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Is it possible to successfully debate religious fundamentalists?
- Thread starter alfieo
- Start date
ImmortalFlame
Woke gremlin
Depends how you define success, I suppose. For instance, I would call the following examples instances of success:
1) the fundamentalist changes their mind completely (practically never happens)
2) the fundamentalist adopts a change in attitude towards the subject (very, very rarely happens)
3) the fundamentalist changes their attitude, but retains their position on the subject (rarely happens)
4) the fundamentalist agrees to reassess or reevaluate information relating to the subject (rarely happens)
5) the fundamentalist stops making their previous claims about the subject (rarely happens)
5) the fundamentalist insults everyone and then leaves (happens often)
1) the fundamentalist changes their mind completely (practically never happens)
2) the fundamentalist adopts a change in attitude towards the subject (very, very rarely happens)
3) the fundamentalist changes their attitude, but retains their position on the subject (rarely happens)
4) the fundamentalist agrees to reassess or reevaluate information relating to the subject (rarely happens)
5) the fundamentalist stops making their previous claims about the subject (rarely happens)
5) the fundamentalist insults everyone and then leaves (happens often)
Because of our inferior reasoning skills.
If there where a way to have perfect reasoning, would not all of us come to the same oppinions?
freethinker44
Well-Known Member
Yes. It is called deprogramming.
I used to be one
. and yes it is possible to successfully debate religious fundamentalists. It's just that some seem to not understand what a debate is and just start preaching to you.As for complete conversion you're unlikely to get that through debate. Your aim should be to get them thinking. If you get them to openly question their own belief, rather than get them running to apologetic websites, then you've done your job. and before I get angry comments I'd like to point out that I'm only referring to the fundamentalists who haven't openly looked at their beliefs. There are quite a lot in my experience. and secondly the open thinking may lead them to strengthen their faith rather than completely destroy it (I just happen to be a part of the latter)
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arthra
Baha'i
I think you have to start where the person is..
(1) If they believe in their scripture you use that.. their scripture.
(2) Also I think eventually you need to rise above the polar extremes that can develop in a "Debate" ..so it's not a mere clash of people but can become a mutual exploration.
The more you "attack" someone the more they will raise their defences.. .
Finally
(3) finding out what you have on common is essential..rather than stressing the differences!
(1) If they believe in their scripture you use that.. their scripture.
(2) Also I think eventually you need to rise above the polar extremes that can develop in a "Debate" ..so it's not a mere clash of people but can become a mutual exploration.
The more you "attack" someone the more they will raise their defences.. .
Finally
(3) finding out what you have on common is essential..rather than stressing the differences!
ImmortalFlame
Woke gremlin
They do? A person can change their mind, even if their original position was correct.
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Because of our inferior reasoning skills.
Just remember that you guys admitted it....I didn't say it.That and how stupid I am
Humans are generally poor at reasoning, but it's the initial premises which cause our downfall.
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CaptainXeroid
Following Christ
Sure...only if you accept the possibility that the fundamentalist is right and you are wrong. Anytime you assume the other person is wrong and you are right, there is no debating. You are the one preaching.
Kilgore Trout
Misanthropic Humanist
It's possible to successfully show how anyone's arguments are factually and/or logically incorrect, but you can't change the mind of someone for whom factual and logical correctness are irrelevant.
When it comes to faith, factual and logical correctness is irrelevant. If there where facts, there would be no need for faith. Faith is the requirement for religion.
Kilgore Trout
Misanthropic Humanist
Exactly. Successful debate requires that both parties find facts and logic relevant to the discussion. If one or both do not, then successful debate simply isn't possible.
Quiddity
UndertheInfluenceofGiants
It's possible if one isn't being a natzi with the word logic. Aristotelian logic has been around for a long time and it requires no faith. Faith will be required at some point but it's disingenuous to excuse it all because one lacks faith or doesn't completely get it.
Kilgore Trout
Misanthropic Humanist
Exhibit A.
Quiddity
UndertheInfluenceofGiants
That's about all that is left to say really.
I have hope dialogue is possible, I hope you atleast share this in common.