If this pandemic/pestilece is a sign of the end..next sign is in the heavens

[izzy88]

No. I don't believe our natures are imperfect and conflicted. When I suffered from chronic depression, I thought this. Now that I'm not, I'm learning to get back in touch with my true nature. Imperfection is in the eye of the beholder. It's also depressing and counterproductive to living a blessed life.

As someone who has suffered from chronic depression for virtually my entire life, I empathize with you. We may not agree on how we see the world, but I'm very glad to hear you've found an outlook on life that makes you feel blessed. If that's the case, you certainly must be doing something right.

I don't know where I'd be if I thought I was fallen and couldn't get up.

If god gives blessings and protects, wouldn't it make sense to lean on him as so Not to fall rather than see yourself fallen in order for him to pick you up?

Isn't the point not to fall in the first place?

If we fall, we can never learn - never grow. A life without struggle is a life without meaning, a life without progress. If a parent were to prevent their child from ever having to make a mistake, what kind of person would that child turn out to be? If they never took the training wheels off of their child's bike, sure the child would never fall, but that means it would never learn to ride. Parents allow their children to fall precisely because they love them so much, and they're always right there beside the child to help pick them back up.

That's how I see it, anyway.

 

[Tiberius]

But on a more serious vein, some signs mentioned in the bible are a great stone falling to earth and poising oceans. A third of the stars going dark. The sun and moon standing still. Satan falling to earth, and his angels. The moon turning red in color.

I doubt it would be something that would be usual, or minor or boring and able to be ignored by most people as a supermoon or something.

Oh, and I forgot a BIG one possibly! If the Rapture is soon and He is coming in the sky, maybe that would have some effects on the heavens even if the wicked world left behind doesn't see us of Him up there!!

What person in their right mind would see something that has a perfectly plausible explanation and has happened many times in the past with no ill effects, but then conclude that it is a sign of doom from God?

 

[InChrist]

I don't know, of course what the big signs will be. I have guessed that it could be something like the ring of SN1987a in which I seem to almost see a human head. I imagine if it formed into a clear picture of the AC almost like a cosmic plasma TV screen in deep space, that would make people worship the guy. Ha. But that was just a wild guess, not really based on anything, except it would be astounding and unexpected or predicted or explainable by science.

But on a more serious vein, some signs mentioned in the bible are a great stone falling to earth and poising oceans. A third of the stars going dark. The sun and moon standing still. Satan falling to earth, and his angels. The moon turning red in color.

I doubt it would be something that would be usual, or minor or boring and able to be ignored by most people as a supermoon or something.

Oh, and I forgot a BIG one possibly! If the Rapture is soon and He is coming in the sky, maybe that would have some effects on the heavens even if the wicked world left behind doesn't see us of Him up there!!

If a virus has had such an impact on a worldwide scale I can only imagine the impact of millions disappearing from the earth at the Rapture, including all children and unborn babies. I think that event is due soon.

 

[Tiberius]

If a virus has had such an impact on a worldwide scale I can only imagine the impact of millions disappearing from the earth at the Rapture, including all children and unborn babies. I think that event is due soon.

People have been saying that for centuries. Hasn't happened yet.

 

[dad]

I'm actually writing one to two sentence replies.

I said that I don't know why you think I'm trying to convince you of anything. Maybe you feel threatened because I'm challenging your opinions? (Even if you don't use the words, the context is the same)

I do not know: It is not personal.



Well, I never considered seeing god's blessings and positivism in human nature as fantasy view.

It would make more sense that god would keep me from drowning not save me once I've drowned.



I think I phrased it wrong. I tried to edit.

The wages of blessings is life.

I honestly know I am not internally deprived. That's just not my reality. I know people get depressed. I suffered from chronic depression myself. That. is horrible in itself-who would want to see themselves as spiritual depressed when they have someone to help them Not get into it in the first place?

Unless you like to be depressed so you can be saved?



We are not all sinners (inherited sin?) and we do not all need to be saved.

Believers feel they need to be saved because they see their internal nature as bad for some reason. While their view is their view, making it everyone else's is totally inappropriate.



For the believer only.

No one else.

We did not choose to be sinners, we were born in sin. We do choose to be saved though.

 

[dad]

I don't recognize a book regarding a very specific politic situation against the Romans as pertinent to today.

1Th 5:4 - But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.


Mt 25:13 - Watch therefore, for ye know neither the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh.

 

[dad]

You missed the plague that wiped out so many human beings between the Black Plague and the Spanish Flu. It's very well known. It was perhaps the greatest plague among humanity. In some communities it wiped out 80 percent of the population. This plague was spearheaded by a European community, there's your first hint, in an Age of Exploration, your second hint. Much of it driven in the name of Christendom. Not all, but much of it.

I replied to a similar question somewhere else. Here it is

(the relevant part is bolded)

another forum...

I read 'earthquakes' as next on the agenda.
For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
(Mat 24:7)
Oh wait, we already have those.

OK. Fair enough. That would mean earthquakes as well as great signs in the heavens if this also was referring to the start of the very end period. Of course, there were earthquakes and etc before also. But the ones that kick off the time of tribulation, also known as labor pains (sorrows) are of particular importance here.

8 All these are the beginning of sorrows

The sense could be, then, that just before or at the start of the very final period referred to as a woman in labor and the great time of tribulation such as the world has never seen, we will see these things. (not that they also to some extent also were not seen through history!)

 

[dad]

What person in their right mind would see something that has a perfectly plausible explanation and has happened many times in the past with no ill effects, but then conclude that it is a sign of doom from God?

Your idea of plausible is a series of leaps of faith coupled with dark and unsupportable doubts and an insolent attitude and contempt for all that is true and holy. Work on that.

 

[dad]

If a virus has had such an impact on a worldwide scale I can only imagine the impact of millions disappearing from the earth at the Rapture, including all children and unborn babies. I think that event is due soon.

You are not alone. Hundreds of millions agree. But the way the wicked will react
is foretold also. They will curse God more and more. Looking at the pestilence today I saw one leader I think it was in Michigan or some state, that doubled down and threatened to keep killing babies as a priority despite the shortages of medical help for victims.

 

[InChrist]

People have been saying that for centuries. Hasn't happened yet.

True, it has happened yet, but doesn’t mean it won’t when it’s the right time.

Do you realize that your doubting and mocking of Christ to keep His promise to return is fulfilling prophecy?
2 Peter 3:3-9

 

[InChrist]

You are not alone. Hundreds of millions agree. But the way the wicked will react
is foretold also. They will curse God more and more. Looking at the pestilence today I saw one leader I think it was in Michigan or some state, that doubled down and threatened to keep killing babies as a priority despite the shortages of medical help for victims.

You’re right, hard hearted hearts which just keep getting harder.

 

[InChrist]

What person in their right mind would see something that has a perfectly plausible explanation and has happened many times in the past with no ill effects, but then conclude that it is a sign of doom from God?

Likely a person who is paying attention and believes God’s prophetic words concerning the events He says will occur at the end of the age.

 

[Tiberius]

Your idea of plausible is a series of leaps of faith coupled with dark and unsupportable doubts and an insolent attitude and contempt for all that is true and holy. Work on that.

Your idea of plausible is to take stories by people who believed in magic and assume that their myths and legends MUST be true simply because they say what you've already decided to believe.

Your grip on reality is precarious.

 

[Tiberius]

True, it has happened yet, but doesn’t mean it won’t when it’s the right time.

Do you realize that your doubting and mocking of Christ to keep His promise to return is fulfilling prophecy?
2 Peter 3:3-9

So people made up a story that sounds ridiculous, so they say people will ridicule it and pretend that countsd as evidence it's real?

If I tell you that Barney the Dinosaur will be revealed as ultimate ruler of the universe and that he told me that people would ridicule me for making that claim, would you count people ridiculing me for it as evidence that I am correct?

No?

Then why do you make the same argument?

 

[Good-Ole-Rebel]

I see. True. One reason I just mentioned that if this extra big sized pestilence was one of these signs of the end, the next thing we might expect to see is great signs in heaven.

The last days started after Jesus rose. So there have been wars and etc since then. What I would keep an eye on is the frequency and intensity.

I agree with what you say and I have considered these end time events and their affect upon mankind. As Christians we know and believe the apocalyptic statements found in the Bible in places such as (Matt. 24) and the entire book of (Revelation), etc.

But these events are not disconnected from the natural flow of history. Therefore the unbelieving will never see this or any other event as a sign from God as it will always have a cause/result explanation.

In other words, the new world order, the anti-christ, the mark of the beast, I believe will occur just like the Bible says. But it will not occur with the declaration by man that we are now in the apocalyptic times of man. There won't be any recognition from mankind as a whole, that such things are supernatural and from God, until the very end when Christ returns. It will all occur in the usual movements of man, unrecognizable by him that God is behind it.

I believe this Corona virus has and will play a role in the preparation of this end time events. Not so much that it is a plague or pestilence that kills a certain number of people, but that it has prepared the people of the world to accept governments involvement on the world stage. And that the people of the world move as a people of the world. Plus it has given governments power to literally stop the normal movements of man. To dictate when you can go in and out and how you are to act and be dressed.

Plus, I listened to two men on the news the other day discussing the economic affect Corona has add and how we must begin thinking about changing the economic structure from what we are used to. They didn't say what that could be, but the very introduction of that thought is important as the mark of the beast is an economic fix.

My point is this. Though I as a believer see this Corona as playing a role in the end time events, the unbeliever never will. It is but a virus that can be traced back to China that got out of hand some way and man is now having to respond to it. No great light flash in the sky saying we are now in end time events. Just the continual flow of history of man slowly and perfectly fulfilling that which the Bible has said.

Good-Ole-Rebel

 

[Unveiled Artist]

We did not choose to be sinners, we were born in sin. We do choose to be saved though.

No we are not. We are born blessed but by our upbringing, societal, and some religious beliefs, we choose to sin.

What's wrong with being born blessed?

Why can't god prevent you from drowning rather than save you from drowning?

 

[dad]

Your idea of plausible is to take stories by people who believed in magic and assume that their myths and legends MUST be true simply because they say what you've already decided to believe.

Your grip on reality is precarious.

That has - what to do with the pandemic? There really is one you know.

 

[dad]

I agree with what you say and I have considered these end time events and their affect upon mankind. As Christians we know and believe the apocalyptic statements found in the Bible in places such as (Matt. 24) and the entire book of (Revelation), etc.

But these events are not disconnected from the natural flow of history. Therefore the unbelieving will never see this or any other event as a sign from God as it will always have a cause/result explanation.

In other words, the new world order, the anti-christ, the mark of the beast, I believe will occur just like the Bible says. But it will not occur with the declaration by man that we are now in the apocalyptic times of man. There won't be any recognition from mankind as a whole, that such things are supernatural and from God, until the very end when Christ returns. It will all occur in the usual movements of man, unrecognizable by him that God is behind it.

I believe this Corona virus has and will play a role in the preparation of this end time events. Not so much that it is a plague or pestilence that kills a certain number of people, but that it has prepared the people of the world to accept governments involvement on the world stage. And that the people of the world move as a people of the world. Plus it has given governments power to literally stop the normal movements of man. To dictate when you can go in and out and how you are to act and be dressed.

Plus, I listened to two men on the news the other day discussing the economic affect Corona has add and how we must begin thinking about changing the economic structure from what we are used to. They didn't say what that could be, but the very introduction of that thought is important as the mark of the beast is an economic fix.

My point is this. Though I as a believer see this Corona as playing a role in the end time events, the unbeliever never will. It is but a virus that can be traced back to China that got out of hand some way and man is now having to respond to it. No great light flash in the sky saying we are now in end time events. Just the continual flow of history of man slowly and perfectly fulfilling that which the Bible has said.

Good-Ole-Rebel

Ok. That was a well-articulated opinion.

On the flip side though, if there are some specific signs that herald the start of that last seven-year period, they also would prepare the world for what is coming.

In another forum, I expressed my opinion as below..

This is one reason I am exploring the possibility that there are three groups of those events.
1) Quakes, wars, pestilences etc before the last seven years.
2) These same sort of signs together just prior to and marking the start of the last seven years (beginning of sorrows)
3) The same sort of events with far greater frequency and degree increasing through the seven years, especially in the last 31/2 and most especially, quickly, frequently, and severity in the very last part of this Great Tribulation.

That would mean that yes, we have had pestilences and signs in heaven and etc before. And yes, in a broad sense these also are part of the last day events.

If there is a batch of signs marking the start of the labor pains/sorrows/last seven years then this is significant to believers.

 

[dad]

No we are not. We are born blessed but by our upbringing, societal, and some religious beliefs, we choose to sin.

What's wrong with being born blessed?

Why can't god prevent you from drowning rather than save you from drowning?

Yet your opinion is opposed to Scripture. What evidence do you have we are all blessed rather than sinners?

 

[Etritonakin]

Luke 21:11 And great earthquakes shall be in divers places, and famines, and pestilences; and fearful sights and great signs shall there be from heaven.

If this virus/pestilence is a sign, the next thing we might expect is great signs in the heaven.

Not comets or asteroids or supermoons probably. But great signs that absolutely stun people and probably have never been seen before.

I was looking at a video the other day of a light -which became three lights -moving in a circle -clouds outside the circle -no clouds within the circle.

I have seen some pretty weird stuff, but even my immediate reaction to such things either that it is a hoax, drones, etc...

I was thinking that if such were something truly significant and abnormal, it would have to be extremely impressive -and many would have to see it/experience it at the same time -for it to be considered significant.

Even then, there are reports of mass sightings of things in the sky -but if one was not there, they would have no reference.

What would it really take for the whole world to say "ummmmmmm.... what was that? "