It's the usual cry from people when God gets too close !looks just like a call to conversion to me.....
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Where is the All-Giving gOd?
- Thread starter blackout
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blackout
Violet.
It's the usual cry from people when God gets too close !
If you would like to discuss the actual topic matter of this thread,
please...
by all means...
feel free.
'ello UV
Regarding the first question, the difference could be taken at the material level. If good is benevolent why not provide (give) all our material needs. It seems logical.
The difference, according to my understanding of scriptures, is that it is the recognition that material needs will not be fulfilled that we are told the answer is to look for benevolence in God Herself.
Material needs will not be fulfilled because material is itself limited. As you and I are limited by our bodies, so too is our possessions (money etc) limited. The answer is that by our very nature there are limitations but there are no limitations in God Herself, and that, I feel is why we are told to look to G0d for all our needs.
blackout
Violet.
What then is the point of looking to gOd for all of your needs,
if gOd then fails to provide them?
ie... in what way is this non giving, non responsiveness
in alignment with the idea/concept of benevolence?
So we have to want and lack,
in order to realize gOd is benevolent?
I'm not buyin' it.
When a person gives freely... to me...
I know their benevolence.
GOd should lavish like a lover does.
Without bounds.
Just because.
This would be "All Loving".
I don't see G0d as failing, I feel grateful for what I have and opimistic of the future. If you mean philosophically, then I would say that there is a difference of understanding of G0d or of what we should have between my answer and your perspective
I see nothing which is not G0d, and in doing so I see nothing which is not already given. There is no lack of benevolence there is only change: if I were to loose 50 dollars on the street that would be another's good fortune, I don't see another's good fortune as my loss, which is why I give to charity. The difference between loosing and giving is not only an action but an attitude and my attitude is that I never loose.G0d does not not give. G0d gave me life and showed me that everything is in consciousness. I don't feel I lack anything, even when G0d takes my life I will not feel sorry. Your question is a question of expectation and attitude, based on what you feel is lacking. It is this sense of lack which might be interesting to address, if it really exists. (I am not attacking you my friend, but trying to show my answer is based on a different attitude and I think that is key to my answer).
The fulfillment of every thing, even perceived failure, is what is given.
Twig pentagram
High Priest
Maybe he's with the All-Taking g0ddess.:dan:
blackout
Violet.
Not that I disagree, but...
This is not the posit/position held by those who raise up the Omipotent, Omniscient, All Loving, Omnibenevolent God though.
blackout
Violet.
I don't see G0d as failing, I feel grateful for what I have and opimistic of the future. If you mean philosophically, then I would say that there is a difference of understanding of G0d or of what we should have between my answer and your perspective
G0d does not not give. G0d gave me life and showed me that everything is in consciousness. I don't feel I lack anything, even when G0d takes my life I will not feel sorry. Your question is a question of expectation and attitude, based on what you feel is lacking. It is this sense of lack which might be interesting to address, if it really exists. (I am not attacking you my friend, but trying to show my answer is based on a different attitude and I think that is key to my answer).
I don't see god as failing either.
Somehow I'm not managing to express mySelf well in this thread.
I have not expressed MY perspective of gOd.
The only perspective I'm expressing here
is that it should follow,
that the 'classic' Omnipotent, Omniscient, All Loving, Omnibenevolent God
(in the "type" of the Christian god)
is also, Omni'giving.
Or how about instead,
Omni'provisional. or Omni'sharing. or Omni'bestowing. or Omni'caretaking.
I don't care how you put it.
MY actual thoughts on what gOd is or isn't,
I have not actually shared here.
I'm really just voicing a problem I have
with the 'Omni'max" version of god.
I was hoping for more Omni'max responses.
Perhaps, you could each post
if your concept of god is Omni'max,
and what that means to you personally.
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Hello UV
I see what you mean, you are expressing it clearly I believe. As you say, if god is omni-x why not omni-giving, why do some people go without and why isn't everything wonderful?
Obviously I would be lying if I said God does, because we only have to turn the news on the TV to see those going without. I cannot answer that, other than to say that it is materialism and material is always limited or countable. But the things which really matter are not material and limited, such as love. I cannot explain it another way yet.
Hope others have more explanations.
I see what you mean, you are expressing it clearly I believe. As you say, if god is omni-x why not omni-giving, why do some people go without and why isn't everything wonderful?
Obviously I would be lying if I said God does, because we only have to turn the news on the TV to see those going without. I cannot answer that, other than to say that it is materialism and material is always limited or countable. But the things which really matter are not material and limited, such as love. I cannot explain it another way yet.
Hope others have more explanations.
blackout
Violet.
I do not see any thing which is not gOd.
(as no'thing, also, is gOd)
Mine is the "All'gOd", or the "All'things" gOd.
Thus, it follows that my view of gOd is an Omni'present,
as well as an.... Omni'being.... type of view.
(as opposed to a 'seperate being' god)
The lack of benevolence I see around me
(in the world)
shows me that gOd (or all things/being/s)
are clearly not benevolent.
I see hunger and abuse and enslavement...
thievery of basic needs...
thus the All 'gOd, is also these things.
I see blue and green and Purple
and sprinkles and throw up and icecream
and fun and games and addiction and bullying.
All gOd.
I figure that 'All information' and ability
is located somewhere, with'in the All.
(or the potentiality of the All)
I see it as MY JOB to tap in.
How can you say that G0d does not give,
and then in the very next sentence
say that G0d gave you life and showed you
that everything is in consciousness?
Just wondering.
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blackout
Violet.
Hello UV
I see what you mean, you are expressing it clearly I believe. As you say, if god is omni-x why not omni-giving, why do some people go without and why isn't everything wonderful?
Obviously I would be lying if I said God does, because we only have to turn the news on the TV to see those going without. I cannot answer that, other than to say that it is materialism and material is always limited or countable. But the things which really matter are not material and limited, such as love. I cannot explain it another way yet.
Hope others have more explanations.
It certainly took a lot of effort!
*wipes the sweat from her brow*
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blackout
Violet.
I do not see any thing which is not gOd.
(as no'thing, also, is gOd)
Mine is the "All'gOd", or the "All'things" gOd.
Thus, it follows that my view of gOd is an Omni'present,
as well as an.... Omni'being.... type of view.
(as opposed to a 'seperate being' god)
The lack of benevolence I see around me
(in the world)
shows me that gOd (or all things/being/s)
are clearly not benevolent.
I see hunger and abuse and enslavement...
thievery of basic needs...
thus the All 'gOd, is also these things.
I see blue and green and Purple
and sprinkles and throw up and icecream
and fun and games and addiction and bullying.
All gOd.
I figure that 'All information' and ability
is located somewhere, with'in the All.
(or the potentiality of the All)
I see it as MY JOB to tap in.
How can you say that G0d does not give,
and then in the very next sentence
say that G0d gave you life and showed you
that everything is in consciousness?
Just wondering.
I like your part above
I was being a smarty pants above
, I said "God does not not give" not that "God does not give", I used a double negative to negate the idea that God does not give. In other words "it isn't that God doesn't give", God gives, but not in the way we think is even. Simply because life wouldn't be a challenge if we lived in an equal society, where the fridge is full every time you open the fridge door and the weight just drops off our hips when we eat pizza. Due to the nature of material, everything is limited. Why make a limited world? In order to have variation, to experience the play of life. Fair? Not for us, but when you are God and everything is your creation then fairness is not the top concern, experiencing variety is more interesting for God... perhaps.Yes, life is full of everything. All we need to do is to tap into it. On the spiritual level in fact it is is already here, so there is no need to tap into anything extra. Nothing is hidden, rather we are lead to think we are limited and cannot find it. Complete bliss and happiness is here, what stops us from seeing it is our unhappiness, for example. Remove the unhappiness and there is only happiness. That isn't so with money, as money is not spiritual, it is material, and materialism is limited by its nature. For more money you need a money tree of course.
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blackout
Violet.
I like your part above
I was being a smarty pants above
Yes, life is full of everything. All we need to do is to tap into it. On the spiritual level in fact it is is already here, so there is no need to tap into anything extra. Nothing is hidden, rather we are lead to think we are limited and cannot find it. Complete bliss and happiness is here, what stops us from seeing it is our unhappiness, for example. Remove the unhappiness and there is only happiness. That isn't so with money, as money is not spiritual, it is material, and materialism is limited by its nature. For more money you need a money tree of course.
You DID say that that!
Sorry.
I do know what you're getting at Onkara,
but when life... basic survival...
is so difficult,
and you are stuck living with others
who drag you down,
or even blatantly abuse you
and you have no power to overcome this,
like a child,
who cannot overcome his (supposed) 'guardians',
or someone with no resources
to get away from/out from under
a bad situation...
it can be very VERY hard
to "remove" the unhappiness.
As well, it is not my experience
that the "removal" of unhappiness,
necessarily results in happiness.
There's alot of "being" space,
in between the two.
I have found that
sometimes you find your happiness,
then turn around
and with all that newness of strength
beat the hell out of your unhappinesses
until they lie as corpses at your feet.
(ie. a source of strength >>> the power/motivation/help to overcome)
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We cannot do alone as much as we can do with others. We are limited physically. It is like a cruel joke, make human being limited and they must depend on others to help them. Also that implies we have to work together. Spice it up with some pride and greed and there is mean mixture of giving and withholding. But it isn't helpless, there are ways we can improve our outlook even if we cannot remove our limitations.
I simplified my answer when I said remove unhappiness. The question is what is unhappiness or rather what causes unhappiness. Together people can address those problems. Communication is key.
We must address the cause together for maximum affect. This is why we must recognise that God is everything and everywhere, like pantheist views. Because when we divide and cause limitations suffering is increased.
I simplified my answer when I said remove unhappiness. The question is what is unhappiness or rather what causes unhappiness. Together people can address those problems. Communication is key.
We must address the cause together for maximum affect. This is why we must recognise that God is everything and everywhere, like pantheist views. Because when we divide and cause limitations suffering is increased.
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What is there to give?
Beneath the lid of the basket there is nothing to give. Or restated, the whole is given.
No one is wanting anything or no is striving for liberation. On the screen, however, Cary Grant plays various roles.
...
blackout
Violet.
I must really be living on a different planet earth than some of you.
Shall we begin with....
Healthy food? Decent shelter? Heating oil? Time with your kids? Sleep? (or even a bed?) Health care?
Car that runs, (with tires that actually grip the road) so one can get to work
(especially during all those snow months, when you have to work to pay for the heating oil)...
(so you're not sick in your freezing house all winter, with no real healthcare,
until such time as you lose the house, for missing work... because you're sick with pneumonia...)
then of course, there is love and support in relationship?... friends?... an occasional babysitter?
*could easily go on, but doesn't*
Trust me. I'm playin' WAAAYYY too many roles,
all by mySelf.
If my theatre macabre doesn't allow for a whole new production soon,
I may fold.
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I prefer the so-called "omni-max" (omniscient/omnipotent/omnipresent), which would include good, to "omnibenevolent". The latter, I suspect, was just invented by atheists as something to argue.