Democrats’ outrageous border cruelty

[Valjean]

Tell that to all the prisoners in our over populated prisons. They probably would cheer for you.

What's your point? There are situations where the law is simply wrong; where it does great harm. Would you have turned in the Frank family during WWII, or a runaway slave in 1850? Legally, the answer is clear. Morally? -- not so clear.

 

[We Never Know]

I dont Mexico rising up and taking back the Western chunk of the US that was theirs.

The Native Americans are the biggest and best example of what happens when you welcome and try to help people not native to your country. Eventually they will take it over.

 

[We Never Know]

What's your point? There are situations where the law is simply wrong; where it does great harm. Would you have turned in the Frank family during WWII, or a runaway slave in 1850? Legally, the answer is clear. Morally? -- not so clear.

I wasn't alive in either of those times. All I can do is access and act during the the time I am alive.
Illegal is illegal. Picking and choosing who to bend laws for only causes more problems.

 

[We Never Know]

I dont Mexico rising up and taking back the Western chunk of the US that was theirs.

Pilgrims wouldn't have survived without the help of Native Americans. With thier help they did survive. What harm can come from a few? Then they went back to bring forth more and more and more and, for the Native Americans, their life forever changed and the rest is history.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

The Native Americans are the biggest and best example of what happens when you welcome and try to help people not native to your country. Eventually they will take it over.

The natives didnt have guns, and the Europeans werent the ones being decimated by European diseases.

 

[We Never Know]

The natives didnt have guns, and the Europeans werent the ones being decimated by European diseases.

Native Americans, the ones without guns, were given blankets tainted with disease and killed by the millions. But hey, what harm can a few new people bring right?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Pilgrims wouldn't have survived without the help of Native Americans. With thier help they did survive. What harm can come from a few? Then they went back to bring forth more and more and more and, for the Native Americans, their life forever changed and the rest is history.

Thats a really bad example. For starters, law, morality, and ethics have advanced tremendously since then. Mexicans also, even in California, are not in a position to take over. Especially now since we cant have a "surprise we know own it! whats own?" type of situation sprung in us.

 

[Valjean]

The Native Americans are the biggest and best example of what happens when you welcome and try to help people not native to your country. Eventually they will take it over.

And this xenophobic, nativist paranoia is pernicious and dangerous. It may have been useful when we lived in small, competitive hunter-gatherer bands, but in a civilized society it's toxic.
It's indicative of a primitive, rule focused, deontologic, non-consequential, morally retarded mindset.

Kohlberg:
Level 2 - Conventional morality
At the conventional level (most adolescents and adults), we begin to internalize the moral standards of valued adult role models.
Authority is internalized but not questioned, and reasoning is based on the norms of the group to which the person belongs.

I wasn't alive in either of those times. All I can do is access and act during the the time I am alive.
Illegal is illegal. Picking and choosing who to bend laws for only causes more problems.

The moral principles involved still obtain. They haven't changed, and they trump any temporary, human law, convention or current social norm.

All you can do? You can be principled. You can be consequentialist. You can question intentions and results.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Native Americans, the ones without guns, were given blankets tainted with disease and killed by the millions. But hey, what harm can a few new people bring right?

Medicine and vaccines have also come along way since then. Another really bad example.

 

[We Never Know]

The natives didnt have guns, and the Europeans werent the ones being decimated by European diseases.

And just for fun.... Here in America when you call many places you have to push a 1 for "English" the American language.
I don't mind any one coming here. But do it legally, learn the language, live by our laws. That's not asking too much.

 

[We Never Know]

And this xenophobic, nativist paranoia is pernicious and dangerous. It may have been useful when we lived in small, competitive hunter-gatherer bands, but in a civilized society it's toxic.
It's indicative of a primitive, rule focused, deontologic, non-consequential, morally retarded mindset.

Kohlberg:
Level 2 - Conventional morality
At the conventional level (most adolescents and adults), we begin to internalize the moral standards of valued adult role models.
Authority is internalized but not questioned, and reasoning is based on the norms of the group to which the person belongs.
The moral principles involved still obtain. They haven't changed, and they trump any temporary, human law, conventions or current social norms.

All you can do? You can be principled. You can be consequentialist. You can question intentions and results.

I'm Native American. Don't preach to me about morals or the harm illegals won't cause.

 

[We Never Know]

Medicine and vaccines have also come along way since then. Another really bad example.

Lol. They purposely gave people a disease, if a cure had existed, they wouldn't have handed it out because killing was the purpose of giving the disease.

 

[Valjean]

And just for fun.... Here in America when you call many places you have to push a 1 for "English" the American language.
I don't mind any one coming here. But do it legally, learn the language, live by our laws. That's not asking too much.

But in an emergency that's just not possible. It can be attended to later.
If your house is burning you can be excused for not wearing a tie and shined shoes.

 

[We Never Know]

And this xenophobic, nativist paranoia is pernicious and dangerous. It may have been useful when we lived in small, competitive hunter-gatherer bands, but in a civilized society it's toxic.
It's indicative of a primitive, rule focused, deontologic, non-consequential, morally retarded mindset.

Kohlberg:
Level 2 - Conventional morality
At the conventional level (most adolescents and adults), we begin to internalize the moral standards of valued adult role models.
Authority is internalized but not questioned, and reasoning is based on the norms of the group to which the person belongs.
The moral principles involved still obtain. They haven't changed, and they trump any temporary, human law, convention or current social norm.

All you can do? You can be principled. You can be consequentialist. You can question intentions and results.

The past cannot be changed. It can only be a lesson.

 

[We Never Know]

But in an emergency that's just not possible. It can be attended to later.
If your house is burning you can be excused for not wearing a tie and shined shoes.

Very bad anology lol.
One of the first stipulations of living here should be learn the language.

 

[We Never Know]

But in an emergency that's just not possible. It can be attended to later.
If your house is burning you can be excused for not wearing a tie and shined shoes.

Not to mention... "A new U.S. Census Bureau report out highlights the breathtaking diversity of language in the United States. According to the report, the most comprehensive data ever released on languages spoken less widely in the U.S., at least 350 languages are spoken in American homes."

I guess eventually there will be a lot more numbers to push besides "1" for English.

 

[Valjean]

Lol. They purposely gave people a disease, if a cure had existed, they wouldn't have handed it out because killing was the purpose of giving the disease.

And America purposely destroyed the refugees' societies and installed gangs, creating a criminal anarchy. Do you blame people for fleeing?

What would you do if your daughter was kidnapped and threatened with rape and death if your son didn't agree to join the gang? Wouldn't it be your duty as a parent to get the family out of there, regardless of "the law?"

 

[Valjean]

Very bad anology lol.
One of the first stipulations of living here should be learn the language.

Fine -- but can a person be blamed for not anticipating the need for flight and the acquisition of a foreign language? Did they even have the opportunity to learn English prior to emigrating?
I understand you find these people annoying, but don't let your annoyance override your principles.

 

[Darkforbid]

Could be worse Fire at Campsfield House immigration removal centre leaves two in hospital

 

[We Never Know]

Fine -- but can a person be blamed for not anticipating the need for flight and the acquisition of a foreign language? Did they even have the opportunity to learn English prior to emigrating?
I understand you find these people annoying, but don't let your annoyance override your principles.

I won't be back on until Saturday evening or Sunday morning.
Tell you what, research how many countries say press 1 for their native language. For example(s).
Does France say press 1 for French?
Does Mexico say press 1 for Spanish?
Does Russia say press 1 for Russian?
Does China say press 1 for Mandarin?
Does Japan say press 1 for Japanese?

I will look forward to what you come up with. Have a great weekend.