Thanksgiving as a day of Mourning

For parts of my childhood, I was raised by my late grandmother who had an affinity for the Native Americans and their beliefs. This thanksgiving, I found myself thinking about her, and the things about them she taught me.

This lead me to come across what some Natives had to say about Thanksgiving;

Why Thanksgiving Is A 'National Day Of Mourning' For Some Americans | HuffPost

“Some would say, ‘Why be so dark about it?’ Well, it’s real, it’s truthful, it was a holocaust, and that holocaust must be shared and communicated so that we ensure that mankind doesn’t do that to each other again,” Cromwell said. “We know this world is made up of travesty and tragedy. We also know that this world is made of a lot of goodness and hope and honesty and integrity.”

.A video as well:


Edit (forgot this part):

I should also mention that I was engaged to a woman who was part native american too at one point and was familiar enough with her roots that she could speak Navajo fluently, and she wasn't quite a fan of thanksgiving either and she was also an influence on how I started to see the holiday. Similar I'm friends with a Native American who brought it up recently as well. So me talking about this, isn't something I do to be antithetical to the status quo (unlike some might assume).

Also, a link I forgot (I wanted to give two viewpoints): Do American Indians celebrate Thanksgiving?

OK, but at least buy turkey. When else are you going to get it at such nice prices?

I should also mention that I was engaged to a woman who was part native american too at one point and was familiar enough with her roots that she could speak Navajo fluently, and she wasn't quite a fan of thanksgiving either and she was also an influence on how I started to see the holiday. Similar I'm friends with a Native American who brought it up recently as well. So me talking about this, isn't something I do to be antithetical to the status quo (unlike some might assume).

Also, a link I forgot (I wanted to give two viewpoints): Do American Indians celebrate Thanksgiving?

Tumah said:

OK, but at least buy turkey. When else are you going to get it at such nice prices?

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You could show a little more respect.

Kapalika said:

Cromwell said. “We know this world is made up of travesty and tragedy. We also know that this world is made of a lot of goodness and hope and honesty and integrity.”

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http://www.latimes.com/opinion/op-ed/la-oe-perez-native-american-indians-trump-20170807-story.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/30/opinion/candidate-obama-kept-his-promise-to-native-americans.html

Elliott5779 said:

You could show a little more respect.

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Yeah, you're right.

Im not American so Thanksgiving is quite meaningless to me. I do feel for the native Americans though and am reminded of an english tradition.

November 5th is Guy Fawkes night. He was a catholic fighting for catholic equality who, in the early 1600s was caught trying to blow up the seat of uk government, tried and burned at the stake.

The evening is celebrated all over England with fireworks and huge bonfires with an effigy of Guy burning on top.

Commonly know as Guy Fawkes night, otherwise known as burn a catholic night.

I wonder if native Americans have their own name for Thanksgiving?

During the first year the Pilgrims attempted to form a socialist commune, where everyone worked for the collective. That social experiment did not work out very well, since they almost starved that first year. The following year they decided to be more capitalistic and allow people to work for themselves. The result was a large increase in productivity leading to a bounty. This was the context of the first Thanksgiving. They had not only survived but where now thriving.

The Pilgrims, as the name implies, were spiritual people who were friendly with the local Indians. The local Indians were friendly back and taught the Pilgrims skills needed to thrive in New England.

What really caused problems for the native Americans, was too much immigration, and the need for the fast growing population to expand into more and more Indian lands. Indian resources became overwhelmed leading to many problems for the indigenous people.

wellwisher said:

During the first year the Pilgrims attempted to form a socialist commune, where everyone worked for the collective. That social experiment did not work out very well, since they almost starved that first year. The following year they decided to be more capitalistic and allow people to work for themselves. The result was a large increase in productivity leading to a bounty. This was the context of the first Thanksgiving. They had not only survived but where now thriving.

The Pilgrims, as the name implies, were spiritual people who were friendly with the local Indians. The local Indians were friendly back and taught the Pilgrims skills needed to thrive in New England.

What really caused problems for the native Americans, was too much immigration, and the need for the fast growing population to expand into more and more Indian lands. Indian resources became overwhelmed leading to many problems for the indigenous people.

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None of this has any relationship to history or reality it's just a bunch of whitewashing. Did you even read any of the two articles or watch the video before regurgitating those narratives?

Tumah said:

Yeah, you're right.

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You're infringing upon my territory there, bub.
Endless mourning seems unproductive.
I'm having turkey with stuffing.
That's what the holiday is all about.

If we went back to the origins of many holidays, we probably wouldn't celebrate them.

I suppose my point is while it's valuable to understand history, there is really no point in shaming people for celebrating something that is tradition and in their culture. Can't we just live, love, and be happy?

Kapalika said:

For parts of my childhood, I was raised by my late grandmother who had an affinity for the Native Americans and their beliefs. This thanksgiving, I found myself thinking about her, and the things about them she taught me.

This lead me to come across what some Natives had to say about Thanksgiving;

Why Thanksgiving Is A 'National Day Of Mourning' For Some Americans | HuffPost

“Some would say, ‘Why be so dark about it?’ Well, it’s real, it’s truthful, it was a holocaust, and that holocaust must be shared and communicated so that we ensure that mankind doesn’t do that to each other again,” Cromwell said. “We know this world is made up of travesty and tragedy. We also know that this world is made of a lot of goodness and hope and honesty and integrity.”

.A video as well:

Edit (forgot this part):

I should also mention that I was engaged to a woman who was part native american too at one point and was familiar enough with her roots that she could speak Navajo fluently, and she wasn't quite a fan of thanksgiving either and she was also an influence on how I started to see the holiday. Similar I'm friends with a Native American who brought it up recently as well. So me talking about this, isn't something I do to be antithetical to the status quo (unlike some might assume).

Also, a link I forgot (I wanted to give two viewpoints): Do American Indians celebrate Thanksgiving?

Click to expand...

Nice to have this perspective but why have this perspective on this day? This very land belonged to the Native Americans and the very things you enjoyed were built by African slaves along with Chinese and Irish immigrants. I mean why choose to reflect on one day? I mean I just find it interesting people choose a day when you have an entire history I think that is what is important. At least Native Americans have a culture to reflect on, mines was robbed of theirs.

The meaning of a holiday often changes over time. Christmas sure has. So has Columbus Day. I think Thanksgiving has too.

Christmas has become something resembling a potlatch. Columbus Day is becoming a day of mourning. And Thanksgiving? Not quite sure, but I don't think it has much to do with the Puritans or with immigration to the Americas anymore.

Tumah said:

Yeah, you're right.

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You could have also been taller...oy vey...

Kapalika said:

For parts of my childhood, I was raised by my late grandmother who had an affinity for the Native Americans and their beliefs. This thanksgiving, I found myself thinking about her, and the things about them she taught me.

This lead me to come across what some Natives had to say about Thanksgiving;

Why Thanksgiving Is A 'National Day Of Mourning' For Some Americans | HuffPost

“Some would say, ‘Why be so dark about it?’ Well, it’s real, it’s truthful, it was a holocaust, and that holocaust must be shared and communicated so that we ensure that mankind doesn’t do that to each other again,” Cromwell said. “We know this world is made up of travesty and tragedy. We also know that this world is made of a lot of goodness and hope and honesty and integrity.”

.A video as well:

Edit (forgot this part):

I should also mention that I was engaged to a woman who was part native american too at one point and was familiar enough with her roots that she could speak Navajo fluently, and she wasn't quite a fan of thanksgiving either and she was also an influence on how I started to see the holiday. Similar I'm friends with a Native American who brought it up recently as well. So me talking about this, isn't something I do to be antithetical to the status quo (unlike some might assume).

Also, a link I forgot (I wanted to give two viewpoints): Do American Indians celebrate Thanksgiving?

Click to expand...

My family escaped Ireland during the spud thingy. We never owned even one native american.

Epic Beard Man said:

Nice to have this perspective but why have this perspective on this day? This very land belonged to the Native Americans and the very things you enjoyed were built by African slaves along with Chinese and Irish immigrants. I mean why choose to reflect on one day? I mean I just find it interesting people choose a day when you have an entire history I think that is what is important. At least Native Americans have a culture to reflect on, mines was robbed of theirs.

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Your beef should be with the Dutch slavers and the other tribes of Africans. If your ancestor was one step faster than those guys 400 or so years ago, you also could be trying to survive in the squalor of some God forsaken third world country.

BSM1 said:

My family escaped Ireland during the spud thingy. We never owned even one native american.




Your beef should be with the Dutch slavers and the other tribes of Africans. If your ancestor was one step faster than those guys 400 or so years ago, you also could be trying to survive in the squalor of some God forsaken third world country.

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God you're getting increasingly annoying. I'll fix that problem.

Epic Beard Man said:

Nice to have this perspective but why have this perspective on this day? This very land belonged to the Native Americans and the very things you enjoyed were built by African slaves along with Chinese and Irish immigrants. I mean why choose to reflect on one day? I mean I just find it interesting people choose a day when you have an entire history I think that is what is important. At least Native Americans have a culture to reflect on, mines was robbed of theirs.

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Because of her grandmother.

Kapalika said:

For parts of my childhood, I was raised by my late grandmother who had an affinity for the Native Americans and their beliefs. This thanksgiving, I found myself thinking about her, and the things about them she taught me.

This lead me to come across what some Natives had to say about Thanksgiving;

Why Thanksgiving Is A 'National Day Of Mourning' For Some Americans | HuffPost

“Some would say, ‘Why be so dark about it?’ Well, it’s real, it’s truthful, it was a holocaust, and that holocaust must be shared and communicated so that we ensure that mankind doesn’t do that to each other again,” Cromwell said. “We know this world is made up of travesty and tragedy. We also know that this world is made of a lot of goodness and hope and honesty and integrity.”

.A video as well:

Edit (forgot this part):

I should also mention that I was engaged to a woman who was part native american too at one point and was familiar enough with her roots that she could speak Navajo fluently, and she wasn't quite a fan of thanksgiving either and she was also an influence on how I started to see the holiday. Similar I'm friends with a Native American who brought it up recently as well. So me talking about this, isn't something I do to be antithetical to the status quo (unlike some might assume).

Also, a link I forgot (I wanted to give two viewpoints): Do American Indians celebrate Thanksgiving?

Click to expand...

I'm not native American (cherokee) by culture just blood but, as an African american we have a lot of relations with native Americans. IndiVisible - African-Native American Lives in the Americas We share a lot of similar sentiments. Not many African Americans know the influence of and suffering from eureopean and put into one category even though our cultures are completely different.

I used to go to POW WOWS and I think I went to one on Columbus Day. The US. Government were their uniforms and embedded their cultural celebrations with natives who lived in the government funded reservation property. The sadness on people's faces as they sold their jewelry was, well, I can't think of the right word.

One chief at another event mentioned why do white people think they are part native American. We live in poor secondhand housing. We depend on the whites to take care if our family. He explained the only way one can be native American is to go to the tribe they are affiliated with. They need to take a blood test to show relationship on the mothers side. If it's X percent and Y many generations back, one is technically rather than culturally native American. Why, he said, people want to spend money on this he didn't know.

Other times we went to a PW and one resident looked at us with so much gratefulness that she saw someone who wasnt white and who have been through similar experiences...

On that note, sorry for the blab, I don't understand why many of us celebrate Thanksgiving. Most African Americans grown up "white" so we are seperates from our cultures. It's very said. I read your articles and video. Nice post.

Kapalika said:

For parts of my childhood, I was raised by my late grandmother who had an affinity for the Native Americans and their beliefs. This thanksgiving, I found myself thinking about her, and the things about them she taught me.

This lead me to come across what some Natives had to say about Thanksgiving;

Why Thanksgiving Is A 'National Day Of Mourning' For Some Americans | HuffPost

“Some would say, ‘Why be so dark about it?’ Well, it’s real, it’s truthful, it was a holocaust, and that holocaust must be shared and communicated so that we ensure that mankind doesn’t do that to each other again,” Cromwell said. “We know this world is made up of travesty and tragedy. We also know that this world is made of a lot of goodness and hope and honesty and integrity.”

.A video as well:

Edit (forgot this part):

I should also mention that I was engaged to a woman who was part native american too at one point and was familiar enough with her roots that she could speak Navajo fluently, and she wasn't quite a fan of thanksgiving either and she was also an influence on how I started to see the holiday. Similar I'm friends with a Native American who brought it up recently as well. So me talking about this, isn't something I do to be antithetical to the status quo (unlike some might assume).

Also, a link I forgot (I wanted to give two viewpoints): Do American Indians celebrate Thanksgiving?

Click to expand...

I'm not native American (cherokee) by culture just blood but, as an African american we have a lot of relations with native Americans. IndiVisible - African-Native American Lives in the Americas We share a lot of similar sentiments. Not many African Americans know the influence of and suffering from eureopean and put into one category even though our cultures are completely different.

I used to go to POW WOWS and I think I went to one on Columbus Day. The US. Government were their uniforms and embedded their cultural celebrations with natives who lived in the government funded reservation property. The sadness on people's faces as they sold their jewelry was, well, I can't think of the right word.

One chief at another event mentioned why do white people think they are part native American. We live in poor secondhand housing. We depend on the whites to take care if our family. He explained the only way one can be native American is to go to the tribe they are affiliated with. They need to take a blood test to show relationship on the mothers side. If it's X percent and Y many generations back, one is technically rather than culturally native American. Why, he said, people want to spend money on this he didn't know.

Other times we went to a PW and one resident looked at us with so much gratefulness that she say someone who were not white and have been through similar experiences...

On that note, sorry for the blab, I don't understand why many of us celebrate Thanksgiving. Most African Americans grown up "white" so we are seperated from nor welcomed back into our cultures. It's very sad. I read your articles and video. Nice post.

Kapalika said:

For parts of my childhood, I was raised by my late grandmother who had an affinity for the Native Americans and their beliefs. This thanksgiving, I found myself thinking about her, and the things about them she taught me.

This lead me to come across what some Natives had to say about Thanksgiving;

Why Thanksgiving Is A 'National Day Of Mourning' For Some Americans | HuffPost

“Some would say, ‘Why be so dark about it?’ Well, it’s real, it’s truthful, it was a holocaust, and that holocaust must be shared and communicated so that we ensure that mankind doesn’t do that to each other again,” Cromwell said. “We know this world is made up of travesty and tragedy. We also know that this world is made of a lot of goodness and hope and honesty and integrity.”

.A video as well:

Edit (forgot this part):

I should also mention that I was engaged to a woman who was part native american too at one point and was familiar enough with her roots that she could speak Navajo fluently, and she wasn't quite a fan of thanksgiving either and she was also an influence on how I started to see the holiday. Similar I'm friends with a Native American who brought it up recently as well. So me talking about this, isn't something I do to be antithetical to the status quo (unlike some might assume).

Also, a link I forgot (I wanted to give two viewpoints): Do American Indians celebrate Thanksgiving?

Click to expand...

i'm not condoning genocide in any form but native americans were not all pacifists. native americans themselves practiced a harvest festival. we are doomed to repeat history if we don't recall it and learn from it.


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