This thread has been split off from my other thread "Catholicism =/= Roman", with Deeje's permission.
Following the example of Jesus is how it happened. Jesus often went out alone or in the wilderness to pray (Luke 9:18, John 6:15, Luke 9:28). Many of the prophets also went out into the wilderness to pray--I'm sure you know the story of St. Elijah on the mountain in 1 Kings 19. Vows of silence is a story that I have no idea how it got started, but it was only ever a thing in the West as far as I'm aware.
The point of being a monastic is following Jesus' words to the letter: Selling all that you have, taking up your cross and following Him. The man who made monasticism the phenomenon that it is, St. Antony the Great, heard these words in the Gospel one Sunday, and without a moment's hesitation he sold his estate which he had inherited from his parents, made sure that his sister was well-supported, gave the rest of the money to the poor, and went out into the wilderness to engage in the struggle against his passions. The point of being a monk or a nun isn't to shut yourself off forever from the world, but to dedicate your entire life to God. St. Seraphim of Sarov once famously said, "If you acquire a spirit of peace, a thousand around you will be saved." The point of being a monastic is to mortify your passions and to give your entire being to God, so that He can use you as He sees fit. Monasteries are a refuge from the world, where the faithful can go to disconnect from everything, be with God and find useful spiritual counsel from the monastics living there. Monks and abbots will sometimes even try to help you find a good person to begin a relationship with!
Actually, it happened in the reverse of what you said. First you had bishops, or episkopoi, who were responsible for the liturgical meetings of the early Church, and for celebrating the Lord's Supper, which happened on the first day of the week (Acts 20:27). The episkopoi and presbyteroi were also responsible for administrative decisions, such as the Council of Acts in Acts 15, or sending out missionaries (Acts 11:22-30) Overtime as Christianity grew and the number of congregations increased, it became impossible for the bishop to visit them all, and so presbyteroi became distinct from the office of episkopos. These presbyteroi were appointed to celebrate the Lord's Supper in place of the bishop. In the beginning, there was no real delineation between a presbyteros and an episkopos.
And there is always more work to be done to help the poor. As Jesus said, "The poor you will have with you always."
State sponsorship of the Church. Which, yes, has led to a lot of good and horrible things over the millennia.
Red symbolizes the passion and humanity of Jesus. Purple is associated with repentance; it is a sign that we should be focusing on the Kingdom of God. Specifically in the Orthodox Church, red is the color of vestments worn on Pentecost, symbolizing the descent of the Holy Spirit in tongues of fire.
And if you're seriously arguing that the Catholic Church is Babylon the Great because people wear red and purple, I hope to not find either of these colors among your wardrobe.
There is a difference between the priesthood of all believers, as the Lutherans put it, and the liturgical priesthood which has been established since the Apostles first began appointing presbyteroi. You also are conveniently ignoring the fact that episkopos means "overseer".
Consider the liturgical formula for the Words of Institution found in 1 Corinthians 11:23-27. Also consider Justin Martyr's account of the Christian Liturgy in chapters 65-67 of his First Apology, written in 150 AD.
Also, note St. Ignatius of Antioch's words of admonition to the Smyrnaean Church around 105 AD:
See that ye all follow the bishop, even as Jesus Christ does the Father, and the presbytery as ye would the apostles; and reverence the deacons, as being the institution of God. Let no man do anything connected with the Church without the bishop. Let that be deemed a proper Eucharist, which is [administered] either by the bishop, or by one to whom he has entrusted it. Wherever the bishop shall appear, there let the multitude [of the people] also be; even as, wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church. It is not lawful without the bishop either to baptize or to celebrate a love-feast; but whatsoever he shall approve of, that is also pleasing to God, so that everything that is done may be secure and valid.
It is additionally worth noting that St. Ignatius of Antioch was the third bishop of Antioch, with Peter being the first and Evodius being the second. St. Ignatius' writings were later gathered up by St. Polycarp of Smyrna, who was a personal disciple of St. John.
Can I ask where the idea of a monastic existence is even hinted at in the Christian scriptures? It seems to me that being cloistered away in a monastery, taking vows of silence, etc is completely contrary to everything Jesus taught. He wanted his disciples to be evangelists....preachers of God's kingdom. (Matthew 28:19-20; Matthew 24:14)
Following the example of Jesus is how it happened. Jesus often went out alone or in the wilderness to pray (Luke 9:18, John 6:15, Luke 9:28). Many of the prophets also went out into the wilderness to pray--I'm sure you know the story of St. Elijah on the mountain in 1 Kings 19. Vows of silence is a story that I have no idea how it got started, but it was only ever a thing in the West as far as I'm aware.
The point of being a monastic is following Jesus' words to the letter: Selling all that you have, taking up your cross and following Him. The man who made monasticism the phenomenon that it is, St. Antony the Great, heard these words in the Gospel one Sunday, and without a moment's hesitation he sold his estate which he had inherited from his parents, made sure that his sister was well-supported, gave the rest of the money to the poor, and went out into the wilderness to engage in the struggle against his passions. The point of being a monk or a nun isn't to shut yourself off forever from the world, but to dedicate your entire life to God. St. Seraphim of Sarov once famously said, "If you acquire a spirit of peace, a thousand around you will be saved." The point of being a monastic is to mortify your passions and to give your entire being to God, so that He can use you as He sees fit. Monasteries are a refuge from the world, where the faithful can go to disconnect from everything, be with God and find useful spiritual counsel from the monastics living there. Monks and abbots will sometimes even try to help you find a good person to begin a relationship with!
Also contrary is the present role of a bishop. Originally, it was nothing close to what it has become in Christendom. How did this happen? After Christ’s death his disciples organized themselves into congregations, many of which met in private homes. (Philemon 2) For decades these congregations were cared for by spiritually “older men.” (Acts 20:17, 28; Hebrews 13:17)
After the death of the apostles, however, there was a falling away from true Christianity. (Acts 20:29, 30) In time, a number of elders elevated themselves above the others and became viewed as bishops having oversight of a number of congregations—something Jesus had warned against. (Matthew 23:9-12)
Actually, it happened in the reverse of what you said. First you had bishops, or episkopoi, who were responsible for the liturgical meetings of the early Church, and for celebrating the Lord's Supper, which happened on the first day of the week (Acts 20:27). The episkopoi and presbyteroi were also responsible for administrative decisions, such as the Council of Acts in Acts 15, or sending out missionaries (Acts 11:22-30) Overtime as Christianity grew and the number of congregations increased, it became impossible for the bishop to visit them all, and so presbyteroi became distinct from the office of episkopos. These presbyteroi were appointed to celebrate the Lord's Supper in place of the bishop. In the beginning, there was no real delineation between a presbyteros and an episkopos.
And bishops were principally found in cities, which acted as convenient hubs for Christians around the region. Also given the larger populations of cities, it became necessary to have larger churches to accommodate more people. The Greek word for "church", as I trust you know, is ekklesia, or gathering. Calling the building where everyone gathers "the gathering" makes a lot of sense.The word “church,” which originally applied to Christians themselves, was then also applied to their place of worship—the building itself. It wasn’t long before some bishops sought to have churches that befitted their rank. A new term was thus coined to describe the bishop’s church—the cathedral.
This term comes from the Greek word kathedra, meaning “seat.” The cathedral was the bishop’s throne, the symbol of his temporal power. From his cathedral the bishop presided over a jurisdiction, the bishopric.
We can see in many nations the degree of importance placed on the building that housed the bishop's throne. These very expensive and impressive buildings were constructed whilst many in their bishopric were living in extreme poverty. There are still beggars on the steps of the Vatican.
And there is always more work to be done to help the poor. As Jesus said, "The poor you will have with you always."
You cannot possibly prove a "great apostasy" where every single Christian fell away and the true church ceased to exist for 1800 years until a bunch of Americans with no connection to the historical, intellectual, philosophical, linguistic connection to first-century Christianity began interpreting the Bible better than the Christians to whom these books were addressed, to the point of knowing Greek grammar better than native speakers.What "the church" became after the death of the apostles was foretold.....the great apostasy, I believe, is clearly evident. But it took place so long ago, most people are unaware that the Christianity they practice today bears little resemblance to the original.
How did we go from these humble beginnings......to this?
State sponsorship of the Church. Which, yes, has led to a lot of good and horrible things over the millennia.
And why is it that the colors associated with "Babylon the great" (the devil's world empire of false worship) are purple and scarlet? (Revelation 17:3-5) These are the colors of royalty, not servants. This prostitute "queen" sits on a scarlet-colored beast, ruling over the kings of the earth, having immoral relations with them. This is spiritual immorality....exerting influence over things that should be none of her business given who is running the show. (1 John 5:19 John 15:18-21)
Red symbolizes the passion and humanity of Jesus. Purple is associated with repentance; it is a sign that we should be focusing on the Kingdom of God. Specifically in the Orthodox Church, red is the color of vestments worn on Pentecost, symbolizing the descent of the Holy Spirit in tongues of fire.
And if you're seriously arguing that the Catholic Church is Babylon the Great because people wear red and purple, I hope to not find either of these colors among your wardrobe.
The Greek pre·sbyʹte·ros is translated “elder” when it refers to those responsible for taking the lead in the congregation.
But there were no earthly priests in Christianity. Elders took the lead in the congregations.
Since the Jews expected God's kingdom to be established on earth, they saw the priesthood as something that was an extension of what they already had with an earthly Temple and priesthood, but for Christians, the promise of "becoming" priests was yet future.
There is a difference between the priesthood of all believers, as the Lutherans put it, and the liturgical priesthood which has been established since the Apostles first began appointing presbyteroi. You also are conveniently ignoring the fact that episkopos means "overseer".
Consider the liturgical formula for the Words of Institution found in 1 Corinthians 11:23-27. Also consider Justin Martyr's account of the Christian Liturgy in chapters 65-67 of his First Apology, written in 150 AD.
Also, note St. Ignatius of Antioch's words of admonition to the Smyrnaean Church around 105 AD:
See that ye all follow the bishop, even as Jesus Christ does the Father, and the presbytery as ye would the apostles; and reverence the deacons, as being the institution of God. Let no man do anything connected with the Church without the bishop. Let that be deemed a proper Eucharist, which is [administered] either by the bishop, or by one to whom he has entrusted it. Wherever the bishop shall appear, there let the multitude [of the people] also be; even as, wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church. It is not lawful without the bishop either to baptize or to celebrate a love-feast; but whatsoever he shall approve of, that is also pleasing to God, so that everything that is done may be secure and valid.
It is additionally worth noting that St. Ignatius of Antioch was the third bishop of Antioch, with Peter being the first and Evodius being the second. St. Ignatius' writings were later gathered up by St. Polycarp of Smyrna, who was a personal disciple of St. John.
The liturgical formula at 1 Corinthians 11 does. According to St. Paul's own words in verse 26, "For as often as you eat this bread and drink this cup, you proclaim the Lord’s death till He comes."Do all Scriptural references to “breaking of bread” indicate that Christ’s death was being commemorated? (Acts 2:42, 46; 20:7, JB)
The Pope only got that title after the people of Rome called him that as a title of endearment for so long (in Latin it is literally "Papa") that it just stuck.I have heard the Pope called "Holy Father" which is the sense that Jesus told us not to use. Being 'like a father figure' to someone is not the same as setting yourself up with a title that makes you sound more like God than his servant.
Yes, and you don't think that priests aren't father figures to the parish, especially in a time where EVERY Christian was a convert to Christianity either from paganism or Judaism? Priests very much were and are father figures, which is why nowadays they have to move around every six to twelve years, sometimes more often, so cults of personality don't arise.Timothy was a 'fatherless boy' because his fleshly father was an unbelieving Greek. Paul was a true father figure to him.