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Zionophobia

England my lionheart

Rockerjahili Rebel
Premium Member
Since i joined the RF i have seen so many threads and posts concerning Zionist conspiracies,the Zionists are running the US according to some while others say they are in league with the Rotary club :sarcastic,you see Islamophobia touted everywhere so i think Zionists should have a name for all the crazy conspiracy theories and slanderous nonsense they are accused of and there seems a lot of prejudice so here it is Zionophobia,do people view Zionists unfairly.
 
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fallingblood

Agnostic Theist
Since i joined the RF i have seen so many threads and posts concerning Zionist conspiracies,the Zionists are running the US according to some while others say they are in league with the Rotary club :sarcastic,you see Islamophobia touted everywhere so i think Zionists should have a name for all the crazy conspiracy theories and slanderous nonsense they are accused of and there seems a lot of prejudice so here it is Zionophobia,do people view Zionists unfairly.
Ignorance breeds ignorance. And this ignorance then leads to fear.

People fear what they do not know, and from that fear, ridiculous statements are made, some of which lead to conspiracy theories.
 

Poisonshady313

Well-Known Member
The same sort of Jew hatred that inspired accusations that Jews are Christ killers, that Jews kidnap Christian babies and use their blood to bake Matzah for Passover, etc... is the same sort of Jew hatred that inspired a Russian document known as the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, an account of a fictional meeting of Jewish leaders that "prove" the Jewish plot to take over the world.

While it is true that this document has been identified as nothing but a fraud and a forgery, written and disseminated for the purpose of stoking the flames of antisemitism, many Arab governments (including but not limited to those of Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Iraq, Libya, and Hamas) insist that the document is a genuine description of a real plot of the Jews to take over the world.

Meanwhile, people who so blindly and virulently hate the Jews often mask their hatred as being hatred not of Jews, but of "Zionists". They insist "accusations of antisemitism are empty because they don't understand the difference between criticisms of the Israeli government and statements against Jews."

Problem is, the people who are busy hating Jews and/or Israelis very rarely make a distinction... and in many cases, from their point of view, there is no distinction.

When they think of Zionism, they think "protocols of the elders of Zion", so they very much misunderstand what Zionism really is, and stand by their hatred of it.

What it boils down to is, antisemitism and anti Zionism are one in the same... except in modern times it's not so fashionable to admit to hating Jews, so to appeal to the rest of the world, they call it a hatred of the policies of the government of Israel.

And since Israel has refused to roll over and die, and they have a sovereign state, and a strong military, and an excellent economy, and the Palestinians have none of those things, the Palestinians have the sympathy of the western world because they're seen as the underdog next to a big, bad, brutal Israel who just wants to grab land and deny Palestinians their self determination.

It's all a load of crap, but that's the way a lot of people see it. And so when they figure all they're doing is criticizing Israeli government policies, they have no idea that they're really feeding into the antisemitic propaganda of a people who hate Jews and wish for the rest of the world to do the same.
 

Flankerl

Well-Known Member
Poisonshady you forgot to mention that arabs can never be antisemites as they themselve are semites. Even though the term "antisemite" has nothing to do with linguistics. :)
 

Yeshe Dawa

Lotus Born
The same sort of Jew hatred that inspired accusations that Jews are Christ killers, that Jews kidnap Christian babies and use their blood to bake Matzah for Passover, etc... is the same sort of Jew hatred that inspired a Russian document known as the Protocols of the Elders of Zion, an account of a fictional meeting of Jewish leaders that "prove" the Jewish plot to take over the world.

While it is true that this document has been identified as nothing but a fraud and a forgery, written and disseminated for the purpose of stoking the flames of antisemitism, many Arab governments (including but not limited to those of Saudi Arabia, Egypt, Iraq, Libya, and Hamas) insist that the document is a genuine description of a real plot of the Jews to take over the world.

Meanwhile, people who so blindly and virulently hate the Jews often mask their hatred as being hatred not of Jews, but of "Zionists". They insist "accusations of antisemitism are empty because they don't understand the difference between criticisms of the Israeli government and statements against Jews."

Problem is, the people who are busy hating Jews and/or Israelis very rarely make a distinction... and in many cases, from their point of view, there is no distinction.

When they think of Zionism, they think "protocols of the elders of Zion", so they very much misunderstand what Zionism really is, and stand by their hatred of it.

What it boils down to is, antisemitism and anti Zionism are one in the same... except in modern times it's not so fashionable to admit to hating Jews, so to appeal to the rest of the world, they call it a hatred of the policies of the government of Israel.

And since Israel has refused to roll over and die, and they have a sovereign state, and a strong military, and an excellent economy, and the Palestinians have none of those things, the Palestinians have the sympathy of the western world because they're seen as the underdog next to a big, bad, brutal Israel who just wants to grab land and deny Palestinians their self determination.

It's all a load of crap, but that's the way a lot of people see it. And so when they figure all they're doing is criticizing Israeli government policies, they have no idea that they're really feeding into the antisemitic propaganda of a people who hate Jews and wish for the rest of the world to do the same.

Hi Poisonshady313!

I agree that there has been and still is a lot of unfounded hatred toward Jewish people. I was confused, however, by your assertion that criticism of Israeli government policies promotes antisemitism. It seems odd to me to tie criticism of the actions of a government to criticism of an entire race or religion. In line with England my Lionheart's original question, do you think that people who do not agree with some Israeli policies or actions (like Operation Cast Lead or the Gaza blockade) should be classified as Zionophobes?

Peace and blessings,
Yeshe
:flower2:
 

Poisonshady313

Well-Known Member
Hi Poisonshady313!

I agree that there has been and still is a lot of unfounded hatred toward Jewish people. I was confused, however, by your assertion that criticism of Israeli government policies promotes antisemitism. It seems odd to me to tie criticism of the actions of a government to criticism of an entire race or religion. In line with England my Lionheart's original question, do you think that people who do not agree with some Israeli policies or actions (like Operation Cast Lead or the Gaza blockade) should be classified as Zionophobes?

Peace and blessings,
Yeshe
:flower2:

Not as a general rule, no. But beware of those who hide behind that line as a way to avoid admitting to hating Jews.
 

Otherright

Otherright
Hi Poisonshady313!

I agree that there has been and still is a lot of unfounded hatred toward Jewish people. I was confused, however, by your assertion that criticism of Israeli government policies promotes antisemitism. It seems odd to me to tie criticism of the actions of a government to criticism of an entire race or religion. In line with England my Lionheart's original question, do you think that people who do not agree with some Israeli policies or actions (like Operation Cast Lead or the Gaza blockade) should be classified as Zionophobes?

Peace and blessings,
Yeshe
:flower2:

Usually, I don't jump into such, but in defense of Israel, they don't get the opportunity to make a mistake. They don't get to have to copacetic lifestyle we in America and Europe afford.

Politically correct or not, they are literally surrounded by neighbors who hate their very existence. You can try to argue individuals, and peace and love, but it isn't there. Not historically and not in reality. If you've paid attention over the course of the past 60 years, Israel is in the fight of their lives every single day.

This might not sound nice or liberal, but it is the truth. The Israeli government does what is has to do to survive, and often does so with restraint. They don't get the opportunity to simply turn the other cheek. While there are two sides to every story, that is their side.
 

Poisonshady313

Well-Known Member
It seems odd to me to tie criticism of the actions of a government to criticism of an entire race or religion.

It is odd. Very odd. Yet it happens a lot, especially in the Arab world. And by extension, those westerners oblivious enough to buy into the propaganda.

It can be seen in many places, but most obviously in the Hamas charter, that the distinction between Israelis and Jews doesn't exist in the minds of many of those who hate "Zionists".
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Poisonshady you forgot to mention that arabs can never be antisemites as they themselve are semites. Even though the term "antisemite" has nothing to do with linguistics. :)
Sometimes it seems that the purpose of language is to defeat communication.
 

Yeshe Dawa

Lotus Born
Usually, I don't jump into such, but in defense of Israel, they don't get the opportunity to make a mistake. They don't get to have to copacetic lifestyle we in America and Europe afford.

Politically correct or not, they are literally surrounded by neighbors who hate their very existence. You can try to argue individuals, and peace and love, but it isn't there. Not historically and not in reality. If you've paid attention over the course of the past 60 years, Israel is in the fight of their lives every single day.

This might not sound nice or liberal, but it is the truth. The Israeli government does what is has to do to survive, and often does so with restraint. They don't get the opportunity to simply turn the other cheek. While there are two sides to every story, that is their side.

Hi Otherright!:)

Yes, you are right. I am for individuals, peace and love. I believe in ahimsa, non-violence. I agree that the country Israel has many political and military enemies. I think that every nation has the sovereign right to defend itself.

I hope it's okay we're straying off the Zionophobe topic, but to respond to your comment, I guess I wonder just how much Israel is really out there on their own. I have a hard time thinking of a country that is ready to eliminate Israel if it shows any sign of weakness. Egypt is trying to work on its own government. Saudi Arabia is our ally and wouldn't dare. The Palestinians are fragmented and cannot even begin to challenge Israel militarily. Iran? The U.S. is just waiting for an excuse to invade them, and they know it. Who does that leave - Syria, Lebanon? - The U.S. would bomb them back into the stone age if they tried. That is assuming the Israelis would even need our help. I guess I'm just not convinced by the argument that Israel must be harsh because it's survival is threatened.

I noticed in the news that the Palestinians are petitioning for statehood recognition at the United Nations, and that the United States and Israel are opposing the effort. Do you think that this opposition is based on concern for Israel's survival as a state, or do you think there is another motivation?

Peace and blessings,
Yeshe
:flower2:
 

Flankerl

Well-Known Member
Also England my lionheart there are a few more things you need to secure yourself from.

There are zionist sharks at the coast of Egypt. Sent by the mossad to kill egyptians.
Then there are zionist balloons filled with poisonous gas which the mossad sends to Lebanon.
Then there are of course zionist vultures in Saudi Arabia who spy for the mossad.
And zionist squirrels and pigeons in Iran.
And of course zionist cats who will try to rape you.
And not to forget the zionist rats for the palestinians.



So beware people! BEWARE!!!
 

sandandfoam

Veteran Member
Since i joined the RF i have seen so many threads and posts concerning Zionist conspiracies,the Zionists are running the US according to some while others say they are in league with the Rotary club :sarcastic,you see Islamophobia touted everywhere so i think Zionists should have a name for all the crazy conspiracy theories and slanderous nonsense they are accused of and there seems a lot of prejudice so here it is Zionophobia,do people view Zionists unfairly.
I agree that railing against 'Zionists' is often a ruse for anti Jewish horse manure. The fact that bigots rail against Jewish people makes Islamophobia no less acceptable.
 

Poisonshady313

Well-Known Member
I noticed in the news that the Palestinians are petitioning for statehood recognition at the United Nations, and that the United States and Israel are opposing the effort. Do you think that this opposition is based on concern for Israel's survival as a state, or do you think there is another motivation?

Peace and blessings,
Yeshe
:flower2:

It is no secret that the Palestinian effort to establish statehood has nothing to do with self determination, and everything to do with the perpetual armed struggle to annihilate the "Zionist entity".

Israel would be the first nation to welcome a sovereign Palestine as its neighbor, and would offer the most help to jumpstart a healthy Palestinian economy, build schools, hospitals, roads, etc.

But not without peace first.

No organization of Palestinians has ever sought peace with Israel. When this changes, then we can talk of being supportive of a Palestinian state.
 

Yeshe Dawa

Lotus Born
It is no secret that the Palestinian effort to establish statehood has nothing to do with self determination, and everything to do with the perpetual armed struggle to annihilate the "Zionist entity".

Israel would be the first nation to welcome a sovereign Palestine as its neighbor, and would offer the most help to jumpstart a healthy Palestinian economy, build schools, hospitals, roads, etc.

But not without peace first.

No organization of Palestinians has ever sought peace with Israel. When this changes, then we can talk of being supportive of a Palestinian state.

Hi Poisonshady313!

Thank you for giving me insight into your worldview. I respect your opinion, and I definitely acknowledge that the Jewish people have undergone horrible things.

As far as Israel the political entity is concerned - well, as I mentioned before, I have a hard time seeing them as endangered. They have a superior military and the backing of the United States, both financially and militarily. I just have a hard time believing that the United States and Israel are blocking Palestinian statehood because they think that a Palestinian state will threaten Israel's existence. I also don't believe that the average Palestinian is after statehood because it will further the destruction of Israel. I think that they want the same things all countries want - stability, jobs, infrastructure, trade, security.

I acknowledge that there is a terrorist element that is bent on Israel's destruction, just as al-Qaeda is bent on the destruction of the United States. However, I don't think that the Palestinian people should be punished for their actions, just as I don't think that the Afghani people should be punished for al-Qaeda's actions. There is no anti-semitism involved - it is a matter of human rights. When a country starts killing more people than the terrorists it is supposedly fighting (which the United States definitely has and I suspect Israel has as well - I would have to research casualty figures though) they make a statement that their citizen's lives are more important than those of the civilians in the countries they are attacking. I do not hold this view.:peace:

Thank you for your honest responses.:namaste

Peace and blessings,
Yeshe
:flower2:
 

Desert Snake

Veteran Member
It means you need to read up on the origin of the term antisemitic.


I know what the origin of the term is. So you think its usage makes sense? There are "Semitic" languages, Semitic peoples, so obviously it's an inaccurate term. Why not just use '"anti-Judaism"? Why use a confusing term?
 
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Rakhel

Well-Known Member
with England...you never know. He has his moments of absolute clarity.Which is most of the time. I believe this to be one of them.




Not that he always comes off as nuts...but ...well... he is a mod... and... well... they are...nuts from time to time. and... well... I should shut up cuz theys everwhere theys always watchin....everthing....:run:
 
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