Why Is Atheism Not a Religion?

[steeltoes]

Well, there you have it.

 

[Desert Snake]

Actually Luis Dantes is correct, I was referring to classification.

 

[Thana]

Whilst some atheists do seem to make a sort of religion of it, atheism per se lacks any of the features of a religion. I don't see how it conforms to any of the definitions you listed.

It's not a belief. It's a lack of belief. It has no doctrine, no belief or faith in anything, no ethic, no world-view. It is not a belief that there is no God.

I don't really understand that..

How can a capable and intellectual being lack belief? They make decisions, They observe and come to conclusions on the basis of God's existence. They decide there is no God. They believe there is no God. They don't just have the question answered for them.
It's an active decision, Not passive like weak atheism.

 

[Thana]

If they practice a religion, then they're irreligious.

Irreligious means indifferent or hostile to religion?

 

[Desert Snake]

I don't really understand that..

How can a capable and intellectual being lack belief? They make decisions, They observe and come to conclusions on the basis of God's existence. They decide there is no God. They believe there is no God. They don't just have the question answered for them.
It's an active decision, Not passive like weak atheism.

There seems to be discrepancies regarding the technical definition of atheism, however it still doesn't make it a religion.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Irreligious means indifferent or hostile to religion?

It means non-religious.

 

[LuisDantas]

So you're all saying that because Atheism is an absense of faith, It cannot be regarded as religion.

Not for that reason, but rather because it lacks doctrine.

An atheistic religion may and has been made. But atheism proper? Hardly even begins to qualify.

But is Atheism really an absense of faith?
How is saying "There is no God" Not a claim, Or not faith, Or not a belief?

How does having a belief in regards to God (Either His existence or non-existence), Not a religious sentiment? And if you have religious ideals, Would that not make you in some way religious?

Religious sentiments have very little, if anything, to do with belief in God. The connection may exist in certain people, but it is far from automatic. I'm not sure it is even frequent.

 

[LuisDantas]

I don't really understand that..

How can a capable and intellectual being lack belief? They make decisions, They observe and come to conclusions on the basis of God's existence. They decide there is no God. They believe there is no God. They don't just have the question answered for them.
It's an active decision, Not passive like weak atheism.

Thana, this post of mine from another thread may give you some idea of how an atheist deals with religiosity.

http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/3740421-post57.html

It does involve beliefs, I suppose. But not about God's existence.

As a side note, can you elaborate on the part that I put in bold? I did not understand it.

Also, atheism, be it weak or strong, if often not a decision at all, although the decision to be open about it may well present itself.

 

[icehorse]

I'd say most accurately that atheism is a lack of belief in the Gods other people believe in. An atheist *might* also believe there is no God whatsoever, but all you can say for sure about an atheist is that they don't find any known religion or scripture to be believable. I suppose if an atheist also chooses not to believe in any God, you might call them an "adeist"?

I would say that what most atheists believe in are scientific values like evidence and logic. Personally, that's where my beliefs exist. I believe that using reason, evidence and logic is the best way to live life. And there's nothing in these beliefs that exclude being spiritual.

 

[Sunstone]

Is atheism a religion?

I think that largely depends on how naive is your definition of religion. In almost every case that I've ever seen, when someone has argued that atheism is a religion, they have naively defined "religion" as something along the lines of this: A belief system.

But that notion is superficial. Religions never exist in reality purely as belief systems. However, a lot of things that are certainly not religions do exist purely or nearly purely as beliefs or belief systems.

In reality religions always involve much more than belief. For instance, among other things, they always or almost always have some notion of sacred and profane that is concretely manifested as sacred places, times, structures, scriptures, and objects. Along with that, they tend to have a sense of blasphemy or defilement. Again they always or almost always rituals and rites of one sort or another. That's only a partial list of what is typical or nearly typical of genuine religions.

To suggest atheism is a religion is laughable unless you re-define religion so that the very term becomes insipid -- so that it means little more than a belief system. And if you do that, all sorts of things suddenly become religions. Hell, even secular political parties -- and perhaps even their platforms -- would qualify as a religions.

But don't let me stop you from having your fun.

 

[Desert Snake]

I wonder how much the term 'agnostic' sidesteps this argument...

 

[Valjean]

I don't really understand that..

How can a capable and intellectual being lack belief? They make decisions, They observe and come to conclusions on the basis of God's existence. They decide there is no God. They believe there is no God. They don't just have the question answered for them.
It's an active decision, Not passive like weak atheism.

Weak atheism is atheism. It's the essence of atheism, the sine qua non. It's what is understood when you use the unmodified term.

When one says "atheism," weak atheism is what is meant. When you start tacking on beliefs ("there is no God"), or values, or doctrine, you've modified and expanded the basic concept.

Weak and strong atheism are two different things. When we non-believers say we're atheists, we're talking about fundamental, unmodified atheism -- weak atheism. When you declare atheism a religion you're talking about strong atheism; you're attributing values and beliefs where there are none.

 

[zenzero]

Friend Thana,

Why Is Atheism Not a Religion?

It is and Gautama leads the path!

Unless you are speaking of something else when you talk of 'atheism'.

Love & rgds

 

[Desert Snake]

Friend Thana,


It is and Gautama leads the path!

Unless you are speaking of something else when you talk of 'atheism'.

Love & rgds

.......

 

[Bunyip]

I wonder how much the term 'agnostic' sidesteps this argument...

Not at all. Agnostic/gnostic speaks to what a person knows, while atheist/theist speaks to what they believe.

You can be an agnostic atheist, an agnostic theist and so on.

 

[Thana]

Weak atheism is atheism. It's the essence of atheism, the sine qua non. It's what is understood when you use the unmodified term.

When one says "atheism," weak atheism is what is meant. When you start tacking on beliefs ("there is no God"), or values, or doctrine, you've modified and expanded the basic concept.

Weak and strong atheism are two different things. When we non-believers say we're atheists, we're talking about fundamental, unmodified atheism -- weak atheism. When you declare atheism a religion you're talking about strong atheism; you're attributing values and beliefs where there are none.

I really do not understand weak atheism, Or what you call weak atheism. I thought that term was generally used on infants and those who don't have any mental capacity to make an informed decision.

How can you, An adult, call yourself a weak atheist?
You've determined you're an Atheist, You've determined there is no God.
That's not a lack of a belief, That is a belief.

Weak Atheism according to Wikipedia - is any other type of atheism, wherein a person does not believe in the existence of any deities, but does not explicitly assert there to be none

What is the difference between not believing in a deity and not explicitly asserting there to be none? Is the difference just that one proclaims there is no God and the other thinks it but does not say it?

To suggest atheism is a religion is laughable unless you re-define religion so that the very term becomes insipid -- so that it means little more than a belief system. And if you do that, all sorts of things suddenly become religions. Hell, even secular political parties -- and perhaps even their platforms -- would qualify as a religions.

But don't let me stop you from having your fun.

I'm not trying to re-define the term religion, Merely trying to understand the difference between religion and Atheism and why they're seperate.

 

[Bunyip]

LaVeyan Satanism, forms of Luciferianism, Jainism and Buddhism are non-theistic religions. And they are religions. You're going to tell a Buddhist monk that he's not a religious man? :areyoucra

Sure, as I said Budda is not a god. Buddism is commonly referred to as a philosophy. As to Satanism, Luciferianism and so on they refer to superhuman beings as higher powers and so I would see them as theistic. Satan for example is a character within Christianity, and so I would see it as a subset of theism.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I really do not understand weak atheism, Or what you call weak atheism. I thought that term was generally used on infants and those who don't have any mental capacity to make an informed decision.

How can you, An adult, call yourself a weak atheist?
You've determined you're an Atheist, You've determined there is no God.
That's not a lack of a belief, That is a belief.

Weak Atheism according to Wikipedia - is any other type of atheism, wherein a person does not believe in the existence of any deities, but does not explicitly assert there to be none

What is the difference between not believing in a deity and not explicitly asserting there to be none? Is the difference just that one proclaims there is no God and the other thinks it but does not say it?

Proclaiming that there's no gods is a truth statement. It's the same as saying that you know there are/is a god or gods. Those are pretty extreme statements. "Weak atheism" is just saying that you don't believe in gods but without claiming that you know there aren't any gods.

 

[Bunyip]

I really do not understand weak atheism, Or what you call weak atheism. I thought that term was generally used on infants and those who don't have any mental capacity to make an informed decision.

How can you, An adult, call yourself a weak atheist?
You've determined you're an Atheist, You've determined there is no God.
That's not a lack of a belief, That is a belief.

Weak Atheism according to Wikipedia - is any other type of atheism, wherein a person does not believe in the existence of any deities, but does not explicitly assert there to be none

What is the difference between not believing in a deity and not explicitly asserting there to be none? Is the difference just that one proclaims there is no God and the other thinks it but does not say it?



I'm not trying to re-define the term religion, Merely trying to understand the difference between religion and Atheism and why they're seperate.

What you seem to be missing is the very simple point that atheism is not the belief that there is no god, but the lack of the belief that there is. The difference is equally simple - to claim to know that there is no god is a claim of knowledge, whilst to doubt the claims of theists that there is not.

Atheism is not a claim of knowledge, it is the position of disbelieving in the claims of theism.

 

[Thana]

Sure, as I said Budda is not a god. Buddism is commonly referred to as a philosophy. As to Satanism, Luciferianism and so on they refer to superhuman beings as higher powers and so I would see them as theistic. Satan for example is a character within Christianity, and so I would see it as a subset of theism.

Heh.. I wouldn't say that to a satanist.
Not only do not all of them worship satan or any deity, But most don't even worship the Christian Devil. Apparently that's a large misconception.