Am I allowed to be a proud white person?

[Harel13]

You haven't said anything about anyone being rejected though.

You're absolutely right. I forgot to add the main part of the example. Here:
Edit:
So if a man from one African tribe demanded to join a different African tribe and they refused, that would be discriminatory?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Your ancestors who made your culture are your collective parents and grandparents. How can you just trash everything they gave you?

I do find that to be curious, as an Irish-American who's family hasnt been here that long. Im very aware the culture I grew up in isnt my heritage or the culture of my ancestors. And the culture I did grow up in, it rejected us when we got here, and the way it is now I have little respect for it or how it got to be that way. Its generations of Bible thumping protestants (again, not my ancestral heritage) who took Christian literalism and fundamentalism to a whole new level around the mid 19th century. We didnt have anything to do with it. It was mostly the children of German Protestants. And after I quit being Protestant, the culture I grew up in and I had a mutual rejection of eachother.
As for where Im at now, there is more influence of Hispanics and Latinos and not an ocean of white doing everything. And it's way better. Still not one of mine or my ancestors doing, but it's better than the one I left (and I fit in way better here).

 

[lewisnotmiller]

As it is known, I am from South Africa, White, Christian, 58Yo, the typical labled "White privelaged.
Throughout my whole life, I worked hard, made money, looked after my wife, children and now grand children. I perceive myself as a ethnic group called the Afrikaner, with my ancestery from 1569 when my great arrived in the Cape under Jan van Riebeeck to build a halfway station for the VOC between Holland and India. My ancestors were born, lived and died for self determination in this country where they bought land which eventually ended up as the republics of Orange Free state, Transvaal and Natal.
They NEVER took the indigenous people as slaves, and even though they did own slaves, these were people who were sent into bannishment by the Dutch government due to wars they had with nations in East Africa, India and elsewhare.
The slaves my greats did own, were set free before 1834 with the British emancipation. This was at least 30 years before the US.
As the Afrikaner lived in Africa, they were constantly attacked by the Black dictator leaders of various tribes, and thousands of peacefull white Christians died in gruesome circumstances being impaled, skinned alive, their children killed before them, women raped and eviscerated before being clubbed to death.
As the Afrikaner fought back, they always made peace treaties with the black tribes, only to be deceived and their livestock stolen, and the killing was just continued.

Eventually the Brittish sent 500 000 soldiers to our republics, and we held them at bay with only 60 000 men aged 7 to 70.
The brittish lost all their battles, and devised a plan of "scorched earth", burning all the farms, capturing all the women and children and placing them in concentration camps.

Meh, I'd quibble on how you're presenting this. The British lost battles early, brought in so many men resistance was useless, occupied Boer territories basically WITHOUT battle, and then realised the Boer were planning to continue fighting using irregular tactics. It doesn't matter too much in terms of your overall points, but I'm just getting completely allergic to binary narratives at this point.

After 1948, the Afrikaner again gained independence from Brittain, and they made laws to protect their kin.
These laws was to ensure that the Afrikaner rules their own country, and no one would take it away again.

This isn't an accurate depiction of facts. At all. It makes me wonder why you would colour things in this manner.
South Africa became self- governing in 1934, and became fully independent in 1961, following a referendum. What happened in 1948 was that the HNP won the election.

This ment that the neighbouring Black people would have their own independent lands, but the South African country would allow Black and coloured to work in the RSA.
As time progressed, the black politicians hated this country, and started to call it their land.
Everything went back to the age of burning, murdering and pillaging.
Eventually the whole world stood against these White people who was now painted as the most horrible ceatures on earth with their Apartheid laws, which was constructed to protect the White Afrikaner.

I mean...'neighbouring Black people' means other countries, I suppose, so I have very little clue what the independence of neighbouring nations has to do with South African elections. Apart from which these seems to have very little recognition of situations like Southern Rhodesia.

​

The White people did not agree with the old National Party government using illegal arrests against the Black politicians, and communist agitators, and voted to change the constitution.
We were betrayed by our leaders, and we were made second class citisens in a country stolen from us by the ANC.
Today the black politicians and communists allow open borders, looting, killing of white farmers, rape, hi jackings, and the burning of libraries, schools, and businusses.

The crime situation in South Africa, and general societal issues seems terrible.

In the mean time, my people are called rubbish and recist galore, whilst the World ignores what the Black communists are doing to this country and the Afrikaner.

I suspect there is some truth to this.

​

Now I want to know:

• Am I allowed to be White in Africa?

Yes

• An I correct to say that the very destruction we see in South Africa was the very reason why my greats constructed Apartheid?

No. I can extrapolate if you like.

• Do the Black people in Europe and US see what the Black racists can do with a great country where they made 30% unemployed and another 40% government employees, and still accuse the whites of being advantaged?

How many of South Africa's inhabitants would share your view that she has historically been a 'great country'? Which of their opinions count?

• Am I allowed to call these black people out for what they are doing, if I am allowed, is it racism? If I an mot allowed, why not?

Call out people based on their actions. White, black, purple...
The way you are doing it is to prejudge based on colour and race, and yes...that is racism.

• Am I allowed to say that evry "White Nation" on this earth became prosperous, and in Africa the Black people are incapable to achieve the same standard? If I am not allowed to say this, why not becaue it is a fact?

Is it? That is not what I would see as 'a fact'. But go for your life. Compare Botswana and Moldova for me.

Now, my last questions:
Am I allowed to be proud to be white?
Am I allowed to demand to entertain my family, friends and other Afrikaners who is white?
Am I allowed to live my social life with Whites only?
Am I allowed to teach my children to rather marry with Whites?
Am I allowed to be proud of my White children and grand children?

If the above makes me a racist, please tell me why.

Pretty simple, mate. You're judging people purely based on perception of race. Ergo : racist.
I would have thought your point is more that you feel justified in your racism, but do you honestly think you're not racist?

 

[lewisnotmiller]

I agree.
He is about as racist as most people I know...white, black & asian.
This is to say he's so normal that calling him "racist" is rather over-the-top.

You can judge that from a single post?

 

[Dan From Smithville]

I think it would highly depend on what the cult was, how their actions effect others in a objectively negative way, rather than just being called a cult by some. Heck most every religion is called a cult by someone. There's very few people I would ban my kids from associating with, and it's largely based on individual properties, not demographics. Certainly not just 'has a different religion/sex/sexuality/national origin' than me.

I very much agree with your position. I just note that there may exist reasonable exceptions. The existence of exceptions does not invalidate the overall reasoning of an inclusive, open-minded view. Exceptions just need to be explained within the context in which they exist. I do not see an exception based on safety, for instance, to be an exercise in bigotry anymore than I see current restrictions on large gatherings to be an attack on Christianity.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

No, you are not racist.

Strong call there. How do you figure that?

 

[Curious George]

Some aspects of cultures should die out. Bigotry is one of them.

 

[Rival]

Strong call there. How do you figure that?

It just doesn't strike me as racist. Maybe I have a different standard having once been a National Socialist but he just more seems to me like he prefers his own people and just wants them left alone.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

It just doesn't strike me as racist. Maybe I have a different standard having once been a National Socialist but he just more seems to me like he prefers his own people and just wants them left alone.

Ok. We read his OP quite differently then. Thanks for letting me know your thoughts.

 

[SA Huguenot]

Not if that was all you said. But that is not all he said.

He says he wants to tell his children only to marry whites.

He says he only wants to socialise with whites.

He tries to justify the Bantustans set up under apartheid to provide white S Africa with a tame population of black labour, while denying them any share of the riches of the country they worked for, which was taken from them by the colonists.

And so on. This is old-fashioned S African racism, of a kind I have not heard for thirty years.

Therefore, what you say is, I should be ashamed to have had an ancestory who was white.
I should discourage my descendends to remain white.
Why, is there somethin wrong with being white?

Dont you think your remarks are bigoted against a man who is who he is?
Dont you think that if I believe God made us the color who we are, that I have the right to be proud of my white existance?
Do you realy have the belief that because I am White I should discourage my children not to be proud of who they are?
Where does this end?
Legislation where I am forced to teach my Children to intermarry?

To force me to deny my culture and to let them become some New Age being total alien to my history and culture?
And you call me a racist for this?

 

[SA Huguenot]

Not if that was all you said. But that is not all he said.

He says he wants to tell his children only to marry whites.

He says he only wants to socialise with whites.

He tries to justify the Bantustans set up under apartheid to provide white S Africa with a tame population of black labour, while denying them any share of the riches of the country they worked for, which was taken from them by the colonists.

And so on. This is old-fashioned S African racism, of a kind I have not heard for thirty years.

I am not a Colonist.
I am a white man born in Africa and my ancestors were here since the first White people came here.
We tamed this land, assisted the Black tribes with food, hospitals, technology, peace and stopped them from genocide as they continously had tribal wars to steal cattle and women.
Do you know when teh white man got to the cape ther were no Black tribes for 600 Km inland?
There were Bushmen and they were killed off by the Hottentots, who wer killed of by the Black tribes as they moved down from the North.
Do you know that all the land the White settlers had were bught and fought for, nothing were stolen.
Do yu know the British came and colonised South Africa, and thereby stole all the land from the Black and White people?
Do you know there were more so called Bantustans in Africa, such as Rhodesia, now Zimbabwe who the Black socilaists destroyed, Mozambique, who went the same route, Angola, Namibia, Tanzania, and so on.
The only country in Sub Sahara Africa with food and an economy, remains South Africa.
Do you know why millions of Black people crossed the border to live in South Africa?
Because there are "White Racists" who keep the country going.
"White Racists who just want to live with their families in safety, not killed because the foolish liberal socialists demands we turn some other color!

Yesterday a Farmer in Natal was attacked by 6 black robbers. They flead after the farmer defended himself firing a few shots.
They fled, he even had the curtesy not to even hurt one of them in doing so.
On of these men decided to not hide in the bushes, and dived into the Crocodile infested Umfulozi river.
The farmer by this time had a reaction security person also arriving, and some neighbouring farmers.
They urged the man to gt out to safety, whilst the farmer watched that no croc attacks.
The man decided to take his chances, and drowned in deeper stronger water.
The police "black officers" was called to the scene, and after investigating the security cameras, and cell videos, they found no ill doing from the farmer.

Today his farm, his house, his fields and his warehouse with 15 milion mplements and tractors, furnature cars...evrything was burned down by a Black mob lead by a Black socialist EFF instigater.
All his personal belongings was looted!

Now, do you want me to tell my children to marry these "Inocent" black people?
I never judge a person on his skin color, but by his character.
You judged me being white, and therefore you are a racist.

 

[Rival]

I do find that to be curious, as an Irish-American who's family hasnt been here that long. Im very aware the culture I grew up in isnt my heritage or the culture of my ancestors. And the culture I did grow up in, it rejected us when we got here, and the way it is now I have little respect for it or how it got to be that way. Its generations of Bible thumping protestants (again, not my ancestral heritage) who took Christian literalism and fundamentalism to a whole new level around the mid 19th century. We didnt have anything to do with it. It was mostly the children of German Protestants. And after I quit being Protestant, the culture I grew up in and I had a mutual rejection of eachother.
As for where Im at now, there is more influence of Hispanics and Latinos and not an ocean of white doing everything. And it's way better. Still not one of mine or my ancestors doing, but it's better than the one I left (and I fit in way better here).

In your case I would be talking about overall US culture that tends to value things like freedom, equality, a balanced justice system, democracy, freedom to lead one's own life, dress how one wishes etc. as opposed to more communal cultures like the Chinese cultural value system.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

In your case I would be talking about overall US culture that tends to value things like freedom, equality, a balanced justice system, democracy, freedom to lead one's own life, dress how one wishes etc. as opposed to more communal cultures like the Chinese cultural value system.

Theres legal freedom, and then social freedom. Indiana is quite "soft authoritarian" in that regard. Such as, how often I got wrote up for my hair being too long even though thats not legal in many places. California nobody cares. Indiana, being trans got me diagnosed as psychotic.

 

[HonestJoe]

Therefore, what you say is, I should be ashamed to have had an ancestory who was white.
I should discourage my descendends to remain white.
Why, is there somethin wrong with being white?

The key point is that it doesn't have to be a matter of either pride or shame. Your skin colour really isn't as significant as you're making out. It's really no different to asking whether you should be proud or ashamed of your hair colour or your height. The only reason skin colour has become such a significant thing is because human beings are fundamentally pack animals and skin colour is a very obvious and immediate identifier of "other". There is no deeper logic or rationale to divisions on the basis of simple skin colour and therefore no justification to consciously promote it further than it already exists (and indeed, no reason not to push though some of our divisive instincts).

After all, I'm a white but I'm sure you have much, much more in common with the average black South African than you do with me.

 

[SA Huguenot]

Pride is never found in the Bible in a positive light. The Father didn't say "This is my beloved son in whom I am very proud of" - he said "This is my beloved son in whom I am well pleased".

Now... are you around because the have white skin? Or are you pleased because they are wonderful children?

Think about it.

In the sense of what I call Proud is a word chosen not at idolizing myself, but a word to describe that the intend of those that hate me for being White, telling me that I should be ashamed of being white.
Well, the hell with anyone who demands of me to be ashamed of my people who were the most outstanding Christian Huegeneuts and Protestants in history, who were persecuted for believing in Jesus and the Bible.
Now, lllow me to rephrase my intent with the word I chose, which you deliberately forced into a filthy conotation.
I am not ashamed of being White!
I am not ashamed of being a White descendand of the people who settled here in Africa and made it the greatest country in Africa.
I am not ashamed of my white children.
I am not ashamed of my white grand chidren.

 

[SA Huguenot]

You are "allowed" to be as racist as you like. But don't expect the people around you to accommodate it. Especially when doing so has, is, and will continue to cause them tremendous hardship.

So you say I am Racist because I am not ashamed of being White, and I love my own people?
So, do you expect me to shange color, or to ensure that my "white lineage" sceizes to exist and I must get my descendends to marry non whites?
Do you see how racist you are?

 

[Rival]

So you say I am Racist because I am not ashamed of being White, and I love my own people?
So, do you expect me to shange color, or to ensure that my "white lineage" sceizes to exist and I must get my descendends to marry non whites?
Do you see how racist you are?

Most people are having issues with this and it does in fact include me,

• Am I allowed to say that evry "White Nation" on this earth became prosperous, and in Africa the Black people are incapable to achieve the same standard? If I am not allowed to say this, why not becaue it is a fact?

 

[PureX]

So you say I am Racist because I am not ashamed of being White, and I love my own people?

You are racist because you exclude people as being "yours" based on the color of their skin. And you are apparently very "proud" of this.

So, do you expect me to change color, or to ensure that my "white lineage" sceizes to exist and I must get my descendends to marry non whites?

I don't expect anything of you. All I'm saying is that so long as you choose to separate your well-being from the well-being of the society of humans within which you live, you will continue to be an impediment to their well-being. And they will treat you as such. So stop crying and whining about the fact that they don't respect or appreciate your selfishness. Why should they? When you clearly do not respect or appreciate them.

 

[SA Huguenot]

No, the isn't a great reason for Apartheid. Education is the best construction for peace. Don't forget, anybody may have the disposition to attack a group of people that are taking their land. Would you attack a person who is trying to take your personal home?

And who took the land?
If one buys the land, does it belong to you?
If people then make war and you retaliate and fight for your land, does it still belong to you?
Well, in this case the Afrikaner did nothing wrong, and should gain self determination.
What about the Muslim horders that stole North Africa?
Or the Australians who settled in New Holland?
Or the Dutch, German, French, Portuguese, Spanish, and English who took North and South America?

Furthermore, why does the Colored people hold he White Americans accountable for something their ancestors did 150 years ago?
And, why does the Coloured people not realise, they are setlers in the USA also?

 

[SA Huguenot]

Yes, there are black racists. But you can't just paint every person "racist" just because of the amount of melanin one has.

I can only hope your statement intend the thought that you also can't just paint every person "racist" just because of the shortage of melanin one has