What in The World Are They Spraying?

[9-10ths_Penguin]

As for all the rest of everyone, guys, I have done what was requested of me, I have provided data, rubbish and otherwise, it is up to you to decide, I can not take responsibility for what you heart and mind tells you to do or believe in. I gtg home, so, byes

That's the thing, though: you haven't done everything we've asked for.

Here's what I was trying to get at with my questions about concentrations and masses: is this actually even physically possible? My intuition says that if you really did want to saturate every farmer's field on Earth with aluminum to make it so that only some special strain of GM plants will grow, then you would need an insane quantity of aluminum... possibly more than the actual world supply, and almost certainly enough that its purchase would be noticed by someone.

Then, you would have the problem of actually spraying it. A plane can only hold so much weight in cargo. I strongly suspect that to spray the sheer mass of aluminum you're suggesting would mean that you'd need an insane number of flights... enough that the constant stream of aircraft from these bases would surely tip everyone off in the area that something fishy was going on.

So... you haven't even answered my most basic question: is what you're suggesting even physically possible?

 

[Father Heathen]

What i love about this is just how insistent people are at staying firmly asleep... Oh well..

If by "asleep" you mean honest and rational. Given that they're logically incoherent and lack solid evidence, we're left with no choice but to dismiss these goofy conspiracy theories.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

Oops.. Thats for dirty penguin.

See, I agree, but look, here I am on post number 58 and despite of providing vast amount of varied data I am still not coming through.. It is our own stubborn ignorance that gonna be the end of human race.. Its sad, really.

*goes off to yell into megaphone at passers by that the end is near*

As for all the rest of everyone, guys, I have done what was requested of me, I have provided data, rubbish and otherwise, it is up to you to decide, I can not take responsibility for what you heart and mind tells you to do or believe in. I gtg home, so, byes

You may not think you are but you're jacked in as much as the rest of us.

Do you.....

Drive a vehicle
Use electricity (from the grid)
Shop for groceries at the market
Wear clothes purchased from a store
Use tap water for any purpose
Use pens, markers, pencils
Use paper of any kind
etc...etc..

Then you, my friend, are jacked in.... In the production and/or supply of any of these things are by products that are and can be harmful to humans and animals alike. Don't worry about the plane in the sky because the car driving down the street exhausting fumes may kill you faster.....

 

[katiafish]

That's the thing, though: you haven't done everything we've asked for.

Here's what I was trying to get at with my questions about concentrations and masses: is this actually even physically possible? My intuition says that if you really did want to saturate every farmer's field on Earth with aluminum to make it so that only some special strain of GM plants will grow, then you would need an insane quantity of aluminum... possibly more than the actual world supply, and almost certainly enough that its purchase would be noticed by someone.

Then, you would have the problem of actually spraying it. A plane can only hold so much weight in cargo. I strongly suspect that to spray the sheer mass of aluminum you're suggesting would mean that you'd need an insane number of flights... enough that the constant stream of aircraft from these bases would surely tip everyone off in the area that something fishy was going on.

So... you haven't even answered my most basic question: is what you're suggesting even physically possible?

Yup and its being done now. Here, answered your question!

 

[katiafish]

You may not think you are but you're jacked in as much as the rest of us.

Do you.....

Drive a vehicle
Use electricity (from the grid)
Shop for groceries at the market
Wear clothes purchased from a store
Use tap water for any purpose
Use pens, markers, pencils
Use paper of any kind
etc...etc..

Then you, my friend, are jacked in.... In the production and/or supply of any of these things are by products that are and can be harmful to humans and animals alike. Don't worry about the plane in the sky because the car driving down the street exhausting fumes may kill you faster.....

Gosh, dont I know it

 

[katiafish]

If by "asleep" you mean honest and rational. Given that they're logically incoherent and lack solid evidence, we're left with no choice but to dismiss these goofy conspiracy theories.

hehe you are funny lol

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Yup and its being done now. Here, answered your question!

You realize that I'm trying to give your position a fair chance, don't you? When you act all evasive and play games with circular arguments, it makes it very difficult for me.

If you want me to believe this, then convince me. Show me evidence. Make an argument. But at the same time, realize that I'm going to need something more than the say-so of some anonymous internet source who goes straight from claiming that secret government planes are spraying poison on us to trying to convince me that I'll be safe from that posion if I just buy what he's selling me (at more than $100 a pop) and shove it up my butt... literally.

If you really do think that the sources you've posted so far should be convincing, then I suggest that you re-consider how you evaluate evidence. All you've given so far are wild claims with no support.

 

[katiafish]

Ok, you want me to be serious, fine. I believe it because I look out of my window every day and see huge expansive "clouds" over my house. I come from a country that has not been polluted by chemicals and i remember the sky of my childhood, it was tall, pure and blue. Sky here is hardly ever blue and crisp like that, it is always in a haze, even in clear days.
I am a parent, I have two kids that are at vulnerable age. As i have said before in a post you seem to have happened to ignore, I care deeply for their wellbeing and also for the state of the planet that they are inheriting. So to dismiss such claims with lightheartedness, unfortunately my consciousness does not allow me. Perhaps I am not that great at researching an information that you would deem "relevant", however, you went into all this incredible pain to prove me wrong without actually watching the film that I have provided, which is not entirely fair, as in that film a lot of the information that you have requested has been provided.

So do I believe that it is happening? Yes. Do i think everyone should believe what i believe? No. What I believe happens to be my reality and I believe firmly that all reality experience is subjective. As a matter of fact, i dont even know if by believing it in a first place I am making it manifest.. This is an open forum and i have chosen to share an information that I deem valuable, but that is my personal subjective experience of it. And as for you... Well, you construct your reality, have fun whilst at it.

With much love,
Kat

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Ok, you want me to be serious, fine. I believe it because I look out of my window every day and see huge expansive "clouds" over my house. I come from a country that has not been polluted by chemicals and i remember the sky of my childhood, it was tall, pure and blue. Sky here is hardly ever blue and crisp like that, it is always in a haze, even in clear days.

Your location says you're in London; it's famous for its drizzly weather. You can thank the Gulf Stream for that, not jets spraying chemicals in the clouds.

I've lived around Toronto my whole life. As far back as I can remember, jet trails all looked just like they do now: some dissipate quickly, some persist for hours. This is how it was even when I was a small child. I've personally witnessed exactly what we see today for my whole life, and I have clear memories of it going back more than 25 years.

I am a parent, I have two kids that are at vulnerable age. As i have said before in a post you seem to have happened to ignore, I care deeply for their wellbeing and also for the state of the planet that they are inheriting. So to dismiss such claims with lightheartedness, unfortunately my consciousness does not allow me.

I don't doubt your sincerity or concern, but I do think you're mistaken in your conclusion.

And you suggest something like the precautionary principle, but I don't think it works. If there really are elevated levels of aluminum and heavy metals in soils around the world, then we need to stop it. Prematurely latching onto the wrong conclusion will make it that much harder to find the real problem and come up with a solution. If you have decided that the cause is secret government jets, then if we find out that it's actually, say, toxic runoff from some industrial process, then you will be an obstacle to actually solving the problem and making the world healthier for your children.

Perhaps I am not that great at researching an information that you would deem "relevant", however, you went into all this incredible pain to prove me wrong without actually watching the film that I have provided, which is not entirely fair, as in that film a lot of the information that you have requested has been provided.

You haven't given me any reason to watch it. If you had put forward a valid argument for why what you suggest is even plausible, I might be inclined to watch it. However, the material that you've cited in this thread that I have been able to look at has been consistently poor quality. I think it's more likely than not that this hour-and-a-half-long video will be a complete waste of my time.

After seven pages of you presenting what I assume is your best case using your best arguments and evidence, you haven't even been able to convince me that watching your video is worthwhile... never mind convincing me that what you suggest is actually true. This is not because I've closed my mind to what you're suggesting; it's because you haven't actually presented anything but unsubstantiated claims and leaps of logic.

So do I believe that it is happening? Yes. Do i think everyone should believe what i believe? No. What I believe happens to be my reality and I believe firmly that all reality experience is subjective.

Well... no. It's either happening or it's not. If you're right, then I'm wrong. This isn't a matter of subjective "reality".

As a matter of fact, i dont even know if by believing it in a first place I am making it manifest..

This is an open forum and i have chosen to share an information that I deem valuable, but that is my personal subjective experience of it. And as for you... Well, you construct your reality, have fun whilst at it.

Well then, fine: I have constructed a reality where there aren't secret government plots to spray aluminum over the countryside, where corporations are run like profit-seeking enterprises and not like SPECTRE from James Bond, and where I don't have to shove mysterious medications up my butt to save myself from poison from the sky. Problem solved.

 

[blackout]

Well there definitely are two distinct kinds,
and if someone could explain WHY
there are two distinct kinds,
why some just vaporize right away,
and some sit there all day long
it might help clear up the issue in question.

They don't behave the same way,
or look the same.

They both trail airplanes.
That's their biggest visible similarity.

Off the top of my head, I know that the windspeed can vary quite a bit in the upper atmosphere. The jet stream will move north and south, and twist or straighten out... as this happens, it creates major differences in the wind at a particular spot. And this is all at very high altitude; you won't be able to feel the jet stream from the ground.


Here's a question for you: let's pretend for a moment that this hypothesis is correct, and that world governments are secretly sprinkling aluminum in the air to combat global warming.

This would've started some time after global warming became an issue of concern, right? When would that have been? At the earliest, it would've been some time in the 80s, right?

Now... I know you're a bit older than me, so you should be able to remember back before that as well. Do you remember seeing both types of contrails when you were a kid? I know I do.

Was that question for me?

I didn't come in here to discuss anything but contrails.

I'm simply saying, that the whole issue could be put to rest,
I think,
if someone could put forth a COMPREHENSIVE and specific
Scientific explination (as opposed to general conjecture)
of the extreme visual/behavioral difference
of what appears to be two radically different kinds of contrails.
(in terms that a layman can clearly understand)

Certainly SOMEONE on this forum must be able to do that.

And actually, no, I only remember contrails that
disappeared/'vaporized' behind the plane
from when I was a kid.
Unless I mistook the others for clouds after the fact,
which is entirely possible.
They look alot like long streaky clouds.
I tend to remember round puffy clouds though.
And also clear blue skies.
But it was a LONG time ago,:areyoucra
(maybe children tend to see pillow clouds in clear blue skies?)
so I really can't say for sure
what I saw in the sky when I was young.
Most people don't remember what they saw in the sky yesterday.
You know?


Anyway, all I'm saying is,
the easiest way to clear up the question,
is to explain exactly what makes a contrail a contrail,
what the characteristics of a contrail are,
and WHY. In scientific terms.
If the answer is CLEAR
testable, demonstratable and provable
by peer review,
at least you can say that science
has made all of the other conjectures
look .... well .... highly unecessary.

 

[blackout]

As a side note,
I really don't trust people in general,
to be honest or forthcoming about anything really,
if it's not in (support of) their own best interest.

From the smallest of issues,
to the largest.
I see that despite all claims to the contrary,
people are out to take care of
(what they percieve to be) "their own" first.

Human beings tend to have "selective" vision
to the benefit of Their Own Self preservation.

Which is all fine.
It's just how it is.

As a result though,
I don't base my reality much at all around what other people assume, say and believe.
It really doesn't matter who they are.

 

[blackout]

Surely basic school science textbooks cover contrails.

Since there seems to be some issue as to
what contrails were like back a few generations,
it would be interesting to get science texts from different eras
and compare the entries.

I just think the issue/discussion should stay on contrails,
unless it becomes implicitly questionable
that the trails in question
are contrails at all.
(by clear scientific standards)

Then the next obvious question would be,
"What are they"/"Why are they there"/"How are they explained".
This would require a few airplanes,'
a few pilots,
and a few teams of scientists I suppose.
(better off independent...
ie not employed/funded by anyone who might "care"
or even be percieved to "care" about the results
for reasons of Self Interest )

But as I say,
I'm not a science person.
So I'm just imagining a procedure.

 

[mjgpgh]

I'm not a science person at all,
so I'm wondering
why a contrail would get more and more puffy
and last for hours and hours, all day even, in one spot.

But then sometimes a plane goes by and the contrail disappears
behind the plane even before the plane is completely out of sight.
And it doesn't get thick, it just streams out behind the plane,
and fades away.

Other times, the thick puffy lines are there all day. Why?

What is the science behind contrails
that accounts for such an extreme difference?

Hi Ultraviolet, the difference is that contrails disipate quickly because all they are is hot jet engine exaust coming into contact with the cold thin air, condensation. Chemtrails do not disipate quickly, they are a concentration of heavy metals, chicken embryos, they are designed to break down the human Immune system, as well as other sinister motives. I have been researching them for the past ten years when I first started noticing them, and them not disipating like normal contrails. It boggles my mind how this is going on right under our noses, and no one even investigates it themselves, they accept what theyre told, that they are to reflect the suns ultraviolet rays, to ease global warming, Wake Up!! there's no such thing as global warming, If anthing, the earth is getting colder due to the pole shifts.

 

[mjgpgh]

Ok, well, so you do admit it that from engineering standpoint it is not too much of a challenge to do it. Now to the question of Why would they do it, way i understand it is they are spraying different chemicals which affects the natural gestation and grwth of the organic plant seed, whilst simultaneously there are government supported companies that are developing the genetically modified seeds that can survive the chemicals in the soil. If the spraying does not stop, farmers around the world might end up in a situation where they can not grow anything unless they spend millions of buying this genetically modified seeds. Now to add 2+2 and think where money from this will go, where else but on the very same military development.

That is not to mention that the chemicals make people sick, which again makes them to rely on drugs developing industries and so on and so forth..

Hardly a conspiracy really, as long as there are people going "I dont believe these conspiracy theories, I dont believe whats right in front of my face", the people responsible for this dont even have to hide...

Hey Kat, Wholeness dear, lets not forget that the honey bee poulation has also been affected geatly by these poison chemtrails, anyone can look up whats known as Colony Collapse Disorder, where honey bees lose they're sense of direction, unable to find theyre way back to the hive, therefore they die, millions of bees have died, threatening our food sources.

 

[katiafish]

Your location says you're in London; it's famous for its drizzly weather. You can thank the Gulf Stream for that, not jets spraying chemicals in the clouds.

I've lived around Toronto my whole life. As far back as I can remember, jet trails all looked just like they do now: some dissipate quickly, some persist for hours. This is how it was even when I was a small child. I've personally witnessed exactly what we see today for my whole life, and I have clear memories of it going back more than 25 years.


I don't doubt your sincerity or concern, but I do think you're mistaken in your conclusion.

And you suggest something like the precautionary principle, but I don't think it works. If there really are elevated levels of aluminum and heavy metals in soils around the world, then we need to stop it. Prematurely latching onto the wrong conclusion will make it that much harder to find the real problem and come up with a solution. If you have decided that the cause is secret government jets, then if we find out that it's actually, say, toxic runoff from some industrial process, then you will be an obstacle to actually solving the problem and making the world healthier for your children.


You haven't given me any reason to watch it. If you had put forward a valid argument for why what you suggest is even plausible, I might be inclined to watch it. However, the material that you've cited in this thread that I have been able to look at has been consistently poor quality. I think it's more likely than not that this hour-and-a-half-long video will be a complete waste of my time.

After seven pages of you presenting what I assume is your best case using your best arguments and evidence, you haven't even been able to convince me that watching your video is worthwhile... never mind convincing me that what you suggest is actually true. This is not because I've closed my mind to what you're suggesting; it's because you haven't actually presented anything but unsubstantiated claims and leaps of logic.


Well... no. It's either happening or it's not. If you're right, then I'm wrong. This isn't a matter of subjective "reality".





Well then, fine: I have constructed a reality where there aren't secret government plots to spray aluminum over the countryside, where corporations are run like profit-seeking enterprises and not like SPECTRE from James Bond, and where I don't have to shove mysterious medications up my butt to save myself from poison from the sky. Problem solved.

Meh, Really, i cant be asked anymore, I have provided vast amounts of data, most of it you have chosen to ignore for whatever reason, and the only bit of the data that attracted your attention is the one bit where it talks about putting things in one's butt. The original post had a video, the name of this thread is based on the name of the video, you have not watched that or any of the other video's provided, hence you can not make a valid judgment on the subject at hand, and hence you opinion is heavily biased, unreasonable and unfair. With my best intention i have no interest in continuing the conversation under these circumstances. You may challenge me further after you have contemplated all data at hand and conducted your own research to prove everyone who says that chemtrails are a real danger wrong. Only then i shall consider your argument valuable.

With much love,
Kat

 

[katiafish]

Hey Kat, Wholeness dear, lets not forget that the honey bee poulation has also been affected geatly by these poison chemtrails, anyone can look up whats known as Colony Collapse Disorder, where honey bees lose they're sense of direction, unable to find theyre way back to the hive, therefore they die, millions of bees have died, threatening our food sources.

Oh hun, in one of the videos I have provided they talk about it in depth. Unfortunately those videos have been vastly ignored.

 

[mjgpgh]

Ok, well, so you do admit it that from engineering standpoint it is not too much of a challenge to do it. Now to the question of Why would they do it, way i understand it is they are spraying different chemicals which affects the natural gestation and grwth of the organic plant seed, whilst simultaneously there are government supported companies that are developing the genetically modified seeds that can survive the chemicals in the soil. If the spraying does not stop, farmers around the world might end up in a situation where they can not grow anything unless they spend millions of buying this genetically modified seeds. Now to add 2+2 and think where money from this will go, where else but on the very same military development.

That is not to mention that the chemicals make people sick, which again makes them to rely on drugs developing industries and so on and so forth..

Hardly a conspiracy really, as long as there are people going "I dont believe these conspiracy theories, I dont believe whats right in front of my face", the people responsible for this dont even have to hide...

Oh yes Kat, the pharma companies are getting a huge peace of this poison pie, you get sick, go to the doctor, he prescribes medications, of course getting a kickback from them, people need to realize that the Medical Establishments are just money making schemes, you dont need to take medications, they are poison, just like the vaccines are, they contain thymerisol, and mercury, MERCURY people!!! Mercury is a deadly poison. Alternative to all medications: MMS google it, take this, and say goodbye to your money sucking doctor, till you break a bone of course, lol

 

[mjgpgh]

There are?

Which companies? How do you know?


Wait... but wasn't your original claim that they were spraying to stop global warming?


Let me get this straight... you're suggesting that there is some sort of partnership between:

- government
- the "military development" (btw: do you mean the government again, or are you talking about defense contractors?)
- agricultural companies
- pharmaceutical companies

And they're all in cahoots in a secret campaign to use government jets (BTW - is it just government jets, or are the airlines in on this, too?) to spray things in the upper atmosphere to kill crops and make people sick so that they can sell more genetically modified seeds and drugs?

This seems exceedingly improbable. For one thing, even if these companies were completely motivated by profit and not worried about inflicting human misery at all, it seems like a very complicated and risky venture for them, with a huge expense but little opportunity for profit. After all, once Monsanto or Pfizer or whoever it is has spent billions upon billions of dollars on this secret campaign, one of their competitors (i.e. one of the ones who hasn't spent all that money) could just as easily swoop in and come up with their own aluminum-tolerant crop or anti-whatever medication. Then, all the conspirators would be out their money without seeing the profit they expected.

So... obviously, such a campaign wouldn't be motivated by humanitarianism. Apparently, common sense also tells us that it wouldn't be motivated by abject greed. What's left? Let's say that all these conspirators are really doing this... why? What's in it for them?

And more importantly: what evidence do you actually have that any of this is going on?


I'll believe anything... as long as I have good reason to believe it. So far, you haven't presented any evidence that what you suggest is actually happening.

First off, it's the U.S. Navy that is doing the spraying, rense.com/general15/chemUSmilitarycontinues.htm add the http www at the beginning, i cant post links yet. and the motive has nothing to do with money, the people behind it have all the money they need,this is more about a system of control, and a means of lowering our natural vibrations, and keeping us from connecting with the creator energy, that which you people would call God, but God isn't what you think it is, religions are just another system of control. People need to wake up and see that we have been lied to for centuries about what we really are, and where we really come from. Stop listening to so called "Authority" they are only steering you away from the truth.

 

[blackout]

Hi Ultraviolet, the difference is that contrails disipate quickly because all they are is hot jet engine exaust coming into contact with the cold thin air, condensation. Chemtrails do not disipate quickly, they are a concentration of heavy metals, chicken embryos, they are designed to break down the human Immune system, as well as other sinister motives. I have been researching them for the past ten years when I first started noticing them, and them not disipating like normal contrails. It boggles my mind how this is going on right under our noses, and no one even investigates it themselves, they accept what theyre told, that they are to reflect the suns ultraviolet rays, to ease global warming, Wake Up!! there's no such thing as global warming, If anthing, the earth is getting colder due to the pole shifts.

Before addressing the idea of "chemtrails" at all,
I'd like FIRST to assume they are contrails,
and have someone explain contrails in all of their forms and appearances.

I don't want to hear that they're NOT contrails.
I want someone to explain contrails,
so we can understand that despite the differences
they are BOTH contrails,
and here is why.

 

[katiafish]

[youtube]Psdg3OAw_a8[/youtube]
YouTube - Killer Chemtrails: The Shocking Truth

in this video the difference is obvious UV