Question

[Kori Houghton]

Well it is a complicated situation. In theory the LHP is about betterment of our species, which is pretty much as close to destruction and hitting bottom as it can go. The philosophies are based around individuality, evolution, freedom, etc. The problems we face mainly arise from heirarchy, power, control, enslavement, demonization, and so forth. The problem is that, in general, the LHP is as dogmatic, silly, and unevolved as we view the RHP. It dogmatically enforces individuality, it enslaves you to its freedom, stuff like that. Look through this DIR and you will find equally disturbing content, dogmatic thought, primitive concepts, reason abandoning philosophies, etc as in a fundy Christian DIR.

I'm preparing for some other LHPers to rip my face off, that happens when you stand out against dogma. My ideas contradict the generally set values of the LHP. They know how I feel and why I rarely come into the DIR anymore.

It would not be LHP to rip someone's face off for expressing their opinion.

I know what you mean about some statements posted here that seem dogmatic (maybe I'd say doctrinal, though, rather than dogmatic) about concepts which are really best left to be defined by the individual. I don't think you can be truly free if you are following a path with doctrines which try to precisely define concepts like freedom, individuality, and the meaning of life in general.

 

[1137]

It would not be LHP to rip someone's face off for expressing their opinion.

You caught onto the point hehe.

I know what you mean about some statements posted here that seem dogmatic (maybe I'd say doctrinal, though, rather than dogmatic) about concepts which are really best left to be defined by the individual. I don't think you can be truly free if you are following a path with doctrines which try to precisely define concepts like freedom, individuality, and the meaning of life in general.

Yes, doctrinal would perhaps be a better word.

 

[Orias]

You own, subjective experience Orias. We know nothing about each other besides what is related to religion / LHP. Now, that may be all you are but there is much more to me than this. You have no idea who I am, my personality, my likes and dislikes, my hobbies, who I spend my time with, what kind of student I am, what kind of worker I am... You don't know me nearly well enough to make that judgement. But then again, I get such things from other religious fanatics...

You're right in all of this except for one thing, you respond to me.

I may not possess the knowledge of how "you are" around other people, but I do read thoroughly and I do understand that you think we know why you don't post in this DIR because of how you "feel", as if that is supposed to imply anything more meaningful to us readers. I DO THE SAME THING.

I also understand that in a place like this, even if you're being jerk here its somewhat sincere. You care enough to put in your two cents worth, which is all any and all of us here should ask for.

The rest is just...being human.

We have CoS, ToS, Order of the Phosphorus, many many more that I couldn't care less about looking up.

Thats probably because you think you know more

You specifically said

I think the reason for its justification was something I tried to emphasis more, but then I guess one could read it literally.

But, again, same as you find in all other DIRs. Believe what you want, what makes you comfortable, hold it against others who disagree, build up your arrogance based on your own subjective correctness, inform everyone else how wrong and inexperienced they are. Well I'm tired of it. Bless you my child... Oh wait wrong DIR

And somehow inexperienced is a viable basis for wrong

You're not going anywhere, you take it on the chin and return like everyone else. Eventually you just learn to dodge while engaging instead of just dodging by not engaging.

I never said that you were wrong, just that you have a lot to learn. That is not to say that I don't have just as much to learn though.

 

[1137]

See, the LHP in many case has the same issues. The subjective being seens as objective, like the arrogance and superiority. Not to mention the settling. You pick a lable and grow around that, for your own reasons of course. It's just all ridiculous and tiring. You are no different than a fundy Christian Orias, except for your symbolism.

 

[Orias]

And here you go, using your subjective experience to objectify your need to be superior and call others arrogant.

Over the years, I've learned that arrogant people usually think other people are arrogant. Its all inherit and instinctual, dominance. If you can't handle it here I guess you should go to more shallow waters.

You have your fantasies that you revolve around as well. You're just calling me Christian because I believe in something that will eventually crush us both, and you think you can survive it.

Whatever bro.

 

[1137]

And here you go, using your subjective experience to objectify your need to be superior and call others arrogant.

I did nothing of the sort. I pointed out your own arrogance that you see as objectove because of subjective belief. We all fall victim to it, it's recognizing it that matters. You literally, straight up say how superior and more experienced you are and then accuse me of arrogance hahaha.

Over the years, I've learned that arrogant people usually think other people are arrogant. Its all inherit and instinctual, dominance. If you can't handle it here I guess you should go to more shallow waters.

See above. I think I handle it just fine, I'm not the one having a meltdown becuase my dogma was questioned and I was forced to look in the mirror.

You have your fantasies that you revolve around as well. You're just calling me Christian because I believe in something that will eventually crush us both, and you think you can survive it.

Yes, we all have subjective beliefs. As said, it's about recognizing that. I did not call you a Christian, I compared you to one. This whole response just reinforces that comparison. You're turning a blind eye to yourself, getting wrapped up in subjective superiority, throwing out fallacy and baseless arguments and then...

Whatever bro.

.... Storming off.

 

[1137]

And here you go, using your subjective experience to objectify your need to be superior and call others arrogant.

I did nothing of the sort. I pointed out your own arrogance that you see as objectove because of subjective belief. We all fall victim to it, it's recognizing it that matters. You literally, straight up say how superior and more experienced you are and then accuse me of arrogance hahaha.

Over the years, I've learned that arrogant people usually think other people are arrogant. Its all inherit and instinctual, dominance. If you can't handle it here I guess you should go to more shallow waters.

See above. I think I handle it just fine, I'm not the one having a meltdown becuase my dogma was questioned and I was forced to look in the mirror.

You have your fantasies that you revolve around as well. You're just calling me Christian because I believe in something that will eventually crush us both, and you think you can survive it.

Yes, we all have subjective beliefs. As said, it's about recognizing that. I did not call you a Christian, I compared you to one. This whole response just reinforces that comparison. You're turning a blind eye to yourself, assuming your beliefs are superior, getting wrapped up in subjective superiority, throwing out fallacy and baseless arguments and then...

Whatever bro.

.... Storming off.

 

[Orias]

I did nothing of the sort. I pointed out your own arrogance that you see as objectove because of subjective belief. We all fall victim to it, it's recognizing it that matters. You literally, straight up say how superior and more experienced you are and then accuse me of arrogance hahaha.

And here you go again, this time while admitting it after you deny it, that you are using your own subjective experience to objectify your need to be superior and call others arrogant.

And no, I think it was I told you that I am more experienced than you, then you called me arrogant and I just said thats an arrogant thing to say. I mean truth can be hard to accept at times. If this wasn't evident I would say that your bouts of leaving the forum/DIR and constant indecision would make it clear to you.

See above. I think I handle it just fine, I'm not the one having a meltdown becuase my dogma was questioned and I was forced to look in the mirror.

Ah, but I am always looking in the mirror. Are you?

Yes, we all have subjective beliefs. As said, it's about recognizing that. I did not call you a Christian, I compared you to one. This whole response just reinforces that comparison. You're turning a blind eye to yourself, assuming your beliefs are superior, getting wrapped up in subjective superiority, throwing out fallacy and baseless arguments and then...

I'm sorry "You're no different than a fundy Christian" isn't really a comparison on your behalf, considering the setting you placed behind it.

I don't think you realize what you are trying to expound upon here.

.... Storming off.

You seem to have been doing that on and off recently, almost like we care that you are leaving because of "how you feel" about the LHP and how you actually feel about it.

You double posted IMO, calm down a little.

Lets face it, its easy to pick at differences but this is no place to argue and you certainly aren't going to get your point across to me because its the same point I'm trying to get across to you. Just remember how this started now and just remember we can go back and edit previous posts.

 

[1137]

And here you go again, this time while admitting it after you deny it, that you are using your own subjective experience to objectify your need to be superior and call others arrogant.

Is hard to think I once respected you with all this roundabout bs. You labled yourself arrogant / superior and then claim I subjectively interpreted it?

And no, I think it was I told you that I am more experienced than you, then you called me arrogant and I just said thats an arrogant thing to say. I mean truth can be hard to accept at times. If this wasn't evident I would say that your bouts of leaving the forum/DIR and constant indecision would make it clear to you.

Claiming yourself superior is arrogant. Apparently the truth is hard to accept, look at this meltdown you are having! My "indecision" is refusal to lay down and die. I refuse to pick a lable and follow it. Could I just decide to be a Satanist? Sure, I have forced myself to follow many things. But the truth isn't found in being still. Sadly, some aggression is caused by certain issues I have (which you have been diagnosed with also ). But of you're going to say the truth is hard to accept / look in the mirror, I'm not the one so seeking of comfort to deny my issues exist!

Ah, but I am always looking in the mirror. Are you?

Over reaching. Why must you deny your flaws? Nobody is perfect, nobody is always looking in the mirror. And there's nothing wrong with that! You're human, not a God. Make peace with it.

I'm sorry "You're no different than a fundy Christian" isn't really a comparison on your behalf, considering the setting you placed behind it.

I don't think you realize what you are trying to expound upon here.

I'm not sure what you are getting at. I'd think an LHPer would enjoy the adversity, being called out on their flaws. I see the one-sidedness as very RHP.

You seem to have been doing that on and off recently, almost like we care that you are leaving because of "how you feel" about the LHP and how you actually feel about it.

I didn't mean to infer you know what I am thinking. I hope fellow members like Adramalek are insulted at you believing they are too stupid to be aware of our quarrels. Such as Set, for example. Just because you may be lost in the depths of that mind does not mean others are so unaware of this DIRs internal disagreements haha.

You double posted IMO, calm down a little.

Yes, you're nothing like those RHPers who use gramatical mistakes in light of no argument.

Lets face it, its easy to pick at differences but this is no place to argue and you certainly aren't going to get your point across to me because its the same point I'm trying to get across to you. Just remember how this started now and just remember we can go back and edit previous posts.

I don't think that we are making the same point, but I am not going to force one to look at themselves. As long as it causes no harm, peopld can do and believe what they want. All I can do is try and enlighten. In the end it doesn't matter much.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

does not the things in the beliefs ultimate lead to the destruction in any way of our species?

According to Psalm [92v7] it will be only the wicked who are destroyed forever.

In the end, so to speak, it's the humble meek people who will forever inherit the inhabited earth.

 

[Orias]

Is hard to think I once respected you with all this roundabout bs. You labled yourself arrogant / superior and then claim I subjectively interpreted it?

What?

I simply said you're no different

Claiming yourself superior is arrogant. Apparently the truth is hard to accept, look at this meltdown you are having! My "indecision" is refusal to lay down and die. I refuse to pick a lable and follow it. Could I just decide to be a Satanist? Sure, I have forced myself to follow many things. But the truth isn't found in being still. Sadly, some aggression is caused by certain issues I have (which you have been diagnosed with also ). But of you're going to say the truth is hard to accept / look in the mirror, I'm not the one so seeking of comfort to deny my issues exist!

First of all, I never denied anything, second of all I never asked you to just lay down and die and third of all I don't deny the reality of my issues. These are probably all personal inclinations that are more relative to you, since I never brought any of these up.

If your trying to prove something to me then you should make it more clear, or does me calling you an equal make you more satisfied?

The LHP thrives on development of the strong.

Over reaching. Why must you deny your flaws? Nobody is perfect, nobody is always looking in the mirror. And there's nothing wrong with that! You're human, not a God. Make peace with it.

I do ironically enough, make every post in reflection of myself and how I would apply what is being discussed.

And yes, I am the one over reaching while attempting to tell someone else to look in the mirror, almost like its water.

I'm not sure what you are getting at. I'd think an LHPer would enjoy the adversity, being called out on their flaws. I see the one-sidedness as very RHP.

You obviously meant to insult me.

If you take being called "inexperienced" as an insult then you obviously have a lot more to learn.

I didn't mean to infer you know what I am thinking. I hope fellow members like Adramalek are insulted at you believing they are too stupid to be aware of our quarrels. Such as Set, for example. Just because you may be lost in the depths of that mind does not mean others are so unaware of this DIRs internal disagreements haha.

This doesn't even make sense.

Why would I think Adramalek is stupid for him being aware of our quarrels? What does this have to do with anything and why would you drag a dear friend of mine into this conversation?

I think you're being stupid because you are.

Yes, you're nothing like those RHPers who use gramatical mistakes in light of no argument.

Yea too bad its not a grammatical error?

Do you even understand the purpose of this entire conversation?

Your wasting your time and emotion, your haste is leaving you sloppy.

I don't think that we are making the same point, but I am not going to force one to look at themselves. As long as it causes no harm, peopld can do and believe what they want. All I can do is try and enlighten. In the end it doesn't matter much.

Ok then, whats your point?

Mine is that you are inexperienced and have a lot to learn about the LHP.

You say that your values contradict the values of the LHP and then continue to say that its not you thats contradicting the values of the LHP. This doesn't even make sense.

 

[Iti oj]

Look at the LHP as more of a human potential movement.

Yeah that's how I feel about it, ohh I might use this

 

[Iti oj]

Well it is a complicated situation. In theory the LHP is about betterment of our species, which is pretty much as close to destruction and hitting bottom as it can go. The philosophies are based around individuality, evolution, freedom, etc. The problems we face mainly arise from heirarchy, power, control, enslavement, demonization, and so forth. The problem is that, in general, the LHP is as dogmatic, silly, and unevolved as we view the RHP. It dogmatically enforces individuality, it enslaves you to its freedom, stuff like that. Look through this DIR and you will find equally disturbing content, dogmatic thought, primitive concepts, reason abandoning philosophies, etc as in a fundy Christian DIR.

I'm preparing for some other LHPers to rip my face off, that happens when you stand out against dogma. My ideas contradict the generally set values of the LHP. They know how I feel and why I rarely come into the DIR anymore.

Yeah I kinda feel you on that. I dont vibe much with the subdir. Ha me and mr awe in therefore midst of developing a new satanic religion. Then we can post in the satanism dir southpark satan told me to do it

 

[1137]

What?

I simply said you're no different

I never claimed to be different.

First of all, I never denied anything, second of all I never asked you to just lay down and die and third of all I don't the deny reality of my issues. These are probably all personal inclinations that are more relative to you, since I never brought any of these up.

As I quoted from your own words, you claimed that bi-polar disorder does not exist. Then, of course, you tried to cover your tracks by saying not to take what you say literally. Well, then how can I take it? Don't say what you do not mean, common intelligence. I never said you told me to lay down and die, I criticized your criticism about how I am "indecisive". Well, sorry but you apparently are not as omniscient as you think. I have believed that same thing for many years, I have argued many different perspectives to understand them and question myself. If your idea of experience is following one narrow path under one label, I do not care that you think me inexperienced. Again, trying to turn this around to say this is how I feel is ridiculous. How could me straight up admitting to being bi-polar possibly mean that I deny my issues?

If your trying to prove something to me then you should make it more clear, or does me calling you an equal make you more satisfied?

Equal is subjective. We are both human, so there we are equal. What makes us more so is subjective. Like experience. You think that staying with one label, following one course, arguing from one perspective, and believing you are the be all end all is experience. I strongly disagree.

The LHP thrives on development of the strong.

I agree with that in many ways. It depends what you see strength as though. Myself, I see as very strong. I have survived many hardships and come out much stronger. I have fought against myself on a constant basis, questioned everything I believe, relooked through all my arguments, etc. That is strength, in my opinion. Like I said, yours may be holding your ground in the face of defeat and harm to your ego / pride, but I disagree. See, there is this idea that we LHPers are all about pride and ego. That is why so many debated about Thelema being LHP or not arise. But I think balance is more LHP.

I do ironically enough, make every post in reflection of myself and how I would apply what is being discussed.

Interesting.

And yes, I am the one over reaching while attempting to tell someone else to look in the mirror, almost like its water.

Well, whatever you need to do. I realize that looking in the mirror is not the whole picture. Isn't solipsism a sin in LaVey's dogmatic Satanism?

You obviously meant to insult me.

If you take being called "inexperienced" as an insult then you obviously have a lot more to learn.

I'm not sure how, I stated an opinion on LHP vs RHP. I have found that it is relatively basic psychology that one who Self obsessed takes everything to be directly about them.

This doesn't even make sense.

Why would I think Adramalek is stupid for him being aware of our quarrels? What does this have to do with anything and why would you drag a dear friend of mine into this conversation?

I said that I did not mean to infer you know what I am thinking. You are acting like it is a big surprise that I disagree with ideas in this DIR. It is because I said that you all know why I spend a scarce amount of time here. I said that I did not mean you all know every thought of mine. But if you think that our brothers are stupid enough to not realize we have serious and obvious issues with each others philosophies sometimes, I take great insult to that. Some of the most intelligent people I know are here, and the fact that you think they are so stupid as to not realize I, personally, have issues with many topics here is disgusting.

I think you're being stupid because you are.

Said the mature, experience, superior, demi-God. Yeah, I'm not into your idea of superiority.

Yea too bad its not a grammatical error?

I said "Yes, you're nothing like those RHPers who use gramatical mistakes in light of no argument." Comparison, a useful tool you cannot seem to wrap your head around. I didn't call double posting a grammatical error, I was saying that pointing out such an irrelevant thing to stroke your own ego is as pathetic as those who do it with grammatical errors.

Do you even understand the purpose of this entire conversation?

The original thread was to discuss if the LHP is positive or negative on humanity as a whole. Our discussion started because I of my first post in the thread and the fact that you seem to be quite incapable of handling an adversary.

Your wasting your time and emotion, your haste is leaving you sloppy.

I don't see sloppiness in my posts. If you'd like me to walk away, if that would be easier for you, just ask.

Ok then, whats your point?

Mine is that you are inexperienced and have a lot to learn about the LHP.

You say that your values contradict the values of the LHP and then continue to say that its not you thats contradicting the values of the LHP. This doesn't even make sense.

Yes, with my diverse experience, lack of childish insults, habit of staying on topic, and dedication to being the adversary at all times (even against myself), I can totally see why you think you are superior . If you used critical reading skills here, you would see I said my ideas contradict the generally set values of the LHP. There is a great difference between what you think I said and what I actually did. But hey, whatever is going to help you sleep at night...

 

[1137]

In general here: I think that the Satanic aspect of the LHP, the adversarial thought, is the foundation. Then we have the Luciferian aspect (dedication to knowledge) and the Setian aspect (which I see as mastery of Self). But the adversary does not mean picking a point against the herds and holding it. No, adversity is constant. I think to be an adversary you have to argue from all points, at least be able to. You have to be willing to lose, you have to be willing to respect and listen. I stated my adversarial thoughts towards the LHP as it generally is, and as I predicted I was met with zombie like resistance for not falling in line.

Personally, I find it much more useful and enjoyable to try and strengthen weak points, especially if they don't agree with yours. That, along with being wrong, is one of the best ways to learn. Once you believe that your uniqueness makes you fundamentally superior you have lost. This also ties in with my agreement that LHP and RHP are useless labels in the long run. If you pick one you settle, you die, you make permanent adversaries.

 

[Orias]

I never claimed to be different.

Then stop acting like my subjective interpretation is meant for you to believe in objectively, because you said "we all do it". Note how many times I told you to not take things so literally.

As I quoted from your own words, you claimed that bi-polar disorder does not exist. Then, of course, you tried to cover your tracks by saying not to take what you say literally. Well, then how can I take it?

You can take it not so literally. I already cleared this position up, its more of a social disease or lever. A justification for one to behave in ways that are not advocated by social norms.

Don't say what you do not mean, common intelligence. I never said you told me to lay down and die, I criticized your criticism about how I am "indecisive". Well, sorry but you apparently are not as omniscient as you think. I have believed that same thing for many years, I have argued many different perspectives to understand them and question myself. If your idea of experience is following one narrow path under one label, I do not care that you think me inexperienced. Again, trying to turn this around to say this is how I feel is ridiculous. How could me straight up admitting to being bi-polar [/COLOR]possibly mean that I deny my issues?

Omniscient?

Wow dude you have a lot of beef with taking things so literally. I mean get real, your indecisive nature is evident in your posts and constant changing of your profile.

My idea of experience involves finishing a goal and motive that is started before beginning another. The rest of this is just whacko emotion "I'm offended by you" which is understandable considering the hole you keep digging yourself into. Experience is defined by totality more specifically, so the rest is pretty much irrelevant.

Equal is subjective. We are both human, so there we are equal. What makes us more so is subjective. Like experience. You think that staying with one label, following one course, arguing from one perspective, and believing you are the be all end all is experience. I strongly disagree.

If we are both equal and equal is subjective, and what makes us is even more so subjective, how can you say that we are then equal?

I do argue from one perspective, my perspective, as if you could truly understand a perspective other than your own.

I agree with that in many ways. It depends what you see strength as though. Myself, I see as very strong. I have survived many hardships and come out much stronger. I have fought against myself on a constant basis, questioned everything I believe, relooked through all my arguments, etc. That is strength, in my opinion. Like I said, yours may be holding your ground in the face of defeat and harm to your ego / pride, but I disagree. See, there is this idea that we LHPers are all about pride and ego. That is why so many debated about Thelema being LHP or not arise. But I think balance is more LHP.

The mind revolves around the ego, whether or not one choses to feed to suppress one is doing so because it is a desire of the ego.

You list your qualifications for strength, I say there is more to strength than just being able to survive.

Interesting.

Well, whatever you need to do. I realize that looking in the mirror is not the whole picture. Isn't solipsism a sin in LaVey's dogmatic Satanism?

Well that depends on how big your mirror is.

And as a Satanist I sin daily, so what? Are you projecting yourself to be less attune then me?

I'm not sure how, I stated an opinion on LHP vs RHP. I have found that it is relatively basic psychology that one who Self obsessed takes everything to be directly about them.

Narcism is a common human characteristic. So you're calling yourself narcissistic?

I'm okay with that.

I said that I did not mean to infer you know what I am thinking. You are acting like it is a big surprise that I disagree with ideas in this DIR. It is because I said that you all know why I spend a scarce amount of time here. I said that I did not mean you all know every thought of mine. But if you think that our brothers are stupid enough to not realize we have serious and obvious issues with each others philosophies sometimes, I take great insult to that. Some of the most intelligent people I know are here, and the fact that you think they are so stupid as to not realize I, personally, have issues with many topics here is disgusting.

I don't think its a surprise at all that you disagree with ideas in this DIR, I've noticed it in the past months. Maybe you've actually noticed that I've noticed.

And I still don't understand your broken sentence here, I'm with you on some of the smartest people being on the forum here and that our philosophies can be conflictual at points but I lost you at the point where they became stupid as to not realize that you personally have issues with many topics here.

Said the mature, experience, superior, demi-God. Yeah, I'm not into your idea of superiority.

Because its oppositional to your idea of superiority?

Whats more superior?

Are these waters your truly wish to swim in?

I said "Yes, you're nothing like those RHPers who use gramatical mistakes in light of no argument." Comparison, a useful tool you cannot seem to wrap your head around. I didn't call double posting a grammatical error, I was saying that pointing out such an irrelevant thing to stroke your own ego is as pathetic as those who do it with grammatical errors.

It does stroke my ego, clearly you couldn't click the "submit reply" button enough times, in reference to your obvious mistakes that you don't commonly make.

Don't think that I'm not aware of your writing style.

The original thread was to discuss if the LHP is positive or negative on humanity as a whole. Our discussion started because I of my first post in the thread and the fact that you seem to be quite incapable of handling an adversary

No, our original discussion was about how the LHP is conflictive with your personal values.

And thats funny you say that, I generally tend to think that others are incapable of handling me as an adversary. The posts did grow in length and drudgery after your responses I might add, but obviously throwing more into the fire just feeds it.

I don't see sloppiness in my posts. If you'd like me to walk away, if that would be easier for you, just ask.

Thats not very adversarial like of me. When I oppose things I usually like to destroy them without giving them the chance to walk away.

With that being said, thats always an option that is available at the beginning.

Yes, with my diverse experience, lack of childish insults, habit of staying on topic, and dedication to being the adversary at all times (even against myself), I can totally see why you think you are superior . If you used critical reading skills here, you would see I said my ideas contradict the generally set values of the LHP. There is a great difference between what you think I said and what I actually did. But hey, whatever is going to help you sleep at night...

So you do not value your ideas?

If your ideas are conflictive with the general "LHP" then are values also not conflictive with them? There is some type of value that your ideas seem to be missing here that is not allowing you to be accepting of your own nature.

Come on dude I shouldn't have to spell everything out for you. I think there is a bigger difference between what you said and what you meant it to mean.

Other than that I never insulted you and I never said I was more superior than you. That is you, just simply stroking your own ego.

 

[Orias]

I stated my adversarial thoughts towards the LHP as it generally is, and as I predicted I was met with zombie like resistance for not falling in line.

Thats kind of like hitting on someone and then when they catch on and do the same thing you just did to them, you freak out and ask what the hell they are doing.

Its also like saying, "I'm going to say these things that are obviously conflictive with the general understanding of an aspect as if its an actual general application and then see if any of the actual believers point it out".

Do I need to go further, I mean being a zombie is actually a fantasy of mine :bat:

 

[1137]

Then stop acting like my subjective interpretation is meant for you to believe in objectively, because you said "we all do it". Note how many times I told you to not take things so literally.

Well I'm not, but ok. I said repeatedly that is is subjective, the point is recognizing that. You are not superior objectively, so you are not superior at all. There is more that just your mind, so I was saying to tone down the arrogance and nothing more. It is only valid to you, not in discussion. If you do not mean what you say, I do not want to waste my time interpreting.

You can take it not so literally. I already cleared this position up, its more of a social disease or lever. A justification for one to behave in ways that are not advocated by social norms.

Don't say what you do not mean, is it that hard?

Wow dude you have a lot of beef with taking things so literally. I mean get real, your indecisive nature is evident in your posts and constant changing of your profile.

Yes, I expect people to say what they mean (for the hundredth time) rather than dancing around and speaking nonsense that they expect me to have an interpreter for. My profile reflects what I am arguing for currently, not what I believe. My beliefs cannot be summed up by a label. The first thing I think I ever said on this forum was not to assume what I believe, because I speak from everywhere. I evolve, you seem to not wish to, that is fine. I look for strengths everywhere and eradicate the weaknesses. If you are so against this, do not do it.

My idea of experience involves finishing a goal and motive that is started before beginning another. The rest of this is just whacko emotion "I'm offended by you" which is understandable considering the hole you keep digging yourself into.

I am actually not offended by you, you do not have the ability to offend me. This is simply because I am not easily offended, don't let it sting too much. Obviously you missed the OP, because this did not start as a conversation between us. If it is more comfortable for you to see me as failing and flailing so be it.

If we are both equal and equal is subjective, and what makes us is even more so subjective, how can you say that we are then equal?

I didn't. Seriously, critical reading class.

I do argue from one perspective, my perspective, as if you could truly understand a perspective other than your own.

That is not what I am saying and you know it (actually... maybe not). Obviously we can only argue from internally, we only know ourselves. But what I mean is I did not slap "Satanist" on myself and then argue with that as a foundation. I argue from many views to understand them and take what I need.

The mind revolves around the ego, whether or not one choses to feed to suppress one is doing so because it is a desire of the ego.

You list your qualifications for strength, I say there is more to strength than just being able to survive.

Actually, the ego revolves around the mind. Humans are one of the only animals we know of with a mind and self-awareness (which leads to ego).

And as a Satanist I sin daily, so what? Are you projecting yourself to be less attune then me?

Here's a show of dogma, the whole concept of sin. Your beliefs admittedly rely on Christian beliefs, the idea of sin.

Narcism is a common human characteristic. So you're calling yourself narcissistic?

I'm okay with that.

Yep, you argue like a highly evolved superior being. I can't even tell if you just childishly threw this in or really did not understand what I am saying. I posted an opinion on LHP vs RHP and you took it for a personal insult. I said that is because of your ego issues and you pretty much said "no you".

I don't think its a surprise at all that you disagree with ideas in this DIR, I've noticed it in the past months. Maybe you've actually noticed that I've noticed.

And I still don't understand your broken sentence here, I'm with you on some of the smartest people being on the forum here and that our philosophies can be conflictual at points but I lost you at the point where they became stupid as to not realize that you personally have issues with many topics here.

I am starting to doubt you are able to understand. You have missed the point 4 times now, I believe. You seriously answer your own confusion. I simply said that people on this DIR are well aware of disagreements they and I have had, and nothing more. How is that so confusing?

Because its oppositional to your idea of superiority?

Whats more superior?

Are these waters your truly wish to swim in?

No, because it is not superior in any way. Hows is childishly calling someone stupid make you farther evolved / superior. Yes, I see that subjectively as pathetic, but I am used to it as the majority of the world turns to such things when challenged. I am not sure what waters you think we are getting into.

It does stroke my ego, clearly you couldn't click the "submit reply" button enough times, in reference to your obvious mistakes that you don't commonly make.

Oh man you got me!! A glitch in technology definitely means that you have me tripping up, shaking, crying in a corner ready to lash out in fear. Ridiculous, completely ridiculous. This is where ego becomes counter-productive.

Don't think that I'm not aware of your writing style.

That's flattering. You should be intelligent enough to realize that a mistake that has never occurred from me on this forum is more likely due to issues beyond my control.

No, our original discussion was about how the LHP is conflictive with your personal values.

Ours, yes. The original discussion at hand, no.

And thats funny you say that, I generally tend to think that others are incapable of handling me as an adversary. The posts did grow in length and drudgery after your responses I might add, but obviously throwing more into the fire just feeds it.

Thats not very adversarial like of me. When I oppose things I usually like to destroy them without giving them the chance to walk away.

I see no issues with it. I answer thoroughly, another thing I perceive subjectively as superior that seems to bug you. I doubt you have destroyed things. You can present facts to people and they will hold their beliefs. That is what you need to realize, that you have less power than you wish. I couldn't care less about destroying, I care about planting that seed of doubt. Only you can destroy what is in your own head. I thought you would realize that.

So you do not value your ideas?

More BS I never said. Did you ever think that you "destroy arguments" because you put words into the opposing side's mouth? That style (or lack there of) of arguing won't work on me. I never said I do not value my ideas.

If your ideas are conflictive with the general "LHP" then are values also not conflictive with them? There is some type of value that your ideas seem to be missing here that is not allowing you to be accepting of your own nature.

GENERALLY SET VALUES, as in generalization. I do not think the LHP, in pure form, has much set at all, let alone values.

Come on dude I shouldn't have to spell everything out for you. I think there is a bigger difference between what you said and what you meant it to mean.

Other than that I never insulted you and I never said I was more superior than you. That is you, just simply stroking your own ego.

Comes back to the previously mentioned critical reading skills. You put words into my mouth, misrepresent my position, do all this ridiculous crap, and then say I am having issues? I never thought you insulted me, and apparently you forgot saying that you are more experienced (oh wait, I am not supposed to take anything you say literally...). Stroking my ego, perhaps as it is unavoidable.

Thats kind of like hitting on someone and then when they catch on and do the same thing you just did them, you freak out and ask what the hell they are doing.

I am not the one who started a debate because someone called me out on my own nature. What is getting to me is all your nonsensical tactics. Putting words in my mouth, twisting them, not understanding the simplest of things and then pretending like it is I who is having the issues. "I am rubber, you are glue" may have worked in 1st grade, but you're wasting it on me.

 

[1137]

Its also like saying, "I'm going to say these things that are obviously conflictive with the general understanding of an aspect as if its an actual general application and then see if any of the actual believers point it out".

Do I need to go further, I mean being a zombie is actually a fantasy of mine :bat:

"Actual believers"? Yeah, no dogmatic thinking here, is there. Just because half the LHP is made up of people reading The Satanic Bible and throwing our LaVey quotes does not mean it is the way to go. Lose the herd mentality. I barely consider such people LHP, it defeats the purpose. I have much respect for many of the Traditional Satanists and such, this is because they tend to be permanent adversaries as well as highly educated and individual. But hey, if you are an actual believer how can I argue with you? I'm just a heretic.

Yeah.... you're not a sheep at all huh... Well, actual believers shouldn't talk with heretics.

 

[Orias]

Actually, the ego revolves around the mind. Humans are one of the only animals we know of with a mind and self-awareness (which leads to ego).

This is untrue, other animals are completely aware of themselves.

My dog for example recognizes pain, he doesn't go in the street because he knows car are bad. If I can teach it to him then its obviously inherit in all of them, its just a matter of understanding the psychology.

And again the mind revolves around the ego, as the mind simply requires "food"

(satisfaction)

Here's a show of dogma, the whole concept of sin. Your beliefs admittedly rely on Christian beliefs, the idea of sin.

Yes and you're dogma has been properly displayed as well throughout this entire conversation.

My beliefs do not rely on Christian beliefs, what I do is something Christians call sin that they believe in. I mean it doesn't take an intellectual to realize that the Seven Deadly Sins are man's most observable characteristics.

That doesn't mean I rely on them.

You know what Christian beliefs rely on? All of the other beliefs before them, same as everyones beliefs.

Yep, you argue like a highly evolved superior being. I can't even tell if you just childishly threw this in or really did not understand what I am saying. I posted an opinion on LHP vs RHP and you took it for a personal insult. I said that is because of your ego issues and you pretty much said "no you".

What does another thread have to do with the conversation I'm trying to have with you now?

You insulted me here, in this thread. I don't care what happened between us in other threads as that is not relevant. Unless your trying to reveal some sort of egotistical stand up here with some things you probably took as offensive in past threads.

But if thats so then why don't you just say it? There is something here you aren't telling me, because all of these "points" you threw at me have nothing to do with this "ultimate" point of yours.

I mean come on here, WHAT IS THE POINT?

I am starting to doubt you are able to understand. You have missed the point 4 times now, I believe. You seriously answer your own confusion. I simply said that people on this DIR are well aware of disagreements they and I have had, and nothing more. How is that so confusing?

Its confusing because theres so many goal posts.

I mean, its not that confusing as there is an obviousness that rings about. Though its not something for words, even though we both did skim the surface.

No, because it is not superior in any way. Hows is childishly calling someone stupid make you farther evolved / superior. Yes, I see that subjectively as pathetic, but I am used to it as the majority of the world turns to such things when challenged. I am not sure what waters you think we are getting into.

Well why is it childish?

Stupidity is a real thing. If its you think its childish then you yourself have stupefied your argument.

Oh man you got me!! A glitch in technology definitely means that you have me tripping up, shaking, crying in a corner ready to lash out in fear. Ridiculous, completely ridiculous. This is where ego becomes counter-productive.

Yea, "glitch", do you think I'm trying to scare you?

This must be a huge psychological endeavor for the both of us then.

That's flattering. You should be intelligent enough to realize that a mistake that has never occurred from me on this forum is more likely due to issues beyond my control.

Sure, if thats what you want to say. I've never seen you this out of hand.

Ours, yes. The original discussion at hand, no.

The original discussion is only relevant because its a clear demonstration of what two members can do to each other.

I see no issues with it. I answer thoroughly, another thing I perceive subjectively as superior that seems to bug you. I doubt you have destroyed things. You can present facts to people and they will hold their beliefs. That is what you need to realize, that you have less power than you wish. I couldn't care less about destroying, I care about planting that seed of doubt. Only you can destroy what is in your own head. I thought you would realize that.

Well I'm not going to confirm any destruction that I've done to people but you are one the lighter side of the shell.

You talk about planting a seed of doubt, well to make way for a new birth something has to be ravished. Destroyed, so I do realize that but I also realize that you can change a person by the words you say.

Lets not call that destruction though, but evolution.

More BS I never said. Did you ever think that you "destroy arguments" because you put words into the opposing side's mouth? That style (or lack there of) of arguing won't work on me. I never said I do not value my ideas.

I'm not saying you said any of this by the way, its the best I can get out of these one liners you keep trying to throw me.

But yea if your values didn't contradict the LHP then you wouldn't see a reason to not partake in them. And yea generally when you contradict someone they have a tendency to weaken a little, they strengthen themselves by posting back.

But then they can still get a little carried away :faint:

GENERALLY SET VALUES, as in generalization. I do not think the LHP, in pure form, has much set at all, let alone values.

YEA I GOT IT, your ideas contradict the "generally set values" or "general" understanding of the LHP. This is conflicting with you trying to express a general understanding, since you don't think there is much of a set at all.

Comes back to the previously mentioned critical reading skills. You put words into my mouth, misrepresent my position, do all this ridiculous crap, and then say I am having issues? I never thought you insulted me, and apparently you forgot saying that you are more experienced (oh wait, I am not supposed to take anything you say literally...). Stroking my ego, perhaps as it is unavoidable.

Oh look, another load of bull. I guess if its bull to you its bull to me.

I didn't put words in your mouth, you said words that didn't make sense so I just attempted to decipher anything worth merit or value. I clearly must of missed something.

I am not the one who started a debate because someone called me out on my own nature. What is getting to me is all your nonsensical tactics. Putting words in my mouth, twisting them, not understanding the simplest of things and then pretending like it is I who is having the issues. "I am rubber, you are glue" may have worked in 1st grade, but you're wasting it on me.

What the hell dude?

I simply asked why you think you don't like the LHP or you don't think you fit with it (or whatever the fluck you said). Either you planned on calling someone out or you just fit perfectly with the LHP.

But yes, I am rubber and you are glue, everything you do I reflect back at you.

I dunno