doesn't have the right to an abortion. if i don't pay my bills i have to pay the price. not that it's the same thing but, there are adoption centres and people that are willing to adopt. although i also think that there are some sever cases where abortion should be leagal like in the cases of incest, rape, major birth defects (such as a part of the brain missing... it does happen), and in the cases where the mother cannot live through the pregnancy.


    the child does depend on the mother to contain it while in the womb as do all mamals. but does that make them not alive not? as soon as the child has brain waves it is alive even if it needs the mother for protection against the odds. a new born also need attention and cannot take care of itself. so in conclusion abortion should not be illegal it should be screaned more closely so that you don't just get people who cannot handel their mistakes getting an abortion.
     
  16. Ðanisty

    Ðanisty Well-Known Member

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    What if it's not a mistake? What if the mother not only didn't intend to get pregnant, but intended not to get pregnant? What if she used birth control?
     
  17. Joe bag of doughnuts

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    Why is it always pro-life or pro-choice? I'm pro-choice who chose life.
     
  18. Buttercup

    Buttercup Veteran Member

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    This won't be a surprise to hardly anyone....Pro Life.

    Having a baby is not the worst thing in the world to happen to someone. Most people who have sex know where babies come from. Before you have sex make sure you don't make a baby. It's called being responsible. If you're old enough to have sex, do it responsibly.
     
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  19. emetib47

    emetib47 New Member

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    okay so what you are getting at is what if a mother uses birth control but still winds up pregnant right? i would say that it would be a mothers choice. by mistake i think you get what i mean. what i was trying to say and i see i didn't word it well and i apologize for that is basicaly i don't think that abortion should be used as a type of birth control because generaly i think that is wrong. i know that i didn't tape into the cases where birth control is used but well life happens. i would leave it up to the woman then. she didn't exactly not use protection. she had every intention of not getting pregnant in the first place. then her choice. same goes for the other sever cases. generaly i am pro-choice i just don't believe that abortion should be used as birth control for the careless aka no intention of using protection in any form.
     
  20. Ceridwen018

    Ceridwen018 Well-Known Member

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    Wow, this thread is so old that I've since changed my position on abortion. I voted that i think abortion should only be permitted in special cases such as rape. Now, I would vote that abortion should be allowed, but it should not be used as birth control, (and I think limits on what term it can be performed in are good too).
     
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