Do you believe it is possible to experience a state of pure awareness?

Valjean · Dec 20, 2014

Gambit said:
Have you personally experienced this?

Yes, temporarily. Many people have. But remembering anything but a minute impression of the experience when back in waking-state, coupled with a language without the capacity to describe it, makes the experience essentially ineffable.

Gambit said:
That's a pretty extraordinary claim. Because it would imply nothing short of "God-consciousness." (Only God can experience all experiences.)

Why extraordinary? This is the goal, after all, of the "Eastern" religions. It's common enough that Huxley described it as "Perennial Philosophy."

I would note, though, that "God Consciousness," whilst a real thing, is not the ultimate state of consciousness you're asking about.
God is a thing, and God's usually thought of as different from the other things He created, implying a duality, not the Unity you ask about.

God is just one step in a hierarchy of consciousnesses.Mystics seek to transcend God.

YmirGF · Dec 20, 2014

FunctionalAthiest said:
In that case I'll try to work through the thought with very old experiences as my background. I found it difficult, though not impossible, to achieve a state of consciousness void of all externals. This state was not possible to maintain more than 5 or 10 minutes. I don't believe i ever achieved a state where I was no longer aware of the distinction between the self and the emptiness. Yet there are two states that followed. First, a state of almost unconsciousness where the awareness itself seemed to become something more primal. So while the nothing and the self no longer seemed to be separate, there really didn't seem to awareness, so much as sensation, though I was in some sense aware. Makes no sense I guess after writing it. Second, is the state in which the self, and all reality, flood back into the emptiness, like air flooding into an opened vacuum. Here the self and the sum of reality become inseparable, and at the same time you are beside yourself. This is literally ecstasy, or standing beside one's self.

I quite like this, though it is true that I would not express it all quite this way. Meditation helps to focus on this "state" and it isn't hard to experience once you have the hang of it. This is also why I said that Gambit seemed to be working from a very limited sense of self. For me, the experience expanded my sense of being/self immeasurably. I do not mean this in the conventional egocentric sense, but rather, in a sense of an incredibly rich civilization of the psyche which is multidimensional in nature.

For the record, in the past I've referred to this "pure consciousness" stage as the burn period... as there is nothing other than awareness expanding ever-outwards... sort of like a sun...

YmirGF · Dec 20, 2014

Seyorni said:
I would note, though, that "God Consciousness," whilst a real thing, is not the ultimate state of consciousness you're asking about.
God is a thing, and God's usually thought of as different from the other things He created, implying a duality, not the Unity you ask about.

God is just one step in a hierarchy of consciousnesses.Mystics seek to transcend God.

Agreed. Meeting god or merging with god, or whatever one wants to call it is certainly something to shoot for. For a time, it will seem like the be all and end all. Fortunately, it's not a "last" stage, but rather, one of the first stages on an entirely new pathway.

Gambit · Dec 20, 2014

Seyorni said:
Yes, temporarily. Many people have. But remembering anything but a minute impression of the experience when back in waking-state, coupled with a language without the capacity to describe it, makes the experience essentially ineffable.

I have experienced a state of consciousness in which awareness is only aware of itself. (In fact, I experienced this state last night. I suspect that most people who practice meditation experience this state regularly). I wouldn't exactly say it is ineffable, although it may sound contradictory. There is no subject; there is no object (or, you could argue that the subject and object are one and the same, but this seems like a logical construct imposed on the experience after the fact). It is an experience of nothingness. In fact, one could argue it is indistinguishable from being unconscious. Indeed, one could argue that it is indistinguishable for experiencing the cessation of existence. But I would not characterized it as an experience of overwhelming unity. (I would characterize it as jarring - at least the first I experienced it - because it is an experience of what most people fear, namely, ceasing to exist.)

Gambit · Dec 20, 2014

FunctionalAthiest said:
Indeed. At the time my interpretation was that I was being held by the hand of god and shown all of this.

This is interesting.

FunctionalAthiest said:
I do not believe I experienced all of reality, only that I experienced the experience of all reality. I believe my experience spanned every neuron and synapse I have.

What exactly is the difference between "experiencing all of reality" and "experiencing the experience of all reality?"

Valjean · Dec 20, 2014

Gambit said:
I have experienced a state of consciousness in which awareness is only aware of itself. (In fact, I experienced this state last night. I suspect that most people who practice meditation experience this state regularly). I wouldn't exactly say it is ineffable, although it may sound contradictory. There is no subject; there is no object (or, you could argue that the subject and object are one and the same, but this seems like a logical construct imposed on the experience after the fact). It is an experience of nothingness. In fact, one could argue it is indistinguishable from being unconscious. Indeed, one could argue that it is indistinguishable for experiencing the cessation of existence. But I would not characterized it as an experience of overwhelming unity. (I would characterize it as jarring - at least the first I experienced it - because it is an experience of what most people fear, namely, ceasing to exist.)

I think I understand now, Gambit. I'm familiar with this state, and it's not what I was referring to in my statements about expanded consciousness.
You describe a sort of arrested or stilled consciousness, common in some meditative states. I was describing an expanded, cosmic consciousness.

George-ananda · Dec 20, 2014

Gambit said:
Do you believe it is possible to experience a state of pure awareness? That is, do you believe it is possible to experience a state of consciousness in which awareness is only aware of itself?

Note: I am not asking you if it is possible to experience self-awareness.

Yes, I believe it is possible. Some call it Brahman; others call it Nirvana.

Storm · Dec 20, 2014

Gambit said:
That's a pretty extraordinary claim. Because it would imply nothing short of "God-consciousness." (Only God can experience all experiences.)

I've experienced the same, and the immediate response of 'extraordinary claim' is why I don't usually advertise it anymore.

That said, it's what neurotheology* calls a peak experience, and it's a scientifically verified, distinct pattern of neural activity.

* I've heard some muddling of the term by pseudoscientific celebrities, so let me be clear. I am speaking of the specific field of neuroscience which studies the self-induced altered states of consciousness known in religious terms as mysticism. It was pioneered by Dr.s Andrew Newberg, a neuroscientist, and Eugene D'Aquili, a psychologist.

FunctionalAtheist · Dec 20, 2014

Gambit said:
This is interesting.

What exactly is the difference between "experiencing all of reality" and "experiencing the experience of all reality?"

Experiencing reality would require sensing all of reality. What I experienced was the sum of all my knowledge, thoughts, ideas, understanding of reality. I.e. I experienced a reality created within my own mind. At least that is my belief. I do not believe I actually flew from one end of the universe to the other and saw every material star in the universe. I believe I experienced a virtual reality.

I had the experience of experiencing reality, without actually experiencing reality. Does that help?

psychoslice · Dec 20, 2014

Yes it is possible, we are in awareness all the time, its just the chattering of the mind that drowns it out. This experience is our Awareness, or Enlightenment, its when we through meditation or whatever that we stumble into it, in this experience we realize that we are one with all there is. The experience isn't what is, the experience is secondary to that, but just that experience or taste is all it needs to ignite our inner being, from there we are never the same again, because we are not who we thought we were, we are all there is.

Indira · Dec 20, 2014

Gambit said:
I'm simply asking if it is possible to experience of state of consciousness in which awareness is aware of ONLY itself.

I am not able to understand that view so i would say not imo..mainly because of the terms 'state of consciousness' and 'only itself'.
What do you think and could you expand on the reasoning of that view.

Gambit · Dec 20, 2014

Seyorni said:
I think I understand now, Gambit. I'm familiar with this state, and it's not what I was referring to in my statements about expanded consciousness.
You describe a sort of arrested or stilled consciousness, common in some meditative states. I was describing an expanded, cosmic consciousness.

Have you achieved this expanded state through meditative practice?

Gambit · Dec 20, 2014

George-ananda said:
Yes, I believe it is possible. Some call it Brahman; others call it Nirvana.

I believe the state I am alluding to in the OP is known as "turiya" and/or "alaya-vijnana." (Moksha is the Hindu equivalent of the Buddhist nirvana.)

Indira · Dec 20, 2014

Storm said:
In the op. Which is why I suggested one of us misread it. No clue as to which, and perhaps neither.

At any rate, my practice includes both. Does yours as well?

I went back and read the op again and i can see what you meant.
Well..i suppose my practice does..My morning meditation is done with purifying an objective view as the focus.. fearless self examination does require isolated assessments, where as correction of wrong views is sensed as communal knowledge and guidance, because honestly i have never learned the knowledge that guides me, at least not in present memory.
In the evenings i engage loving kindness meditation and i sense that as communion of All.

Gambit · Dec 20, 2014

Storm said:
I've experienced the same, and the immediate response of 'extraordinary claim' is why I don't usually advertise it anymore.

I'm not saying that it is not possible. I just saying that it is an extraordinary claim.

I noticed on your profile that you are interested in process theology. So, let me put this in terms of Whitehead's metaphysics. Such an experience would be the equivalent of experiencing the consequent nature of God.

Indira · Dec 20, 2014

Indira said:
I am not able to understand that view so i would say not imo..mainly because of the terms 'state of consciousness' and 'only itself'.
What do you think and could you expand on the reasoning of that view.

Gambit..You answered my query in a post to another poster and i thank you. I don't analyze my meditation much as i just trust the process but i am finding the views of others fascinating. Nirvana may or may not be for the being i am..i am quite happy being of service to others and living in the state of love and compassion. Perhaps that's why this Earth is a popular place to be for some and hence the cyclic existence.

Gambit · Dec 20, 2014

FunctionalAthiest said:
Experiencing reality would require sensing all of reality. What I experienced was the sum of all my knowledge, thoughts, ideas, understanding of reality. I.e. I experienced a reality created within my own mind. At least that is my belief. I do not believe I actually flew from one end of the universe to the other and saw every material star in the universe. I believe I experienced a virtual reality.

I had the experience of experiencing reality, without actually experiencing reality. Does that help?

That sounds like you experienced something concocted by your personal unconscious (as opposed to the collective unconscious). That's a much more modest claim.

Gambit · Dec 20, 2014

Indira said:
Gambit..You answered my query in a post to another poster and i thank you. I don't analyze my meditation much as i just trust the process but i am finding the views of others fascinating. Nirvana may or may not be for the being i am..i am quite happy being of service to others and living in the state of love and compassion. Perhaps that's why this Earth is a popular place to be for some and hence the cyclic existence.

I'm of the view that nirvana and samsara are one.

FunctionalAtheist · Dec 20, 2014

Gambit said:
That sounds like you experienced something concocted by your personal unconscious (as opposed to the collective unconscious). That's a much more modest claim.

Interesting. My experience would have included both, as I said, the total of my consciousness, whether 'inherited' or individually developed. I don't see how the claim is any more modest. If I'm reading the article correctly, Jung is saying that part of each persons consciousness can't be explained by personal development, but rather by inheritance of a primordial unconsciousness. I.e. collective unconsciousness does not refer to a shared unconsciousness.

I find this a bit suspect at best. I expect what he is referring to amounts to what biologists would call instinct. Yes, inherited, part of the unconsciousness, shared by others of the species, but it develops within each individual during embryonic ontogeny. I can understand how he would think it was primordial, as it is a part of the human prior to development of the consciousness. But it is a part of individual ontogeny.

Indira · Dec 20, 2014

Gambit said:
I'm of the view that nirvana and samsara are one.

A logical assessment and a relief to those of us with no goal of destination, lol.
I can't find a hug in the icons so here's one..Hug!

Do you believe it is possible to experience a state of pure awareness?

Veteran Member

Bodhisattva in Recovery

Bodhisattva in Recovery

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Veteran Member

Advaita Vedanta, Theosophy, Spiritualism

ThrUU the Looking Glass

Hammer of Reason

Veteran Member

Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Member

Well-Known Member

Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Hammer of Reason

Member