Supporting Muslims as members of our communities

[The Emperor of Mankind]

Saudi Arabia: 425 cases of sex-reassignment in 27 years | ILGA
The International Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Trans and Intersex Association | ILGAsaudi-arabia-425-cases-of-sex-reassignment-in-27...
1- In Saudi Arabia, only intersex individuals are allowed to undergo sex-reassignment process. According to a decree by the Saudi Ministry of Health -issued in May 2011-, all hospitals and medical centers can only perform sex-correction precedes only after the cases are confirmed by the "Medical Treatment Office" of the Health Ministry.

What about the fact Saudi Arabia (as well as many other Islamic countries) puts gays and lesbians to death?

 

[sooda]

What about the fact Saudi Arabia (as well as many other Islamic countries) puts gays and lesbians to death?

KSA doesn't put gays to death, but you will find many instant pundits who lump all Muslim countries together.

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

Don't the Hellenists have along history of pedophilia??

Do we? I've not heard of it being a problem in the community.

@DavidMcCann is this something you've heard of?

I also love how you've been studiously avoiding condemning Christian or Muslim child abuse on this forum for years but the moment you get a chance to lampoon Pagans you can't jump at the opportunity fast enough.

KSA doesn't put gays to death, but you will find many instant pundits who lump all Muslim countries together.

Yes they do. See below a list of capital crimes in Saudi Arabia (accurate as of 2011 so perhaps they've changed since then) - namely one 'Consensual sexual relations between adults of the same sex'.

"Judges reportedly treat gay and lesbian sexual relations as zina, applying the penalty of death or lashing according to the circumstances. [36] The schools of Sunni Islam take different positions on the treatment of homosexual and lesbian acts. The Hanbali school treated male sodomy as carrying the penalty of death as hadd, regardless of the marital status of the offender, while lesbianism was punished (under all schools) as a ta’zir offense. In this regard, Saudi jurisprudence is heterodox in that it treats lesbianism as punishable as hadd."

In fact do you want to know how much they dislike homosexuality? They're executing (or have executed) one of the royal family's horses for mounting another stallion.

I'll say that again. They're executing. A. Horse.

Link

 

[sooda]

Do we? I've not heard of it being a problem in the community.

@DavidMcCann is this something you've heard of?

I also love how you've been studiously avoiding condemning Christian or Muslim child abuse on this forum for years but the moment you get a chance to lampoon Pagans you can't jump at the opportunity fast enough.




Yes they do. See below a list of capital crimes in Saudi Arabia (accurate as of 2011 so perhaps they've changed since then) - namely one 'Consensual sexual relations between adults of the same sex'.

"Judges reportedly treat gay and lesbian sexual relations as zina, applying the penalty of death or lashing according to the circumstances. [36] The schools of Sunni Islam take different positions on the treatment of homosexual and lesbian acts. The Hanbali school treated male sodomy as carrying the penalty of death as hadd, regardless of the marital status of the offender, while lesbianism was punished (under all schools) as a ta’zir offense. In this regard, Saudi jurisprudence is heterodox in that it treats lesbianism as punishable as hadd."

In fact do you want to know how much they dislike homosexuality? They're executing (or have executed) one of the royal family's horses for mounting another stallion.

I'll say that again. They're executing. A. Horse.

Link

Cornell Law School simply got it wrong.

Doha isn't in Saudi Arabia.

Where facts don't matter?????

ABOUT US
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Saudi Arabia: Famous racehorse to be executed for being homosexual

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

Cornell Law School simply got it wrong.

Doha isn't in Saudi Arabia.

Where facts don't matter?????

Does Cornell Law School mention Doha? Where on the page? I've looked and they don't mention it.

Sounds like your clutching at straws to dismiss the source.

ABOUT US
World News Daily Report is an American Jewish Zionist newspaper based in Tel Aviv and dedicated on covering biblical archeology news and other mysteries around the Globe.

Our News Team is composed of award winning Christian, Muslim and Jewish journalists, retired Mossad agents and veterans of the Israeli Armed Forces.

Saudi Arabia: Famous racehorse to be executed for being homosexual

I googled a facsimilie of the headline and came up with this link: TruthorFiction.com which points out that this is a phoney story. You were right not to trust it. I should have been more circumspect in my use of this source.

The Saudis are intolerant enough of gays that we don't need to make stuff up to condemn them over.

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

I hope those situations change and saner religious interpretations prevail.

I agree. But do you think that'll really happen?

 

[sooda]

Does Cornell Law School mention Doha? Where on the page? I've looked and they don't mention it.

Sounds like your clutching at straws to dismiss the source.




I googled a facsimilie of the headline and came up with this link: TruthorFiction.com which points out that this is a phoney story. You were right not to trust it. I should have been more circumspect in my use of this source.

The Saudis are intolerant enough of gays that we don't need to make stuff up to condemn them over.

Well, not exactly. The Saudis have sons and brothers and cousins who are gay. Every city has a gay underground and they do quite well in terms of education, jobs etc.. Its like in the US in the 1950s.. they are invisible.

Put it in context... In a society that condemns all public displays even between heterosexuals, it not a problem.

For sure.. They won't have any Gay Pride parades.

 

[Lyndon]

Which places have the death penalty for gay sex?,, note several countries have death penalty for gay sex, but it seems it is never enforced, at least recently.

 

[sooda]

Which places have the death penalty for gay sex?,, note several countries have death penalty for gay sex, but it seems it is never enforced, at least recently.

In Iran the gays who were executed were convicted of molesting little boys. That much I do know.

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

Well, not exactly. The Saudis have sons and brothers and cousins who are gay. Every city has a gay underground and they do quite well in terms of education, jobs etc.. Its like in the US in the 1950s.. they are invisible.

Put it in context... In a society that condemns all public displays even between heterosexuals, it not a problem.

For sure.. They won't have any Gay Pride parades.

The gay community is invisible because being gay is a crime punishable by death. Their presence does not dispute the fact their sexuality is illegal under their nation's laws. There are probably more atheists like Raif Badawi in Saudi Arabia but you wouldn't know it because any Saudi atheists would need to remain invisible for their own safety.

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

Which places have the death penalty for gay sex?,, note several countries have death penalty for gay sex, but it seems it is never enforced, at least recently.

Which I'm sure must be a huge comfort to gay citizens fearing they might be caught and be the ones on whom a death sentence is enacted because these laws are still on the statute books.

 

[sooda]

The gay community is invisible because being gay is a crime punishable by death. Their presence does not dispute the fact their sexuality is illegal under their nation's laws. There are probably more atheists like Raif Badawi in Saudi Arabia but you wouldn't know it because any Saudi atheists would need to remain invisible for their own safety.

The penalty for gay sex is lashings not death.. Your information is wrong..

You do know that the protocol for lashing limits range of motion... Its public humiliation not a beating.

Atheism isn't really an issue unless you go real loud and public and cause your brothers to stumble.

When did you become interested in Islam and the Middle East or KSA? 18 years ago?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I agree. But do you think that'll really happen?

I'm a realist so obviously it won't happen for everyone but it would nice if it happened enough to change the culture. It would be nice if my government stop funding hardline regimes in any way, too.

 

[Lyndon]

it is my understanding that original sharia law does not specify the death penalty for adultery or gay sex, the countries that are claiming that are not following sharia law.

 

[sooda]

I'm a realist so obviously it won't happen for everyone but it would nice if it happened enough to change the culture. It would be nice if my government stop funding hardline regimes in any way, too.

The US government doesn't fund the GCC.. never has. They do fund Afghanistan, but Afghanistan has gone BACKWARDS since the communists overthrew the monarchy in 1974.

The ME will come around to modernity in their own time and probably also maintain their culture. I think its easier for countries that are not war torn and/or impoverished.

Seems to me like the reaction to turmoil is always, always a retreat into ultraconservative thinking. Look at ISIS emerging from war torn Iraq.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

The US government doesn't fund the GCC.. never has. They do fund Afghanistan, but Afghanistan has gone BACKWARDS since the communists overthrew the monarchy in 1974.

The ME will come around to modernity in their own time and probably also maintain their culture. I think its easier for countries that are not war torn and/or impoverished.

Seems to me like the reaction to turmoil is always, always a retreat into ultraconservative thinking. Look at ISIS emerging from war torn Iraq.

I'm referring to the US being allied with Saudi Arabia and sending them money.

 

[sooda]

I'm referring to the US being allied with Saudi Arabia and sending them money.

We don't send Saudi Arabia money.. never have. We don't even buy much Saudi oil anymore.

KSA has been a staunch ally since the 1940s and they have never been on the dole. Be very wary of the talking heads on TV.. They don't know anything about Saudi Arabia, but they know what their ignorant audience wants to hear and they can make a buck playing pundit.

 

[sooda]

Which I'm sure must be a huge comfort to gay citizens fearing they might be caught and be the ones on whom a death sentence is enacted because these laws are still on the statute books.

There are no statutes on the books..

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

We don't send Saudi Arabia money.. never have. We don't even buy much Saudi oil anymore.

KSA has been a staunch ally since the 1940s and they have never been on the dole. Be very wary of the talking heads on TV.. They don't know anything about Saudi Arabia, but they know what their ignorant audience wants to hear and they can make a buck playing pundit.

Yes, I'm aware of you carrying water for KSA on this forum but it's not changing my mind.

According to these articles, it's actually the US selling our arms to the Saudis and the Saudis own a lot of American interests, like the Chinese do. Either way, it's very corrupt and just places America in a bad place to be selling arms to a regime that violates the rights we claim to hold so dear in such ways.

What Makes the U.S.-Saudi Relationship So Special? Weapons, Oil and 'An Army of Lobbyists'
What Has $49 Billion in Foreign Military Aid Bought Us? Not Much
What Makes the U.S.-Saudi Relationship So Special? Weapons, Oil and 'An Army of Lobbyists'

 

[sooda]

Yes, I'm aware of you carrying water for KSA on this forum but it's not changing my mind.

According to these articles, it's actually the US selling our arms to the Saudis and the Saudis own a lot of American interests, like the Chinese do. Either way, it's very corrupt and just places America in a bad place to be selling arms to a regime that violates the rights we claim to hold so dear in such ways.

What Makes the U.S.-Saudi Relationship So Special? Weapons, Oil and 'An Army of Lobbyists'
What Has $49 Billion in Foreign Military Aid Bought Us? Not Much
What Makes the U.S.-Saudi Relationship So Special? Weapons, Oil and 'An Army of Lobbyists'

Saudi Arabia pays for arms.. they aren't a freebe. As for me carrying water for Saudi Arabia. I know the leadership. I have known them for over 60 years. Thank God I don't have to lie for them.