What's the deal with Chritian divorcees remarrying?

[columbus]

how are mohammed's improvement?

How much do you know about 7th century Arabic culture?
I ask because that is the context in which Mohammed's teachings were delivered.
I'm pretty sure Mohammed's first wife, an extremely strong and intelligent person, is who made him such a raging feminist.
But he was, by the standards of his place and time.
Tom

 

[Godobeyer]

Unless you had an extremely good reason for divorcing your wife, yes. Note the action there, and specific implied meaning.

'Divorce' is not an implied mutual agreement. This verse /the wisdom of Scripture/, is very apt for the varying divorce laws by culture/country

Ok Where is the exception in verse ?

Why you mention to culture or country law , since we talking about "Divorce" in Luke 16:18 (Christianity) ?

 

[Desert Snake]

Ok Where is the exception in verse ?

Why you mention to culture or country law , since we talking about "Divorce" in Luke 16:18 (Christianity) ?

Different cultures and countries, have different laws concerning who can be 'divorcing' the other person. In places where the woman is the one ''divorcing'', then it would be her to not remarry. There is nothing 'weird' about what is being said/taught; if someone divorces /is the one ''divorcing'', without a good reason, /a very good reason/,

 

[Skwim]

It seems to me that the one attributed to Jesus would at least take precedence.
But they are not really contradictory. Paul isn't addressing divorce.
Tom

The divorced easily fall under the category of "Unmarried."

We don't live in the Jewish Middle East, 2,000 years ago... That seems pretty clear to me.

What difference does this make?

Meaning if you divorce your wife then you have to saty single for the rest of your days?

Or be an adulterer. You've got your choice.

Unless you had an extremely good reason for divorcing your wife, yes. Note the action there, and specific implied meaning.

'Divorce' is not an implied mutual agreement. This verse /the wisdom of Scripture/, is very apt for the varying divorce laws by culture/country

Didn't see any exception mentioned in the Bible. Got a Chapter and verse?

Nothing that Jesus or Paul say in the Bible suggest any problem with remarrying if you don't divorce your first wife.

Other than being a widower, does Christian law allow one to marry a woman while still married to another?

I don't think this is true.
By the standards of the day, women were chattel. Jesus's standards were an improvement. So were Mohammed's.
Today's cultural standards are different and better. If you find yourself married to a violent criminal or serious drug addict, grabbing the kids and filing for divorce are the responsible way to go.
The fact that this wasn't mentioned in the Bible is because Biblical standards and morality are primitive.
Tom

So you're pretty much saying not to take scripture at its word, but look at it in the context of today's mores. Boy, that should make for a good variety show, which of course, is what has happened with Biblical interpretation, what with Christianity's 30,000 to 40,000 denominations.


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[Godobeyer]

What do you mean by ''exception''? If you mean remarraige, that is addressed in the other verse. It states that iti is actually ok for the /woman , in this instance, to remarry. Now, because of that, it infers that that the rule to not remarry, is the one commiting the 'act of divorce'. The 'one ''divorcing''. //Mutual divorce is not implied in the first verse.

You made an exception "Unless you had an extremely good reason ".

from which verse you got that understanding/exception ?

Different cultures and countries, have different laws concerning who can be 'divorcing' the other person. In places where the woman is the one ''divorcing'', then it would be her to not remarry. There is nothing 'weird' about what is being said/taught; if someone divorces without a good reason, /a very good reason/, would you want to marry them?

think about it

Again We are not talking about different culture or countries , we were talking bible verse., got it ?

 

[columbus]

The divorced easily fall under the category of "Unmarried."

Not in the standard culture of 1st century Judea.
Tom

 

[Desert Snake]

Didn't see any exception mentioned in the Bible. Got a Chapter and verse?





.

The first verse implies an exception, /because it refers to the man 'divorcing' the woman. It doesn't say ''divorced people'.

 

[Desert Snake]

Again We are not talking about different culture or countries , we were talking bible verse., got it ?

Huh? These are ''teachings'', they apply to all countries/cultures. Not some fictional idea of what you think was happening in Yisrael and the area, at some point. This is a ''religion'', not a place specific historical treatise

 

[columbus]

The first verse implies an exception, /because it refers to the man 'divorcing' the woman. It doesn't say ''divorced people'.

In order to understand Jesus's teachings you have to put them in the context of a culture that didn't automatically assume personhood for women. It is hard for modern people to grasp that mindset, but it was common then.
Tom

 

[Godobeyer]

Huh? These are ''teachings'', they apply to all countries/cultures. Not some fictional idea of what you think was happening in Yisrael and the area, at some point. This is a ''religion'', not a place specific historical treatise

This is it , we are talking about religion.

 

[Desert Snake]

This is it , we are talking about religion.

These are teachings within a religion, yes.

 

[meghanwaterlillies]

How much do you know about 7th century Arabic culture?
I ask because that is the context in which Mohammed's teachings were delivered.
I'm pretty sure Mohammed's first wife, an extremely strong and intelligent person, is who made him such a raging feminist.
But he was, by the standards of his place and time.
Tom

You'll have to try especially since your comment before was that women were chattel. And then justified it with Muhammad's offenses. So I'm not sure where you got that from if you could make your point clearer about him and his time, meanwhile I'll just post male and female references from him which seems to be a lot more. The only obsession maybe? It seems off balanced not a little. Maybe there is a reason he came up with that, this and that they wrote up his philosophy.
I hope you live forever.
Quran
Quran (4:11) - (Inheritance) "The male shall have the equal of the portion of two females" (see also verse 4:176). In Islam, sexism is mathematically established.
Quran (2:282) - (Court testimony) "And call to witness, from among your men, two witnesses. And if two men be not found then a man and two women." Muslim apologists offer creative explanations to explain why Allah felt that a man's testimony in court should be valued twice as highly as a woman's, but studies consistently show that women are actually less likely to tell lies than men, meaning that they make more reliable witnesses.
Quran (2:228) - "and the men are a degree above them [women]"
Quran (5:6) - "And if ye are unclean, purify yourselves. And if ye are sick or on a journey, or one of you cometh from the closet, or ye have had contact with women, and ye find not water, then go to clean, high ground and rub your faces and your hands with some of it" Men are to rub dirt on their hands, if there is no water to purify them, following casual contact with a woman (such as shaking hands).
Quran (24:31) - Women are to lower their gaze around men, so they do not look them in the eye. (To be fair, men are told to do the same thing in the prior verse).
Quran (2:223) - "Your wives are as a tilth unto you; so approach your tilth when or how ye will..." A man has dominion over his wives' bodies as he does his land. This verse is overtly sexual. There is some dispute as to whether it is referring to the practice of anal intercourse. If this is what Muhammad meant, then it would appear to contradict what he said in Muslim (8:3365).
Quran (4:3) - (Wife-to-husband ratio) "Marry women of your choice, Two or three or four" Inequality by numbers.
Quran (53:27) - "Those who believe not in the Hereafter, name the angels with female names." Angels are sublime beings, and would therefore be male.
Quran (4:24) and Quran (33:50) - A man is permitted to take women as sex slaves outside of marriage. Note that the verse distinguishes wives from captives (those whom they right hand possesses).

 

[Skwim]

Not in the standard culture of 1st century Judea.
Tom

But the Bible that people read today doesn't this cite this qualification, so why assume it applies? I know you're into reading the Bible in the context of the time it was written, but this has never been required or even suggested as the appropriate approach to it. From what I've observed, most Christians read the Bible literally, making no allowances for personal interpretation, or regard some of its more questionable stories as parables and such. OR, simply cherry-pick which of its passages to believe. Few if any delve into the context of the Bible's passages to see if they still apply.

The first verse implies an exception, /because it refers to the man 'divorcing' the woman. It doesn't say ''divorced people'.

Seeking truth asked: "Meaning if you divorce your wife then you have to saty [sic] single for the rest of your days?"

To which you replied: "Unless you had an extremely good reason for divorcing your wife, yes. Note the action there, and specific implied meaning"

And my question was to this point. What "extremely good reason for divorcing your wife" is mentioned in the Bible that would allow one to remarry after divorce? I Didn't see any exception mentioned in the Bible. Got a Chapter and verse?


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[columbus]

You'll have to try especially since your comment before was that women were chattel.

I'll have to try what "especially"?
To be honest, I didn't really understand much of your post to me. Could you be more clear?
Tom

 

[meghanwaterlillies]

How much do you know about 7th century Arabic culture?
I ask because that is the context in which Mohammed's teachings were delivered.
I'm pretty sure Mohammed's first wife, an extremely strong and intelligent person, is who made him such a raging feminist.
But he was, by the standards of his place and time.
Tom

I would more from here of what you mean.

 

[meghanwaterlillies]

I don't think this is true.
By the standards of the day, women were chattel. Jesus's standards were an improvement. So were Mohammed's.
Today's cultural standards are different and better. If you find yourself married to a violent criminal or serious drug addict, grabbing the kids and filing for divorce are the responsible way to go.
The fact that this wasn't mentioned in the Bible is because Biblical standards and morality are primitive.
Tom

And here where you said women were chattel and then jumped to mohammeds as improvement
I said I don't see how that is? Did it just bring it back around the same way?

 

[meghanwaterlillies]

I hate neronian Pythagoras in religion or concept they may ruin both.

 

[seeking the truth]

Today's cultural standards are different and better. If you find yourself married to a violent criminal or serious drug addict, grabbing the kids and filing for divorce are the responsible way to go.
The fact that this wasn't mentioned in the Bible is because Biblical standards and morality are primitive.Tom

The above is my take and what I have been trying to say to people for a long time, that the bible could not address every single situation and there are many so decision to divorce should be based on each individual's special circumstance and situation.

 

[columbus]

The above is my take and what I have been trying to say to people for a long time, that the bible could not address every single situation and there are many so decision to divorce should be based on each individual's special circumstance and situation.

I agree. Which is why I am not really a Christian.
The Bible is important, but It is not Truth.
It is what primitive people thought about a narrow range of subjects.
Tom

 

[URAVIP2ME]

You made an exception "Unless you had an extremely good reason ".
from which verse you got that understanding/exception ?
Again We are not talking about different culture or countries , we were talking bible verse., got it ?

Jesus gave the basis, an extremely good reason, for scriptural divorce found at Matthew 5:32 and Matthew 19:9
Please notice that Jesus did Not use the word adultery, but the word fornication ( Greek Porneia ) as grounds for scriptural divorce.
The reason ' porneia ' (English fornication) is used is because porneia is more comprehensive in meaning than the word adultery.
Porneia includes more than sex before marriage, because it includes all perverted sex acts including having sex with an animal would be scriptural grounds for divorce.
We even get the word pornography ( porn ) from the Greek word porneia.
So, being involved in the practice of pornography could also be scriptural grounds for divorce.