Why God appears to be a bad guy.

[stvdv]

I think you tell yourself that so you don't have to worry about hell. It's a coping mechanism.

That is your belief, not a fact

My Master says that Hell does not exist, except in the mind of some people

I trust my Master to be right

 

[rational experiences]

I learnt you believe in spirit yet those humans choose and act out evil human acts.

I learnt you don't believe in spirit humans still choose and act out evil human acts.

Determined by humans who know human life is created equally and shouldn't be hurt by anyone.

Scientists can be good men.
Scientists can be evil men.

So you do a human assessment what is a humans saving answer?

Of life and behaviour.

First you see some humans DNA damaged as physical brain emotional. Dysfunctional behaviours.

Some humans motivated by anger.
Some by greed trade and rich in control.

What's the real human answer?

It's about definition of a correct human spirit teaching.

Who a human is and where we came from personally. To know why spiritual human life choices are only correct.

As some say a spiritual being as humans and others claim an evil being.

Yet we are only one being the human.

The human agreement simply does not exist.

As I can say father and mother. Animals after ice age came direct out of and owned the eternal body. That changed once inside the heavenly body.

Making them direct spiritual beings.

It you have science of God earth just human scientists with machine practices. Who by earth are claiming evolution from earth base themes just as humans.

Thinking by and as the human.

They cannot think by theme thesis until they personally exist.

 

[Clara Tea]

The chances of any of the Angels including Iblis disobeying him, were so low.
The chances of Adam who is one of God's elite chosen, to look towards the everlasting tree and exalted unending authority with envy, was so low.
The chances that Successors of Adam, be not followed by humanity, and instead loud mouth leaders and idols instead, were so low leading to Nuh, it was all so low.

Thousand of years of preaching by Nuh, the chances were supposed to be they heed his calls.

After that, chances of guidance were inverted. Due to diseases of example of disobedience and the "well a lot did it, so what's the big deal" and uninspiring nature of human majority, it became the opposite.

Now guidance which is so dear to God, became, something that was improbable for most. Generation to generation, he tries to fix it with his revelations and Messengers, but there is no cure for the disease.

Because people assume God knows the future, it looks bad. Because assume this is the way he intended them to be it looks bad.

Because people assume God's powers can make him do impossible like make square triangles, but it's how God expresses for example regarding the misguidance of Muslims (not limited to them) "how can God guide a people who disbelieve after they witnessed the Messenger is truth..."

He through his Messengers (Ali (a) to Hassan Al-Askari (a)) tried to annul the sorcery from sorcerers and Iblis forces, but people despite the emphasis to hold to God's chosen, guidance, and rope in the Quran, stick to people who are not appointed by God. Despite Rasool (s) words to hold on to Quran and family together, there's been a war to separate Quran from his family and his family from Quran while Quran unites them and calls them the "family of the reminder".

God is trying to save us from his wrath. He wants humans to mostly enter paradise and so has prolonged the life of the Twelfth Successor, but now the time, without miracles, is making it almost impossible to save them.

It seems the warnings are becoming unavoidable, and the warning to the Mahdi is meant to be avoided, and that we will be destroyed (except few believers as was in the past).

He doesn't want to bring the Mahdi and the world is in it's arrogant and heedless state, so that they look towards misguiding loud mouths and they like those in the past, accuse him of being a sorcerer when he performs miracles.

The entertainment business (just for entertainment we believe) always shows the top powerful person to be evil and show incredible powers like reviving dead and other things are not a display of power of God. This is from shows, to movies, to games. It doesn't matter. We been incepted.

The Quran which warns about the Mahdi more then the day of judgment is veiled with occult darkness and sorcery so that people are oblivious to the Mahdi in the Quran.

Ya Ali help.

Maybe God is training some people to see the futility of saving humans? My friend has been trying to show how to stop Global Warming by putting chemicals in the upper atmosphere (as super-volcano, Pinatubo, did). But, after getting discouraged by being called an idiot or nut, she is frustrated, and now thinks that maybe a lot of people shouldn't be saved. Why work hard to save them, if they don't even study Global Warming and try to save themselves?

 

[Clara Tea]

That is your belief, not a fact

My Master says that Hell does not exist, except in the mind of some people

I trust my Master to be right

Those with hell in their minds often make hell for others here on earth. They are overbearing and mean.

 

[wellwisher]

The reason God appears to be a bad guy, based on bible data, is because people still mistake Satan for God and refer to Satan as being God. God is not good and evil, that is the role of Satan. This world view comes from Satan, and not God.

God told Adam and Eve not to eat of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. This polarizing POV was never condoned by God. Eve and Adam were misled to polarize their perception of reality because Satan conned them into believing this was much better than it was.

When they ate from the tree of knowledge of good and evil they lost the instinct view of paradise being, as is, in exchange for a world and a world view that now appeared to breaks reality down into good and evil. Who decides that?

The very act of passing the value judgement, that God is good or evil, is an artifact of Satan's trick and Original sin. If Adam and Eve had been strong and there was no original sin, we would not know how to make polarizing value judgements of good and evil. Instead we would view the exact same bible data, from a unity POV; God's plan. This topic is a good example of original sin still in action.

As a science analogy, magnets have a north and a south pole. Science, treats the two poles as two separate things. However, neither pole can be totally isolated, as a self standing monopole. This separation into two is an illusion and convention and not a how reality is set up.

The separation into two opposites things is a convention and state of mind, that does not really exist, since neither pole can be isolated as a self standing thing or monopole. Both need to work together to get both affects.

The unity of God's plan is the magnet; period. The magnet does exist and it can be isolated. Physics has been looking for a monopole, as implied by the polarizing convention of north and south. But this is elusive, since it is perceptual illusion, that leads to problems in terms of seeing the unity of reality.

God never condoned this polarizing POV, that made us look at reality as two separate things, that really do not exist. This trick came from Satan and continues to come from Satan. Its most common expression is law which defines human behavior as good or evil. The person who is often viewed as the God of the Old Testament was really Satan. He was both good and evil, and not just one unified entity, like God the magnet.

This is why Paul said, it is not yes and no, but yes in him. It is not north and south pole, nether of which can be isolated; original sin, but just a single magnet; tree of life.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

The chances of any of the Angels including Iblis disobeying him, were so low.
The chances of Adam who is one of God's elite chosen, to look towards the everlasting tree and exalted unending authority with envy, was so low.
The chances that Successors of Adam, be not followed by humanity, and instead loud mouth leaders and idols instead, were so low leading to Nuh, it was all so low.

Thousand of years of preaching by Nuh, the chances were supposed to be they heed his calls.

After that, chances of guidance were inverted. Due to diseases of example of disobedience and the "well a lot did it, so what's the big deal" and uninspiring nature of human majority, it became the opposite.

Now guidance which is so dear to God, became, something that was improbable for most. Generation to generation, he tries to fix it with his revelations and Messengers, but there is no cure for the disease.

Because people assume God knows the future, it looks bad. Because assume this is the way he intended them to be it looks bad.

Because people assume God's powers can make him do impossible like make square triangles, but it's how God expresses for example regarding the misguidance of Muslims (not limited to them) "how can God guide a people who disbelieve after they witnessed the Messenger is truth..."

He through his Messengers (Ali (a) to Hassan Al-Askari (a)) tried to annul the sorcery from sorcerers and Iblis forces, but people despite the emphasis to hold to God's chosen, guidance, and rope in the Quran, stick to people who are not appointed by God. Despite Rasool (s) words to hold on to Quran and family together, there's been a war to separate Quran from his family and his family from Quran while Quran unites them and calls them the "family of the reminder".

God is trying to save us from his wrath. He wants humans to mostly enter paradise and so has prolonged the life of the Twelfth Successor, but now the time, without miracles, is making it almost impossible to save them.

It seems the warnings are becoming unavoidable, and the warning to the Mahdi is meant to be avoided, and that we will be destroyed (except few believers as was in the past).

He doesn't want to bring the Mahdi and the world is in it's arrogant and heedless state, so that they look towards misguiding loud mouths and they like those in the past, accuse him of being a sorcerer when he performs miracles.

The entertainment business (just for entertainment we believe) always shows the top powerful person to be evil and show incredible powers like reviving dead and other things are not a display of power of God. This is from shows, to movies, to games. It doesn't matter. We been incepted.

The Quran which warns about the Mahdi more then the day of judgment is veiled with occult darkness and sorcery so that people are oblivious to the Mahdi in the Quran.

Ya Ali help.

I'm getting some serious Stockholm Syndrome vibes here.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

Convenient to call Justice and Righteous retribution and vengeance that but like I said it's a coping mechanism for people who don't want there to be justice.

That's your belief, but it isn't mine anymore. I was a Christian for 30 years, so I'm quite familiar with the fear tactics of using the threat of God's wrath and going to hell against people who don't believe in God or people who no longer believe in God. You might as well save your breath, because these fear tactics don't scare me anymore. You can call my rejection of your message whatever you want; I don't care because your opinion of my rejection of your message has no bearing on me whatsoever. I want to be perfectly clear when I say that I won't be coerced with the threat of God's wrath or hell and emotionally manipulated into accepting God into my life again.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

Well the very idea of hell I think strengthens my case. Because here we have a god who creates creatures who he can convict of thought crimes and then torture for eternity. Did I miss anything here?

According to the Bible, God creates some people to be wicked. Proverbs 16:4 states, "The LORD works out everything to its proper end—even the wicked for a day of disaster." And according to the Bible, God also creates evil, disasters, and calamities (Isaiah 45:7).

In other words, God deliberately creates mayhem throughout the world that will inflict suffering on humanity. If the Bible is accurate about God's atrocious behavior of intentionally inflicting pain and suffering on humanity, then I think it's more than fair to conclude that he is insecure, egotistical, cruel, unjust, unethical, vengeful, incoherent, sadistic, psychopathic, barbaric, and bloodthirsty.

Proverbs 16:4

KJV: "The LORD hath made all things for himself: yea, even the wicked for the day of evil."

NIV: "The LORD works out everything to its proper end— even the wicked for a day of disaster."

ESV: "The LORD has made everything for its purpose, even the wicked for the day of trouble."

Wicked: 1. evil or immoral; 2. maliciously or mischievously playful; 3. severe and distressing.

Isaiah 45:7

KJV: "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things."

Evil:
1. Morally bad or wrong; wicked, 2. Causing ruin, injury, or pain; harmful, 3. Characterized by or indicating misfortune; ominous.

NIV: "I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, the LORD, do all these things."

Disaster:
1. An occurrence causing widespread destruction and distress; a catastrophe; 2. A grave misfortune, and 3. A total failure.

ESV: "I form light and create darkness; I make well-being and create calamity; I am the LORD, who does all these things."

Calamity: 1. An event that brings terrible loss, lasting distress, or severe affliction; a disaster, 2. Dire distress resulting from loss or tragedy; 3. Any great misfortune or cause of misery; in general, any event or disaster which produces extensive evils, as loss of crops, earthquakes, etc., but also applied to any misfortune which brings great distress on a person; misfortune; distress; adversity.

 

[Link]

That's your belief, but it isn't mine anymore. I was a Christian for 30 years, so I'm quite familiar with the fear tactics of using the threat of God's wrath and going to hell against people who don't believe in God or people who no longer believe in God. You might as well save your breath, because these fear tactics don't scare me anymore. You can call my rejection of your message whatever you want; I don't care because your opinion of my rejection of your message has no bearing on me whatsoever. I want to be perfectly clear when I say that I won't be coerced with the threat of God's wrath or hell and emotionally manipulated into accepting God into my life again.

Hell is no easy concept to believe in. I was non-Muslim for 5 years primarily because I couldn't handle the concept. However, when you know it's truth, then you have to submit to it even if you wish it was not true. If you don't know, then you should find out if it's truth or not.

Even some of the great Prophets (a) struggled with God's wrath at times (we see in Quran, Ibrahim (a) leans on side of mercy with respect to Lut's (a) people but is told to turn aside from trying to avert punishment for them).

 

[Link]

And if you recall, the Quran declares itself to be clear and easy to understand

The same verses (repeated in that Surah) that say Quran is made easy to remember says "...so will there be anyone who grasps?". This was said in a tone, perhaps, despite, how clear it is, it would all fall on deaf ears.

 

[icehorse]

The same verses (repeated in that Surah) that say Quran is made easy to remember says "...so will there be anyone who grasps?". This was said in a tone, perhaps, despite, how clear it is, it would all fall on deaf ears.

Would you agree that the Quran says that if a non-believer claims to believe, Allah will know the non-believer is lying?

 

[Link]

Would you agree that the Quran says that if a non-believer claims to believe, Allah will know the non-believer is lying?

Lying in what sense? This is the thing most people don't understand. Hypocrites convince themselves they are sincere believers and when talk to God are veiled in their own masks. This is what is meant they desire to deceive God, it's that they lie to themselves so much so they also address God with the same deception. They are lost.

Hypocrites don't see God's light but love talking about God. They are satisfied with outward acts of Islam while totally void of God's mercy and proximity.

So people can distinguish, Quran has shown signs, and Sunnah (words of Prophet (s) as well), and Imams (a) also show it.

There are ways you can know you are lying to yourself, but most people won't wake up from their lie.

 

[icehorse]

Lying in what sense? This is the thing most people don't understand. Hypocrites convince themselves they are sincere believers and when talk to God are veiled in their own masks. This is what is meant they desire to deceive God, it's that they lie to themselves so much so they also address God with the same deception. They are lost.

Ah, this is interesting. If I understand you correctly, your claim is that the non-believers don't even know they're lying about their belief?

IMO, hypocrites know what they're doing and they're trying to fool others. In this case, the non-believer knows that he doesn't believe, but claims to believe. Perhaps he would do this to try to avoid being punished as a non-believer? In any case, the Quran says that Allah knows when someone is lying like this, and those liars will be punished.

In that case, Allah punishes people for thought crimes, quite a cruel behavior on Allah's part, IMO.

 

[Link]

Ah, this is interesting. If I understand you correctly, your claim is that the non-believers don't even know they're lying about their belief?

IMO, hypocrites know what they're doing and they're trying to fool others. In this case, the non-believer knows that he doesn't believe, but claims to believe. Perhaps he would do this to try to avoid being punished as a non-believer? In any case, the Quran says that Allah knows when someone is lying like this, and those liars will be punished.

In that case, Allah punishes people for thought crimes, quite a cruel behavior on Allah's part, IMO.

They know better and yet are ignorant. Their lying to themselves is not sincere. I will respond to the issue of thought crimes in a different new thread (I will even it call it "thought crimes"). You bring an important point and so I feel a topic about it is due.

 

[1213]

...
Because people assume God knows the future, it looks bad. Because assume this is the way he intended them to be it looks bad....

I think God looks bad only if person doesn't know God, or doesn't understand properly what is good and right.

 

[icehorse]

I will respond to the issue of thought crimes in a different new thread (I will even it call it "thought crimes"). You bring an important point and so I feel a topic about it is due.

That sounds like a good topic for a thread.

They know better and yet are ignorant. Their lying to themselves is not sincere.

Back when Abrahamic scripture was written, people had some crude understanding of psychology. But we know a LOT more about psychology now than we did back then. It seems to me that you're making psychological claims based on an outdated understanding of the science.

 

[Link]

That sounds like a good topic for a thread.



Back when Abrahamic scripture was written, people had some crude understanding of psychology. But we know a LOT more about psychology now than we did back then. It seems to me that you're making psychological claims based on an outdated understanding of the science.

Damn, I'm going to have to make a topic about Psychology now too lol.

 

[rational experiences]

Is a human man.. man by owning a penis beginning a heavens spirit?

No.

Was the God O planet erection a volcano?

Yes.

Cloud smoke burning rolling voiding cooling from volcanic mass? In space void womb?

Yes.

Is your machine anything like that erection? History gases?

No.

So you can't make cloud reactions inside your new machine by man's history my sex penis erection?

No.

But you've been transmitting a Phi experiment as a new laboratory of man's machines experiments our heavens bio ownership..... as you the man own string invention of first ever machine?

Yes says lying I'm just a human man... just a human position.... human in biology...consciousness just human lying.

So by machine past my owned man reasoned I lie....

. .. Did Phi fallout stop end then cool as man gained an image of himself life in clouds?

Yes.

Okay so it went back causes to eternal hell first then a cold cloud?

Yes.

But cold just clouds were first?

Yes. Not owner man's image.

Gods heaven eternal hell not eternal life?

Yes.

Did it take humans living ground water microbiology and oxygen to form cloud cooling. As clouds protected human life from burning above?

Yes.

So you taught how man's machine caused fallout attack had been stopped...so you data letter numbered it and said it was cause of Phi by man theists and named it Jesus?

Yes.

Where do humans bodily physical bones rock and cell blood end? Dead on ground. Then decompose.

Reason cells exist as they own a living end already as does blood bone being a human. Natural life.

Okay.

So did the physical life die?

Yes.

Did you not put a letter number value on the dead human on the ground?

No. It wasn't about Phi...machine technology. Wasn't in the data testimony life versus machine scientists.

Okay.

It wouldn't tally then by a story letter number if you said dead human corpse as the result?

That's right it wouldn't have owned a legal testimony against science of man. As written proof by calculus only...why it's not real life by letter to a word value. As reading.

Reason why it wasn't stated as fact. Science murdered human animal biology life.

Argument legal. Depended on the legal human reading advising the correct use of the word. And how Phi fallout had to be proven as the legality.

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

I think you tell yourself that so you don't have to worry about hell. It's a coping mechanism.

Hell is the tool of the lazy.

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

Maybe God is training some people to see the futility of saving humans? My friend has been trying to show how to stop Global Warming by putting chemicals in the upper atmosphere (as super-volcano, Pinatubo, did). But, after getting discouraged by being called an idiot or nut, she is frustrated, and now thinks that maybe a lot of people shouldn't be saved. Why work hard to save them, if they don't even study Global Warming and try to save themselves?

How is polluting even more going to be helpful?