If there is a hell, what percentage of humans should go there?

[URAVIP2ME]

Birth and death are both necessary if we are to live in a finite world. If we reproduce and don't die, eventually the world fills up with humans (and animals, but lets keep it simple) and we are all standing shoulder to shoulder on the dry land. That's obvious from a naturalistic pov, but what about Biblically?
If Adam and Eve had never "fallen" they could either have had children or not. If not, there would only have been two humans for ever, which doesn't seem to have been God's plan. If they did have children and remained immortal, we have the population problem that I outlined above. There seems therefore to have been a necessity for God to have introduced death regardless of the fall.
How does the Bible address this, if it does?

Yes, it is addressed at both Genesis 1:28 and repeated again at Genesis 9:1.
People were to only reproduce until Earth was full, til Earth was populated. Not over-full. Nor over-populated.
In other words, Earth was formed to be inhabited, Not over-inhabited - Isaiah 45:18
Once paradisical Eden was expanded and spread out world wide then reproduction would cease.
As to what is God's purpose after that remained to be seen. After all there is a whole universe out there.
Those of us who are around after the end of Jesus' coming 1,000 year reign over Earth will have all the details at that time.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

There are many parents who have more than one child and sometimes some are loving and some are not.
I met a man at a campsite and noticed how well behaved his children were and mentioned that to him.
His reply startled me because he said he also had a son in jail.
Did that make him a failure as a father

It makes him imperfect.

Is your God imperfect?

___________
We see in Scripture that God had two (2) Son/son's. One turned out well, one did not.
Jesus proved to be the Son who turned out well, and Satan proved to be the son who did not turn out well.
Jesus did Not prove their Father to be a failure.
Jesus will vindicate his Father and his Father's name will be hallowed - John 17:6; John 17:26

3 sons. The Bible also describes Adam as a son of God.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Right: so something less than full success. God's creation fails to entirely reflect what he intended for it.
If God designed and created humans knowing full well what they'd do, then of course he caused those actions.

God simply chose NOT to know our choices. Free-will choice is a free gift.
The choice is ours to repent or perish - 2nd Peter 3:9
God forces No one to repent.
However, Earth was Not formed for wicked people but for humble meek people to inherit the Earth. - Psalm 37:9-11, 38
So, if God did Not forewarn that would show a lack of success.
In the Bible we find God forewarns before action is taken.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

It makes him imperfect.
Is your God imperfect?
3 sons. The Bible also describes Adam as a son of God.

The camper person was an imperfect descendant like us from fallen father Adam Not a direct creation by God.
Yes, besides heavenly creation, Adam was an earthly creation.
Adam started out without sinfull leanings. Adam like Satan chose sin with its leanings towards wrong doing.
Righteous Jesus, on the other hand, chose to remain righteous without sin. He could do that because his Father was Not from Adam, but God.
The rest of us are from fallen father Adam and can't undo what Adam did.
This is why we needed someone who could undo the damage Satan and Adam caused.
That someone is sin-free Jesus who will do away with enemy death for us - 1st Cor. 15:24-26; Isaiah 25:8

 

[Trailblazer]

Right: so something less than full success. God's creation fails to entirely reflect what he intended for it.

God's creation did not fail, it did exactly as God intended for it to do. Some people fail, some succeed.

If God designed and created humans knowing full well what they'd do, then of course he caused those actions.

There is absolutely no logical connection between God knowing our actions and God causing our actions.
If you think there is a logical connection, please explain how knowing something is going to happen causes it to happen.

 

[YoursTrue]

Birth and death are both necessary if we are to live in a finite world. If we reproduce and don't die, eventually the world fills up with humans (and animals, but lets keep it simple) and we are all standing shoulder to shoulder on the dry land. That's obvious from a naturalistic pov, but what about Biblically?

If Adam and Eve had never "fallen" they could either have had children or not. If not, there would only have been two humans for ever, which doesn't seem to have been God's plan. If they did have children and remained immortal, we have the population problem that I outlined above. There seems therefore to have been a necessity for God to have introduced death regardless of the fall.

How does the Bible address this, if it does?

It is certainly a possibility that in a perfect world with perfect people they could agree to stop reproducing.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

It is certainly a possibility that in a perfect world with perfect people they could agree to stop reproducing.

Since it's God's purpose for people to stop reproducing when Earth is 'full' (populated, Not overly populated - Gen. 1:28) then reproducing would stop.
So, to me it could seem that God's purpose was to end getting pregnant, with the agreement also being on God's part for planet Earth's purpose.
Thus, after the end of Jesus' 1,000-year reign over Earth is over perfected mankind will have the details.
For now, it would be good to be counted as one of the figurative 'sheep' at Jesus' coming Glory Time of separation - Matt. 25:37

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

God simply chose NOT to know our choices.

So God couldn't be bothered to figure out whether his creation would work as intended?

You're still not making your God sound exactly competent.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

So God couldn't be bothered to figure out whether his creation would work as intended?
You're still not making your God sound exactly competent.

The gift of free-willed choices is just as God has gifted up. God forces No one to worship him.
Jesus forewarned that he and his followers would be hated. That does Not make God incompetent, but makes the haters as Not being competent.
And Jesus said as to who to worship at John 4:23-24

 

[icehorse]

Depends (as usual), on your definition of hell..

And based on what the definition probably is, I'd say no one deserves eternal torment in fire, not even hitler.

 

[YoursTrue]

Since it's God's purpose for people to stop reproducing when Earth is 'full' (populated, Not overly populated - Gen. 1:28) then reproducing would stop.
So, to me it could seem that God's purpose was to end getting pregnant, with the agreement also being on God's part for planet Earth's purpose.
Thus, after the end of Jesus' 1,000-year reign over Earth is over perfected mankind will have the details.
For now, it would be good to be counted as one of the figurative 'sheep' at Jesus' coming Glory Time of separation - Matt. 25:37

Yes. And if people are not "sheeplike" now -- then what happens? It's called, I think, separating the sheep from the goats. We shall see what happens.

 

[YoursTrue]

Depends (as usual), on your definition of hell..

And based on what the definition probably is, I'd say no one deserves eternal torment in fire, not even hitler.

That is true. Hitler may not be resurrected, we may see if he is or is not, but you're right, God did not tell Adam or Eve that they would be tortured forever. He simply said, they will die. Go back to the dust. He never said He would take their souls somewhere else and have them 'live' there wherever...If anyone, no matter how bad they are, is not given the opportunity for everlasting life, they will not suffer; they will not know about it. They'll be dead. So you bring out a good point.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

The gift of free-willed choices is just as God has gifted up. God forces No one to worship him.
Jesus forewarned that he and his followers would be hated. That does Not make God incompetent, but makes the haters as Not being competent.
And Jesus said as to who to worship at John 4:23-24

A competent creator does not create incompetent creations. The quality of the creation reflects on the creator.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

God's creation did not fail, it did exactly as God intended for it to do. Some people fail, some succeed.

There is absolutely no logical connection between God knowing our actions and God causing our actions.
If you think there is a logical connection, please explain how knowing something is going to happen causes it to happen.

I already did.

 

[dybmh]

A competent creator does not create incompetent creations. The quality of the creation reflects on the creator.

It really depends on what's valued. If improvement is valued, then creating a deeply flawed being and giving it means to improve does not reflect poorly on the creator. To the contrary, it shows tremendous skill.

Have you ever seen a puzzle box? If not, just consider a door. What takes more skill, making a door, or making a door with a lock and a key? What about making multiple locks with multiple keys? Or perhaps multiple locks with multiple keys and one master key that fits every door?

So, creating something perfect, something easy, something uniform takes some skill. But creating diverse flaws and the remedy takes much more skill and talent. It's the difference between making a box, and making a puzzle. Making a door compared to making a lock. Writing a biography compared to writing a mystery.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

It really depends on what's valued. If improvement is valued, then creating a deeply flawed being and giving it means to improve does not reflect poorly on the creator. To the contrary, it shows tremendous skill.

Have you ever seen a puzzle box? If not, just consider a door. What takes more skill, making a door, or making a door with a lock and a key? What about making multiple locks with multiple keys? Or perhaps multiple locks with multiple keys and one master key that fits every door?

So, creating something perfect, something easy, something uniform takes some skill. But creating diverse flaws and the remedy takes much more skill and talent. It's the difference between making a box, and making a puzzle. Making a door compared to making a lock. Writing a biography compared to writing a mystery.

If God expresses dissatisfaction with his creations - e.g. by sending them to Hell or excluding them from Heaven, then this is a sign that the creation failed to meet God's standards.

... and a creator who can't get his own creations to meet his own standards is a deficient creator.

 

[dybmh]

If God expresses dissatisfaction with his creations - e.g. by sending them to Hell or excluding them from Heaven, then this is a sign that the creation failed to meet God's standards.

... and a creator who can't get his own creations to meet his own standards is a deficient creator.

Unless that is a clue to solving to puzzle, unlocking the door, or understanding the mystery.

God can get his creations to meet his standards... it just depends on what those standards are. If the standard is improvement, then, the failure/dissaticfaction of others inspires change.

 

[Treasure Hunter]

The rebels will go there and will not seek mercy from God. Among them, the righteous will enter the Kingdom.

 

[Father Heathen]

Justice is when the punishment is proportionate to the offense, thus hell is an injustice since no offense is proportionate to eternal damnation.
If there's a god, it would be a being of pure love and pure logic, with infinite understanding and patience, thus anything devoid of reason or compassion cannot be of god, thus no eternal damnation.

 

[Father Heathen]

Most cling to the concept of hell due to an emotional need for the sadistic gratification they receive from the imagined comeuppance.