Why Is Atheism Not a Religion?

[Thana]

I was looking at a thread before and I found it interesting, And it brought up some questions and thoughts and I'd like to discuss them.

The Poll on the thread was "What Religion Are you?" and I wasn't suprised when I saw that Atheism was among the choices. And I started to wonder, Why am I not suprised that Atheism is in this when Atheism is not meant to be a religion? What was even less suprising was that people who have claimed on these forums before that Atheism is not a religion, Had actually clicked on Atheism.

So I started to wonder if it's a case of "If it talks like a duck, And walks like a duck, It's probably a duck"

Even now, We're on a religious forums site. And guess where Atheism is? In the DIR (Discuss Individual Religions) section. Should it be there when most if not all Atheist's claim that Atheism is not a religion?

So I'd like to bring up some reasons why I'm confused, And I'd love to hear Atheists refute these and explain to me exactly why Atheism is not a religion and why I should not think it so (I'm completely open to this idea)

1 - For example, When someone goes from Christianity to Atheism they say they converted. How can I convert from a religion to a non religion? Is that not apples and oranges? Shouldn't they say they left religion and joined Atheism?

2 - At what point does a belief stop being a belief?
I believe in Christ. An Atheist believes in there never having been a Christ.
Where do we draw the line between these two beliefs? And is it not correct to call them both beliefs? And if you have a belief regarding God, how is that not religious?

3 - When you ask an Atheist: What are your beliefs?
They'll answer "I believe there is no God"

You ask "What is your religion"
They reply "I'm an Atheist" Or "Atheism"

What is with claiming you're not a religion but also claiming you are? You either are or you are not, So which is it?

4 - I read that someone asked on a forum "Is atheism a religion"
And one of the replies was "How can a non-belief in deities be a "set of beliefs"? As has been said before atheism is a religion like not collecting stamps is a hobby."

Which reminded me of another time I discussed this and actually came up with an answer:

If you actively avoid collecting stamps, If you tell the world how you hate to collect stamps, If you debate the pro's and cons of stamp collecting,
if you try to convince people that stamp collecting is a waste of time...
Then yeah, I'd say not stamp collecting is a hobby.

Cannot the same be said for Atheism as a religion?

5 - Why is Atheism different to a Non-Theistic Religion?

"Non theistic religion is a religion based on the doctrine of non-existence of god or gods.
This means that they do not worship any god and includes religions like Buddhism. Many scholars have described the religion as 'absence of religion'."

So Non-Theists can admit to having a Non-Theistic religion. And since the difference between a Non-Theist and an Atheist is very little, Why can't Atheists be put in the same boat?

I should also add that this is a discussion about Strong Atheism, Not Weak Atheism.

Thanks ahead of time for all your answers! I hope I learn something new =)

 

[Desert Snake]

It's non-belief. It's the absence of belief, so therefore it isn't really anything.

 

[Bunyip]

I was looking at a thread before and I found it interesting, And it brought up some questions and thoughts and I'd like to discuss them.

The Poll on the thread was "What Religion Are you?" and I wasn't suprised when I saw that Atheism was among the choices. And I started to wonder, Why am I not suprised that Atheism is in this when Atheism is not meant to be a religion? What was even less suprising was that people who have claimed on these forums before that Atheism is not a religion, Had actually clicked on Atheism.

So I started to wonder if it's a case of "If it talks like a duck, And walks like a duck, It's probably a duck"

Even now, We're on a religious forums site. And guess where Atheism is? In the DIR (Discuss Individual Religions) section. Should it be there when most if not all Atheist's claim that Atheism is not a religion?

So I'd like to bring up some reasons why I'm confused, And I'd love to hear Atheists refute these and explain to me exactly why Atheism is not a religion and why I should not think it so (I'm completely open to this idea)

1 - For example, When someone goes from Christianity to Atheism they say they converted. How can I convert from a religion to a non religion? Is that not apples and oranges? Shouldn't they say they left religion and joined Atheism?

2 - At what point does a belief stop being a belief?
I believe in Christ. An Atheist believes in there never having been a Christ.
Where do we draw the line between these two beliefs? And is it not correct to call them both beliefs? And if you have a belief regarding God, how is that not religious?

3 - When you ask an Atheist: What are your beliefs?
They'll answer "I believe there is no God"

You ask "What is your religion"
They reply "I'm an Atheist" Or "Atheism"

What is with claiming you're not a religion but also claiming you are? You either are or you are not, So which is it?

4 - I read that someone asked on a forum "Is atheism a religion"
And one of the replies was "How can a non-belief in deities be a "set of beliefs"? As has been said before atheism is a religion like not collecting stamps is a hobby."

Which reminded me of another time I discussed this and actually came up with an answer:


Cannot the same be said for Atheism as a religion?

5 - Why is Atheism different to a Non-Theistic Religion?

"Non theistic religion is a religion based on the doctrine of non-existence of god or gods.
This means that they do not worship any god and includes religions like Buddhism. Many scholars have described the religion as 'absence of religion'."

So Non-Theists can admit to having a Non-Theistic religion. And since the difference between a Non-Theist and an Atheist is very little, Why can't Atheists be put in the same boat?

I should also add that this is a discussion about Strong Atheism, Not Weak Atheism.

Thanks ahead of time for all your answers! I hope I learn something new =)

Atheism can not be a religion, the word 'religion' has a meaning - it involves belief in a higher power.

Atheism is not a worldview, an ideology or a religion.

1. That would be just a poor use of words. Leaving Christianity to become atheist is deconversion, not conversion.
2. You believe in Christ an atheist does not. A person eother has that belief (theist) or does not (atheist).
3. Sounds like a simple misunderstanding.
4. See above.
5. Non-theists are atheist by definition. The word 'atheist' essentially identifies a person as not-a-theist. Just as adding the letter 'a' as a prefix to many other words renders them to mean the opposite - amoral for example.

 

[LuisDantas]

Atheism is not particularly related to religion one way or the other.

Not everyone agrees, though. And sometimes it is offered as a choice in a questionaire, for various reasons.

Not much of a mystery there.

 

[Thana]

Atheism can not be a religion, the word 'religion' has a meaning - it involves belief in a higher power.

Atheism is not a worldview, an ideology or a religion.

Religion -
1: the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods.
2: a particular system of faith and worship.
3: a pursuit or interest followed with great devotion.

These can apply to Atheism. And as I said, What about Non-Theistic Religion?
How is that different to Atheism?

 

[Desert Snake]

Religion -
1: the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods.
2: a particular system of faith and worship.
3: a pursuit or interest followed with great devotion.

These can apply to Atheism. And as I said, What about Non-Theistic Religion?
How is that different to Atheism?

Because only some atheists are like that, would be my answer...

 

[steeltoes]

I don't practice any religion and coincidentally I am an atheist posting on a religious forum because I am in awe of the stuff that people believe.

 

[steeltoes]

Religion -
1: the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods.
2: a particular system of faith and worship.
3: a pursuit or interest followed with great devotion.

These can apply to Atheism. And as I said, What about Non-Theistic Religion?
How is that different to Atheism?

First of all, there is no need to capitalize atheism.

Secondly, no, those examples cannot apply to atheism. Atheism means without theism.

 

[Bunyip]

Religion -
1: the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods.
2: a particular system of faith and worship.
3: a pursuit or interest followed with great devotion.

These can apply to Atheism. And as I said, What about Non-Theistic Religion?
How is that different to Atheism?

1. Nope, if you believe in a superhuman controlling power you can not be an atheist. Atheism is the absence of belief in such things. Belief in a personal god is THEISM.
2. Atheism is the absence of faith in a superhuman controlling power, there is no system of worship implicit in atheism.
3. Atheism is not a persuit or interest, it is the absence of a specific belief.

Can you give an example of a non-theistic religion please? Buddism is technically a philosophy rather than a religion (because Budda is neither a god nor a supreme power).

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

All atheism is is a position on the existence of deities. Theism by itself isn't a religion, either. They are parts or foundations of religion, but not religions themselves. Religions are much more than just that:

Religion is a set of variously organized beliefs about the relationship between natural and supernatural aspects of reality, and the role of humans in this relationship. While religion is difficult to define, one standard model of religion, used in religious studies courses, was proposed by Clifford Geertz, who simply called it a "cultural system" (Clifford Geertz, Religion as a Cultural System, 1973). A critique of Geertz's model by Talal Asad categorized religion as "an anthropological category." (Talal Asad, The Construction of Religion as an Anthropological Category, 1982). Many religions have narratives, symbols, and sacred histories that are intended to explain the meaning of life and/or to explain the origin of life or the Universe. From their beliefs about the cosmos and human nature, people derive morality, ethics, religious laws or a preferred lifestyle. According to some estimates, there are roughly 4,200 religions in the world.[1]

Many religions may have organized behaviors, clergy, a definition of what constitutes adherence or membership, holy places, and scriptures. The practice of a religion may also include rituals, sermons, commemoration or veneration of a deity, gods or goddesses, sacrifices, festivals, feasts, trance, initiations, funerary services, matrimonial services, meditation, prayer, music, art, dance, public service or other aspects of human culture. Religions may also contain mythology.[2]

So we can see that a religion is a narrative that typically involves rituals that encompasses your entire worldview.

 

[Desert Snake]

Can you give an example of a non-theistic religion please? Buddism is technically a philosophy rather than a religion (because Budda is neither a god nor a supreme power).

Well, people try with various systems to example that, but it's problematic.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

1. Nope, if you believe in a superhuman controlling power you can not be an atheist. Atheism is the absence of belief in such things. Belief in a personal god is THEISM.
2. Atheism is the absence of faith in a superhuman controlling power, there is no system of worship implicit in atheism.
3. Atheism is not a persuit or interest, it is the absence of a specific belief.

Can you give an example of a non-theistic religion please? Buddism is technically a philosophy rather than a religion (because Budda is neither a god nor a supreme power).

LaVeyan Satanism, forms of Luciferianism, Jainism and Buddhism are non-theistic religions. And they are religions. You're going to tell a Buddhist monk that he's not a religious man? :areyoucra

 

[LuisDantas]

That distinction is way too arbitrary. Buddhism is clearly a religion.

 

[Thana]

So you're all saying that because Atheism is an absense of faith, It cannot be regarded as religion.

But is Atheism really an absense of faith?
How is saying "There is no God" Not a claim, Or not faith, Or not a belief?

How does having a belief in regards to God (Either His existence or non-existence), Not a religious sentiment? And if you have religious ideals, Would that not make you in some way religious?

 

[Desert Snake]

So you're all saying that because Atheism is an absense of faith, It cannot be regarded as religion.

But is Atheism really an absense of faith?
How is saying "There is no God" Not a claim, Or not faith, Or not a belief?

How does having a belief in regards to God (Either His existence or non-existence), Not a religious sentiment? And if you have religious ideals, Would that not make you in some way religious?

Nope, not me... with non-theism I don't use the term 'religion' the same way as with theistic religions...they're too different.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

So you're all saying that because Atheism is an absense of faith, It cannot be regarded as religion.

But is Atheism really an absense of faith?
How is saying "There is no God" Not a claim, Or not faith, Or not a belief?

How does having a belief in regards to God (Either His existence or non-existence), Not a religious sentiment? And if you have religious ideals, Would that not make you in some way religious?

If you're an atheist and you're a part of a non-theistic religion, then yes you're religious. But if you're just an atheist, you're not. You'd be just irreligious or non-religious when it comes to that. Same as how you can be an irreligious theist.

 

[Desert Snake]

That distinction is way too arbitrary. Buddhism is clearly a religion.

/edit/ true.

 

[Thana]

If you're an atheist and you're a part of a non-theistic religion, then yes you're religious. But if you're just an atheist, you're not. You'd be just irreligious or non-religious when it comes to that. Same as how you can be an irreligious theist.

That actually... Makes a lot of sense.

So it's a choice, in other words.

You either identify with Non-Theistic religion or you identify as irrelegious? And in certain circumstances you could call an Atheist religious, If they believe things that correlate with Non-theistic religion?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

That actually... Makes a lot of sense.

So it's a choice, in other words.

You either identify with Non-Theistic religion or you identify as irrelegious? And in certain circumstances you could call an Atheist religious, If they believe things that correlate with Non-theistic religion?

If they practice a religion, then they're irreligious. If they don't, then they're not religious. Neither theism or atheism are religions by themselves. Simple as that.

 

[Valjean]

Whilst some atheists do seem to make a sort of religion of it, atheism per se lacks any of the features of a religion. I don't see how it conforms to any of the definitions you listed.

It's not a belief. It's a lack of belief. It has no doctrine, no belief or faith in anything, no ethic, no world-view. It is not a belief that there is no God.