Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber
Says the guy speaking for women and dismissing what women are telling him.@anna. @Shadow Wolf
Remind me to never rely on you two for anything that has to do with statistics..
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Why is this board so obsessed with restrooms?
- Thread starter Saint Frankenstein
- Start date
i rest my case
anna.
but mostly it's the same
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber
Yes, you certainly do.
Ella S.
*temp banned*
It's also worth noting that, by banning transgender women from restrooms, you are directly encouraging "trans spotting."
"Trans spotting" is a practice where people attempt to tell whether a given individual is cisgender or transgender, often using a variety of unreliable "tells." In practice, this means that cisgender women who might have masculine physical traits are misidentified as transgender women. I have even seen celebrities such as Emma Watson be subject to this phenomenon of "trans spotting," despite the fact that Emma Watson's whole life has been extremely public and we know she is not transgender.
I was reading a comment on YouTube the other day about a cisgender woman with small breasts, short hair, wide shoulders, and a strong jawline who has been forcibly removed from restrooms more than once due to living in a particularly transphobic region. She mentioned that the laws, in practice, only make people more suspicious of one another.
Of course they do. That's the real point behind them. It was never about actually protecting women. It was always about stigmatizing trans people. The result is not that women are protected, but that both transgender and cisgender women are put in more danger. The result is not that men are suddenly prevented from assaulting women in restrooms somehow, but that the women in the restrooms now assault each other, too.
"Trans spotting" is a practice where people attempt to tell whether a given individual is cisgender or transgender, often using a variety of unreliable "tells." In practice, this means that cisgender women who might have masculine physical traits are misidentified as transgender women. I have even seen celebrities such as Emma Watson be subject to this phenomenon of "trans spotting," despite the fact that Emma Watson's whole life has been extremely public and we know she is not transgender.
I was reading a comment on YouTube the other day about a cisgender woman with small breasts, short hair, wide shoulders, and a strong jawline who has been forcibly removed from restrooms more than once due to living in a particularly transphobic region. She mentioned that the laws, in practice, only make people more suspicious of one another.
Of course they do. That's the real point behind them. It was never about actually protecting women. It was always about stigmatizing trans people. The result is not that women are protected, but that both transgender and cisgender women are put in more danger. The result is not that men are suddenly prevented from assaulting women in restrooms somehow, but that the women in the restrooms now assault each other, too.
Protecting trans people is a real problem we need to solve. I've said it before, I'm saying it again.
We have to find solutions that protect trans people without weakening existing protections for women.
We have to find solutions that protect trans people without weakening existing protections for women.
Interesting, that's not how I read her post. Can you say more?
Can you give an example or two of anti-trans rhetoric that's relevant to women's safe spaces?
Ella S.
*temp banned*
How is it that you so readily misinterpreted me directly saying "The result is not that women are protected, but that both transgender and cisgender women are put in more danger. The result is not that men are suddenly prevented from assaulting women in restrooms somehow, but that the women in the restrooms now assault each other, too" at the end of my post?
I was rather explicit.
Could it be that you are merely trying and failing to create unfounded doubts about my character and position, so that you can attack a straw man and not have to actually face anything I am saying?
Is that the action of someone who cares about protecting women? To completely ignore when women are telling you that you are putting them in danger for the sake of pushing a transphobic narrative?
I'll leave those as open questions for you to do some soul searching. I'm no longer interested in your bad faith discussions.
did you mean to direct these comments to @Yerda? because I said exactly zero about your most recent comments. i asked yerda to clarify his comments, that's all.
From what I'm gathering, what the women in this thread have been telling me is based on their own anecdotal experience. Am I getting that wrong?
Ella S.
*temp banned*
Well, I was not expecting you to fall into blatant lies, but I'm not surprised.
Yerda
Veteran Member
Sure. The post spoke about "trans spotting" and cis women being subjected to unfair evaluation and treatment, like being harrassed in public because over zealous protectors of women mistake them for being trans. As well as the stigmatization of trans women. The result is women being endangered.
Maybe cast your eyes over that post again?
With all sincerity, I'm lost. Here's a verbatim restating of the exchanges in question:
icehorse: Interesting, that's not how I read her post. Can you say more?
==
So where are the blatant lies in my response to yerda?
Yerda
Veteran Member
It just looked like you missed the point of the post.
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber
This entire thread with posts treating women like objects to protect instead if individuals caoabke of taking care of themselves (1) and you ignoring what women are telling you (2).
1 especially leads to women getting harassed amd attacked.
Not at all, sorry for any confusion. I'm actually listening to the women in my life and to many prominent women feminists whose opinions I'm agreeing with.
I might have gotten this wrong, but I believe I asked the women on this thread, and I was told that I was not listening to their personal opinions and anecdotal evidence. I don't ignore this, but I take it for what it is, anecdotal.