Why did God create homosexuality?

[Unveiled Artist]

Personal opinions on the matter, even from the participants themselves, can be extremely subjective, unsound or insincere - we can all talk ourselves into believing that our desires and intents are justified and valid.

The evidence that I am talking about is both the character and the lifestyle that such act elicits. The gay pride parade is a great example of extremely undignified, unbridled and brazen behaviour. Cross-dressing, and both flamboyant attire and behaviour is another example. The fact that transvestites are predominant , if not exclusive,to the homosexual community, is a testimony to the conflict and hypocrisy that is inherent in their belief system - how can one claim that it's totally acceptable for a man to sleep with a man, and yet they must either dress, or act like a woman in order to do so?

We're talking about sexual orientation, the science of it, and whether god created our hormones to jump at some groups of people and not others.

Cross-dressing, PRIDE, and transvestites have nothing to do with the science and experiences of people who experience sexual attraction from a young age and ostracized and reprimanded for it before they even reach adulthood and even before they kissed their first boyfriend or girlfriend.

But I wanted to know of scientific evidence. What you listed isn't evidence. It's (how to say) your biases against groups of people and listing these things in a negative light just confirms your biases. From observation it could be a generational gap thing. There are homosexuals who don't like PRIDE, believe in conventional marriage, and believe that homosexual means what one does not who one is attracted to. Most likely rare but I came across a few.

Without scientific evidence (de ja vu) and testimonial evidence its all opinion. In my opinion, though, a lot of what you said is based on miseducation rather than just differences in religious morals.

 

[DNB]

@DNB (If interested)

This is just from first result google search: The biological basis of human sexual orientation: is there a role for epigenetics? - PubMed

Homosexuality used to be a sin and people convicted would be convicted
The Decriminalization of Sodomy in the United States

Homosexuality used to be described as a mental illness but then was taken out of the DSM book because of evidence to the contrary search results - homosexuality mental illnesses 1960s DSM

Christians used to (and probably to some extent still do) have conversion therapies to indoctrinate people by forcing their body and mind to like other people (kind of like training a rat to change its instinct for some study or another). https://williamsinstitute.law.ucla.edu/publications/conversion-therapy-and-lgbt-youth/

It's fine to say homosexual behavior is a sin. However, when you say that attraction is distorted when the object is different than the norm it becomes more unscientific not just seen as immoral.

I noticed people change their views when they find out they are gay late in life or they shunned their child or tried to fix their child and that child no longer loves their parent and left their religion.

People may regret the way that they handled a situation irrespective of whether or not their objective, or even their intent, was valid or justified, or not. How one addresses a situation in which they disapprove of, should not determine whether or not their opinion is correct. It may have some bearing, but that requires a deeper understanding of the entire situation.

We are not assessing either the beneficial or consequential aspect of action, due to whether or not it has been the 'norm' for as long as we can remember. We determine right from wrong or what is acceptable behaviour by fundamental reasoning. When all life on this planet (worth mentioning) is engendered and subsists by the unequivocal principle of gender, we become alarmed and indignant when there are those who, first, try to bastardize this principle and two, call it normal. When a man by nature, determined by the landslide majority of the evidence around us, acts in a particular and unique way, and the same for the woman, and the fact that these distinctions are the glory of each respectively, and when combined compliment one another, we denounce any deviation from this principle.

 

[DNB]

We're talking about sexual orientation, the science of it, and whether god created our hormones to jump at some groups of people and not others.

Cross-dressing, PRIDE, and transvestites have nothing to do with the science and experiences of people who experience sexual attraction from a young age and ostracized and reprimanded for it before they even reach adulthood and even before they kissed their first boyfriend or girlfriend.

But I wanted to know of scientific evidence. What you listed isn't evidence. It's (how to say) your biases against groups of people and listing these things in a negative light just confirms your biases. From observation it could be a generational gap thing. There are homosexuals who don't like PRIDE, believe in conventional marriage, and believe that homosexual means what one does not who one is attracted to. Most likely rare but I came across a few.

Without scientific evidence (de ja vu) and testimonial evidence its all opinion. In my opinion, though, a lot of what you said is based on miseducation rather than just differences in religious morals.

There is no scientific evidence to explain why I might like red-heads, and you like blondes, get it? There is no scientific evidence that can quantify whether i will like apples or celery, who i will fall in love with, and what genre of music or movies that i may enjoy (classic rock by the way).
So, i gave you evidence that allows me to determine whether or not an act is sound or inconsequential. I use this process in all my judgement calls in life. I watched the effects of drugs on a person and concluded, whether subjectively or not, that it is not expedient for man to indulge, on any level, in such activity. Same with promiscuity, most of the tv shows, and certain attire.

So what do you want me to say, my methodology is incorrect? It's not, as long as my intent is objective and sincere, I am fully both justified and qualified to make such determinations, and it is incumbent upon me to do so,. ..as it is to you also.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

People may regret the way that they handled a situation irrespective of whether or not their objective, or even their intent, was valid or justified, or not. How one addresses a situation in which they disapprove of, should not determine whether or not their opinion is correct. It may have some bearing, but that requires a deeper understanding of the entire situation.

I don't follow this. Can you rephrase?

We are not assessing either the beneficial or consequential aspect of action, due to whether or not it has been the 'norm' for as long as we can remember. We determine right from wrong or what is acceptable behaviour by fundamental reasoning. When all life on this planet (worth mentioning) is engendered and subsists by the unequivocal principle of gender, we become alarmed and indignant when there are those who, first, try to bastardize this principle and two, call it normal. When a man by nature, determined by the landslide majority of the evidence around us, acts in a particular and unique way, and the same for the woman, and the fact that these distinctions are the glory of each respectively, and when combined compliment one another, we denounce any deviation from this principle.

The thing is, sexual attraction isn't an action. Heterosexuals can engage in same-sex sex and still be heterosexual. So, behavior is irrelevant in this since your scripture says only straights can express their love each other but gay people cannot. However, when you said you had evidence of (say?) homosexuality being distorted or so have you, that's what I wanted evidence for.

But I'm honestly not following what you're saying-your points. Can you dumb it down a bit?

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Flamboyant and effeminate behaviour, cross-dressing and transvestites for male gender humans. Butch and tom-boy behaviour for female genders. There is an extreme conflict between their physiology and their behaviour.

No doubt you are aware that a very small minority of gay people fit into those categories -- just as a very small minority of heterosexual men are rapists, and few heterosexual women are whores.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

There is no scientific evidence to explain why I might like red-heads, and you like blondes, get it? There is no scientific evidence that can quantify whether i will like apples or celery, who i will fall in love with, and what genre of music or movies that i may enjoy (classic rock by the way).

There is scientific evidence why we are attracted to others-but of course not why you're attracted to red-heads but we do have an idea of why people are attracted to other people biologically and physiologically. 13 biological factors that make you attracted to someone (quick note: I don't post links just to post them)

What you say can't compare to the studies that have proven human to human attraction, the nature of that attraction, and why/how humans develop relationships and want to engage intimately with others because of their attraction.

So, i gave you evidence that allows me to determine whether or not an act is sound or inconsequential. I use this process in all my judgement calls in life. I watched the effects of drugs on a person and concluded, whether subjectively or not, that it is not expedient for man to indulge, on any level, in such activity. Same with promiscuity, most of the tv shows, and certain attire.

It limits you to what's inside your box. It's using logical fallacies as the basis of your opinions.

For example, if you see 80% of gay people are flamboyant that shouldn't let you conclude all gay people are like that. It's a generalization. If you figure all gay people are out for sex and promiscuity, that's another generalization. A miseducation point is associating transvestites', cross-dressing to sexual orientation.

It's one thing to have the correct information and still build sound arguments of why you're against it, but its totally different when a lot of your information isn't correct and you're basing a whole class of people because of your experiences.

So what do you want me to say, my methodology is incorrect? It's not, as long as my intent is objective and sincere, I am fully both justified and qualified to make such determinations, and it is incumbent upon me to do so,. ..as it is to you also.

With religion, it just sounds like you're not familiar with sexual orientation, gender expression, promiscuity versus intimacy, and the nature of why people are attracted to each other in a more marital sense not a lustful one. Using television shows to judge a group of people is another reason I disagree with your reasoning.

A lot of people this doesn't affect their everyday life so it's all opinion. However, in discussion it's fine to disagree but in this case I don't believe you understand what homosexuality means to form a non-biased (without the television and generalization for example) opinions.

I'm just appalled.

 

[InChrist]

The Bible states that if a man lies with another man they should both be stoned to death. It's my belief that homosexuals are born that way and have no choice over who they're attracted to just like a heterosexual. If this is true why would God create homosexuals when he seems so opposed to their nature? I believe in the God of the Old Testament and believe that he is righteous but I'm confused by this. Did God create homosexuals purely to destroy them or is there something else going on? Does he want a homosexual man to be celibate or to go against his nature and procreate with a woman? Is God offering him the chance to make a huge sacrifice to the highest by denying himself? What are your thoughts?

I believe, according to the scriptures God created human beings: male and female. God didn’t create homosexuals. God did provide wise instructions for healthy sexual relations, which are to guide and override feelings.

 

[The Hammer]

Flamboyant and effeminate behaviour, cross-dressing and transvestites for male gender humans. Butch and tom-boy behaviour for female genders. There is an extreme conflict between their physiology and their behaviour.

This is cute.

 

[Kooky]

Personal opinions on the matter, even from the participants themselves, can be extremely subjective, unsound or insincere - we can all talk ourselves into believing that our desires and intents are justified and valid.

And this post is an excellent example of this.

 

[DNB]

I don't follow this. Can you rephrase?

If a father mishandled his approach to dealing with a gay son, it doesn't necessitate that either his objective or intent were wrong, but merely his tact and diplomacy.

I don't follow this. Can you rephrase?The thing is, sexual attraction isn't an action. Heterosexuals can engage in same-sex sex and still be heterosexual. So, behavior is irrelevant in this since your scripture says only straights can express their love each other but gay people cannot. However, when you said you had evidence of (say?) homosexuality being distorted or so have you, that's what I wanted evidence for.

But I'm honestly not following what you're saying-your points. Can you dumb it down a bit?

Biological evidence - gender dictates life.
Behavioral evidence - sound and mature men don't dress or act like woman..

 

[DNB]

No doubt you are aware that a very small minority of gay people fit into those categories -- just as a very small minority of heterosexual men are rapists, and few heterosexual women are whores.

A very large demography of gay people act in an antithetical way to what their gender dictates - effeminate boys, and butch girls. An extremely large, if not exclusive, contingency of cross-dressers are in the gay community.

 

[DNB]

There is scientific evidence why we are attracted to others-but of course not why you're attracted to red-heads but we do have an idea of why people are attracted to other people biologically and physiologically. 13 biological factors that make you attracted to someone (quick note: I don't post links just to post them)

What you say can't compare to the studies that have proven human to human attraction, the nature of that attraction, and why/how humans develop relationships and want to engage intimately with others because of their attraction.



It limits you to what's inside your box. It's using logical fallacies as the basis of your opinions.

For example, if you see 80% of gay people are flamboyant that shouldn't let you conclude all gay people are like that. It's a generalization. If you figure all gay people are out for sex and promiscuity, that's another generalization. A miseducation point is associating transvestites', cross-dressing to sexual orientation.

It's one thing to have the correct information and still build sound arguments of why you're against it, but its totally different when a lot of your information isn't correct and you're basing a whole class of people because of your experiences.



With religion, it just sounds like you're not familiar with sexual orientation, gender expression, promiscuity versus intimacy, and the nature of why people are attracted to each other in a more marital sense not a lustful one. Using television shows to judge a group of people is another reason I disagree with your reasoning.

A lot of people this doesn't affect their everyday life so it's all opinion. However, in discussion it's fine to disagree but in this case I don't believe you understand what homosexuality means to form a non-biased (without the television and generalization for example) opinions.

I'm just appalled.

Homosexuality is perverted, unsound and subversive, you should quite trying to make it appear normal and inconsequential.
A man has a penis, and a woman has a vagina, that should end the discussion.
Your licentious attitude and misguided reasoning reveals a lack of depth within your understanding!

 

[Koldo]

I said that within even hetero people come many vices as in deviant practices like S&M, role playing, toys, abuse, selfishness, hedonism, objectification, etc... Thus, all have to control their innate compulsions in some way or another. If a man is being sexually attracted to another man, he has to refrain from carrying out his desires and try to understand and cure the catalyst behind such impulses.

Why? What is the harm in having sex with another man?

 

[Koldo]

The topic is in the OP itself, so I think what you are trying to do is not relevant.

I am merely saying that questioning the hidden premises in the OP, as you have done, is pointless. Otherwise we might as well question all of them.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Homosexuality is perverted, unsound and subversive, you should quite trying to make it appear normal and inconsequential.
A man has a penis, and a woman has a vagina, that should end the discussion.
Your licentious attitude and misguided reasoning reveals a lack of depth within your understanding!

I am not talking about behavior. Straight people have same sex sex too. We choose who we want to go to bed with.

Sexuality does not always involve sex.

Homo/hetero/bi just refers to the sex of the other person in relation to who one is attracted to. It's a label. Nothing more.

What you're saying is not homosexuality.

 

[Aštra’el]

Men who are attracted to men are not born that way. They develop that way. Women who are attracted to women are not born that way. They develop that way.

Most humans develop an attraction to the opposite sex because it propagates the species, is culturally ingrained... and because the biological differences between man and woman naturally creates a better match than man+man or woman+woman.

I would not say “God created homosexuality”... but that humans are here, we are malleable, we have free will, and our physiology/ thoughts/ choices/ actions/ experiences shape who we are leading most people to be attracted to the opposite sex and some people to be attracted to the same sex.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

@DNB I'm actually calm and not accusative in this discussion. I just see you have the wrong definitions of homosexuality, and it's hard to discuss other views if you can't see it from a factual perspective not based on opinions.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Men who are attracted to men are not born that way. They develop that way. Women who are attracted to women are not born that way. They develop that way.

Most humans develop an attraction to the opposite sex because it propagates the species, is culturally ingrained... and because the biological differences between man and woman naturally creates a better match than man+man or woman+woman.

I would not say “God created homosexuality”... but that humans are here, we are malleable, we have free will, and our physiology/ thoughts/ choices/ actions/ experiences shape who we are leading most people to be attracted to the opposite sex and some people to be attracted to the same sex.

How?

Most gay people are raised in straight households and don't understand attraction until after puberty. No one teaches them how to "react" to people they are attracted to; that's all human nature. Most know before they even kiss their first boyfriend or girlfriend.

I would say God created you to be attracted to other people. Your hormones among other factors dictate whether that attraction is sparked to men, women, or both.

How?

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Here's an abstract on this topic:

Many people believe that sexual orientation (homosexuality vs. heterosexuality) is determined by education and social constraints. There are, however, a large number of studies indicating that prenatal factors have an important influence on this critical feature of human sexuality. Sexual orientation is a sexually differentiated trait (over 90% of men are attracted to women and vice versa). In animals and men, many sexually differentiated characteristics are organized during early life by sex steroids, and one can wonder whether the same mechanism also affects human sexual orientation. Two types of evidence support this notion. First, multiple sexually differentiated behavioral, physiological, or even morphological traits are significantly different in homosexual and heterosexual populations. Because some of these traits are known to be organized by prenatal steroids, including testosterone, these differences suggest that homosexual subjects were, on average, exposed to atypical endocrine conditions during development. Second, clinical conditions associated with significant endocrine changes during embryonic life often result in an increased incidence of homosexuality. It seems therefore that the prenatal endocrine environment has a significant influence on human sexual orientation but a large fraction of the variance in this behavioral characteristic remains unexplained to date. Genetic differences affecting behavior either in a direct manner or by changing embryonic hormone secretion or action may also be involved. How these biological prenatal factors interact with postnatal social factors to determine life-long sexual orientation remains to be determined.

Minireview: Hormones and Human Sexual Orientation, The biological basis of sexual orientation: How hormonal, genetic, and environmental factors influence to whom we are sexually attracted - ScienceDirect and Neurobiology of gender identity and sexual orientation

I get not liking the behavior, but sexual orientation not existing, being distorted, or homosexuality being taught or socially influenced just doesn't make sense to me.

 

[Truthseeker]

I don’t believe homosexuals are born that way or that God creates them to be that way. I believe that through the process of human development and life experiences, same sex attraction/homosexuality can develop in a person.

From the moment we are born, we begin bonding with the people around us. We build relationships and learn who to trust. Our thoughts, feelings, likes and dislikes develop. We have a variety of experiences from the time we are born and throughout childhood that have influenced and shaped our thoughts, feelings, and actions. It’s definitely possible that some people could develop same sex attraction at some point during their younger developing lives, or later.

God commands everyone, including homosexuals, to control their sexual impulses and live moral lives. Yes, a homosexual would need to live a celibate life or choose to marry the opposite sex. You would need to work that out with him as to which one you choose. Yes, God expects us to sacrifice, overcome, and give up whatever is in our physical natures that is keeping us from following his teachings.

I agree with especially the last part. However, there seems to a biological component as well as life experiences involved. When I think of this further I'm not sure I'm not sure your position is that it is purely experiences that cause the development of homosexuality.

Wikipedia:

Although scientists favor biological models for the cause of sexual orientation,[6] they do not believe that the development of sexual orientation is the result of any one factor. They generally believe that it is determined by a complex interplay of biological and environmental factors, and is shaped at an early age.[4][7][8] There is considerably more evidence supporting nonsocial, biological causes of sexual orientation than social ones, especially for males.[10] There is no substantive evidence which suggests parenting or early childhood experiences play a role with regard to sexual orientation.[13] Scientists do not believe that sexual orientation is a choice.

The American Academy of Pediatrics stated in Pediatrics in 2004:

There is no scientific evidence that abnormal parenting, sexual abuse, or other adverse life events influence sexual orientation. Current knowledge suggests that sexual orientation is usually established during early childhood.[6][152]

The American Psychological Association, American Psychiatric Association, and National Association of Social Workers stated in 2006:

Currently, there is no scientific consensus about the specific factors that cause an individual to become heterosexual, homosexual, or bisexual—including possible biological, psychological, or social effects of the parents' sexual orientation. However, the available evidence indicates that the vast majority of lesbian and gay adults were raised by heterosexual parents and the vast majority of children raised by lesbian and gay parents eventually grow up to be heterosexual.[4]

"Gay genes"
Main article: Gay gene
Despite numerous attempts, no "gay gene" has been identified. However, there is substantial evidence for a genetic basis of homosexuality, especially in males, based on twin studies; some association with regions of Chromosome 8, the Xq28 locus on the X chromosome, and other sites across many chromosomes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality

I believe God did create the conditions so homosexuality could exist. However, homosexual people, like everyone else, is tested by God. It's just that we are all tested in different ways.