Does the OT apply to modern day gentiles?

[meghanwaterlillies]

I have no idea why anyone would make that distinction, /or even use the word/gentile,, aside from quoting Scripture, text

it seems completely contextual to me /where it is used.

well I said to compare lol basically I remember people asking like people; questioning is a norm, normal to ask is what I mean, they always ask what is a jew? Because I still see the posts come down to it so I made a funny one. Not to harm anyone. They usually state because of your mom quote or conversion. And then people tend to go a little more or ask well what is that exactly, and then it gets a little further into where I see two or three arguments and some who study/ some really do identify Judaism/ some been everywhere in religion making points that seem to further discussion. What about gentile? Sometimes it just equates its self with mystery or delusion just as much as in all religious affiliations. I posted a while that I was downtown, the building intercom through the hallway was spouting something about the anti-Semitism and Semitism. I asked if the people listening knew what a jew was? and they didn't have answer. I'm sure someone would have said the common basic eventually. Unless people jump up and where clothing that states I am a jew or a clothing that states it, or a clothing that states I am gentile or "thor" believer, I'm a chrisitian, or Islamic, i'm a pagan, or dress in some religious garb that identifies them upon looking at you; you and I wouldn't know; so how could you judge or bash or even if it was some sort of dangerous affiliation with some other ideology you wouldn't really know. And even if I wear a shirt like such or a grab wouldn't make it always true. With that I started to wonder not as a mystery anymore but things such the things you may not know how it is and doesn't even identify you. That's why I didn't like the intercom actually sometimes, because of the delusions of identification, the only thing we have sometimes is communications basically the things that always shroud in religion as mystery.
And didn't they force identify religion in ww2? I change underwear all the time or I don't have any, ur not always able to identify and be correct. Truth.

 

[meghanwaterlillies]

Yes...... much of it still does.
Some of it does not. For instance the laws that were written to protect the Tribes from mass desease, plague and other weakness can be re-written, because our medicine has provided cures and protections to some extent, so you can eat properly cooked shellfish, or choose polyamory as a lifestyle, etc.

But our world is unbalanced, and about 65 people own more wealth than half of the whole population of the World!!!!
Have a look at these laws, and please do note that charity is not an act of choice in the OT laws, it is a COMMAND!
And the laws on lending and borrowing are brilliant!
These laws, adjusted to suit today's world, would rectify the horrific imbalance of wealth.
Not to afflict an orphan or a widow (Ex. 22:21)
Not to reap the entire field (Lev. 19:9; Lev. 23:22)
leave unreaped corners of fields/orchards for the poor (Lev.19:9)
Not to gather gleanings that have fallen while reaping (Lev. 19:9)
To leave the gleanings for the poor (Lev. 19:9)
Not to gather ol'loth (imperfect clusters) of the vineyard (Lev.19:10)
Leave ol'loth of the vineyard for the poor (Lev. 19:10; Deut. 24:21)
Not to gather single grapes that have fallen to ground (Lev.19:10)
To leave the single grapes of the vineyard for the poor (Lev. 19:10)
Not to return to take a forgotten sheaf (Deut. 24:19)
This applies to all fruit trees (Deut. 24:20)
To leave the forgotten sheaves for the poor (Deut. 24:19-20)
Not to refrain from maintaining a poor man (Deut. 15:7)
To give charity according to one's means (Deut. 15:11)

I think that spiritually I could look this too. What ever the argument or debate I take some of this for my own consideration thank you for posting.

 

[Jonathan Ainsley Bain]

Hey guys, I became a born again christian 2 years ago. Since then I have been trying to find answers to questions which just won't leave me. I have been subscribing to three main forums [Christian, Jewish and Messianic] and I am now more confused than ever because these 3 groups all have different interpretations of the scriptures. Going back and forth between those three forums was too much so I was led here by someone in the hopes that all three faiths mentioned [or more] can join in and discuss everything here under one roof, if ok with you guys?

My first very basic question is, as a modern day gentile, does the OT apply to me? I am being told NO, the OT refers specifically to the Jews. And where it does apply to Gentiles, it was meant for the gentiles "of that era ONLY". If anyone disagrees with this, please state why? Thanks.

Where there is a conflict in ideas, the New testament overrides the old Testament.
So parts of the Old apply, unless the New specifically says otherwise.

For example: Solomon had many wives, but the New testament says only one wife is allowed.

Also, the Old Testament requires circumcision, but the New says that it is a worthless ritual.

etc...

 

[Desert Snake]

well I said to compare lol basically I remember people asking like people; questioning is a norm, normal to ask is what I mean, they always ask what is a jew? Because I still see the posts come down to it so I made a funny one. Not to harm anyone. They usually state because of your mom quote or conversion. And then people tend to go a little more or ask well what is that exactly, and then it gets a little further into where I see two or three arguments and some who study/ some really do identify Judaism/ some been everywhere in religion making points that seem to further discussion. What about gentile? Sometimes it just equates its self with mystery or delusion just as much as in all religious affiliations.

'Gentile', is merely a contextual word that does not have a ''meaning'', outside a contextual /comparison, //usually in Scripture. I wouldn't call myself a 'Gentile', (there's no context or anything being compared, whatever. the Jewish thing is a religious /rabbinical/ distinction that may or may not mean anything to someone.

The thread premise is basically wrong, in inference and wording, as far as i'm concerned

 

[meghanwaterlillies]

Where there is a conflict in ideas, the New testament overrides the old Testament.
So parts of the Old apply, unless the New specifically says otherwise.

For example: Solomon had many wives, but the New testament says only one wife is allowed.

Also, the Old Testament requires circumcision, but the New says that it is a worthless ritual.

etc...

there still is a mighty comparison that is like that in the old testament too

 

[Jonathan Ainsley Bain]

there still is a mighty comparison that is like that in the old testament too

Please explain further...

 

[meghanwaterlillies]

Please explain further...

Adam and eve. His first interpretation to how He saw man was not alone but to add a woman.

 

[Ingledsva]

This is what I have gathered so far. I should live my life trying to keep all 10 commandments, the only commandment in question is if to observe sabbath. One Orthodox rabbi has told me that while I am not required to keep the sabbath I can do so if I wish to have a closer relationship with God BUT I should "purposely break one or more of the sabbath laws not to be in violation being a Gentile" so that is my current issue. I wish I could find other Orthodox Rabbi's to confirm or deny this, any thoughts please?

I assume what he was trying to tell you, - was to take the gift given to the Gentile - of only having to observe a few of the commandments, - rather then joining the Jewish covenant with YHVH, - and TRYING to follow all 613 commandments given to the Jews, and failing, as you are not Jewish, and don't fully understand them, - and thus angering/offending YHVH.

In other words he is probably saying make sure you stay Gentile, with only a few laws to keep, rather then risk angering YHVH, - by making a commitment - and then not correctly following those 613 commandments.

*

 

[muhammad_isa]

In other words he is probably saying make sure you stay Gentile, with only a few laws to keep, rather then risk angering YHVH, - by making a commitment - and then not correctly following those 613 commandments.

A bit silly that .. religion doesn't belong to anybody .. it's for ALL human beings

Th most usual meaning of 'gentile' is goy/disbeliever (or kafir in arabic)
The thing that most angers Almighty God is disbelief and pride

 

[Ingledsva]

A bit silly that .. religion doesn't belong to anybody .. it's for ALL human beings

Th most usual meaning of 'gentile' is goy/disbeliever (or kafir in arabic)
The thing that most angers Almighty God is disbelief and pride

Which has absolutely NOTHING to do with my answer, or the question I was answering.

He/She was wondering what a Jewish RABBI meant! This was in a Jewish-Christian context!

*

 

[viole]

The most usual meaning of 'gentile' is goy/disbeliever (or kafir in arabic)

In Italian it means "kind person".

The thing that most angers Almighty God is disbelief and pride

Awww, poor thing. My disbelief and pride angers Him.

Ciao

- viole

 

[muhammad_isa]

Which has absolutely NOTHING to do with my answer, or the question I was answering.

I beg to differ..
Does this Rabbi think that religion belongs to him?
Why should he not recommend his religion to others, if it is indeed correct?

 

[Ingledsva]

I beg to differ..
Does this Rabbi think that religion belongs to him?
Why should he not recommend his religion to others, if it is indeed correct?

GOOD GRIEF!!!

Think man! Think!

NO other religions have anything to do with what he asked!!!!!

He asked a specific question about what a Jewish Rabbi said!

Therefore my reply was about JEWISH religious ideas!

*

 

[Flankerl]

Th most usual meaning of 'gentile' is goy/disbeliever (or kafir in arabic)

That is wrong. Gentile just means that someone is not Jewish, whether they believe in God is of no consideration.

Don't insert the logic of your Religion into other Religions.

 

[Tumah]

A bit silly that .. religion doesn't belong to anybody .. it's for ALL human beings

Th most usual meaning of 'gentile' is goy/disbeliever (or kafir in arabic)
The thing that most angers Almighty God is disbelief and pride

No, it doesn't mean "disbeliever". It just means someone who isn't Jewish. Even if the non-Jew believes in G-d, he would sill be called a gentile. From what I can see, the literal meaning of the word is "someone who is not of your clan". English translators used it to differentiate between Jews when they were translating the Tanach. I guess it stuck from tehre.

 

[Tumah]

I assume what he was trying to tell you, - was to take the gift given to the Gentile - of only having to observe a few of the commandments, - rather then joining the Jewish covenant with YHVH, - and TRYING to follow all 613 commandments given to the Jews, and failing, as you are not Jewish, and don't fully understand them, - and thus angering/offending YHVH.

In other words he is probably saying make sure you stay Gentile, with only a few laws to keep, rather then risk angering YHVH, - by making a commitment - and then not correctly following those 613 commandments.

*

Actually in an Orthodox context (which is the type of rabbi he had asked) it has to do with a prohibition for non-Jews to keep the Sabbath. We actually believe that most other commandments a non-Jew is permitted to keep on his own without being part of the Jewish people and even receive reward for it. Sabbath is one of the exceptions to that where it is actually prohibited for a non-Jew to keep. So by doing something purposely in order to profane it, its considered as if the person didn't keep it. Its a trick that prospective converts usually do prior to their conversion in order to practice for afterwards.

 

[rusra02]

Hey guys, I became a born again christian 2 years ago. Since then I have been trying to find answers to questions which just won't leave me. I have been subscribing to three main forums [Christian, Jewish and Messianic] and I am now more confused than ever because these 3 groups all have different interpretations of the scriptures. Going back and forth between those three forums was too much so I was led here by someone in the hopes that all three faiths mentioned [or more] can join in and discuss everything here under one roof, if ok with you guys?

My first very basic question is, as a modern day gentile, does the OT apply to me? I am being told NO, the OT refers specifically to the Jews. And where it does apply to Gentiles, it was meant for the gentiles "of that era ONLY". If anyone disagrees with this, please state why? Thanks.

The term "Old Testament" is not accurate. The Hebrew Scriptures encompass much more than the Law covenant God gave the Israelites through Moses. Christians are not subject to the Law covenant. IMO, because the Law covenant was fulfilled by Christ and brought to it's end. However, the historical record in the Hebrew Scriptures, the prophecies, and the principles and standards of conduct there can prove greatly beneficial. That is why the Bible says; "the holy writings... are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness, so that the man of God may be fully competent, completely equipped for every good work." (2 Timothy 3:15-17)

 

[muhammad_isa]

That is wrong. Gentile just means that someone is not Jewish, whether they believe in God is of no consideration.

Don't insert the logic of your Religion into other Religions.

I'm sorry?
You seem a bit confused. Does a Gentile believe in the truth? Or is Judaism not the truth?

Does the Torah mention gentiles? If so, what was it referring to?

 

[Ingledsva]

Actually in an Orthodox context (which is the type of rabbi he had asked) it has to do with a prohibition for non-Jews to keep the Sabbath. We actually believe that most other commandments a non-Jew is permitted to keep on his own without being part of the Jewish people and even receive reward for it. Sabbath is one of the exceptions to that where it is actually prohibited for a non-Jew to keep. So by doing something purposely in order to profane it, its considered as if the person didn't keep it. Its a trick that prospective converts usually do prior to their conversion in order to practice for afterwards.

Ahhh, that last (highlighted) makes sense as he said he was searching when he talked to the Rabbi.

*

 

[ukok102nak]

~:> Therefore accept one another, even as Messiah also accepted you, to the glory of God.
Now I say that Messiah has been made a servant of the circumcision for the truth of God, that he might confirm the promises given to the fathers,
and that the Gentiles might glorify God for his mercy. As it is written,
"Therefore will I give praise to you among the Gentiles,
and sing to your name."
Again he says,
"Rejoice, you Gentiles, with his people."
Again,
"Praise the Lord, all you Gentiles!
Let all the peoples praise him."e
Again, Isaiah says,
"There will be the root of Jesse,
he who arises to rule over the Gentiles;
in him the Gentiles will hope."
Now may the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, that you may abound in hope, in the power of the Holy Spirit.

. ... so as it is written
:read: (as they say)
I will make mention of the loving kindnesses of the Lord and the praises of the Lord, according to all that the Lord has bestowed on us, and the great goodness toward the house of Israel, which he has bestowed on them according to his mercies, and according to the multitude of his loving kindnesses.
For he said, "Surely, they are my people, children who will not deal falsely:" so he was their Savior.
In all their affliction he was afflicted, and the angel of his presence saved them: in his love and in his pity he redeemed them; and he bore them, and carried them all the days of old.
But they rebelled, and grieved his holy Spirit: therefore he was turned to be their enemy, and he himself fought against them.

Then he remembered the days of old, Moses and his people, saying, Where is he who brought them up out of the sea with the shepherds of his flock? Where is he who put his holy Spirit in their midst?
who caused his glorious arm to go at the right hand of Moses? who divided the waters before them, to make himself an everlasting name?
who led them through the depths, as a horse in the wilderness, so that they did not stumble?


:ty:



godbless
unto all always