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What do you think about other religions?

Do all the major religions..

  • Teach spiritual virtues

    Votes: 15 83.3%
  • Teach good character

    Votes: 14 77.8%
  • Come from the same God

    Votes: 11 61.1%

  • Total voters
    18

Sundance

pursuing the Divine Beloved
Premium Member
But some Baha'is have said that all of the other religions have added in "traditions" of man and/ or have misinterpreted their own Scriptures. Those Baha'is are not accepting the other religions as is. To be complete, it sounds more like those Baha'is expect people in the other religions to recognize that the Baha'i Faith is the fulfillment and continuation of their old religion. And that if they only take and look, they will see that as being true and become Baha'is and drop out of their old religion.

As for adding traditions onto the original teachings of any religion, this is true, independently of anything Bahá’ís say. It’s observable reality. The Christianity of today is not the same as the Christianity of Jesus’s Time, nor is the Buddhism of today the same as when Lord Buddha first appeared. Of course, though, this principle is true for practically everything in existence. It doesn’t stay the same as it was originally; it changes over time.

As for misinterpreting their own scriptures, again, I wouldn’t deny that in certain respects (again, independently of Bahá’í teachings), certain followers of various religions have distorted the teachings. Take Jews for example, some of whom had taken the Biblical idea of themselves as a chosen people way past the point of calling others to a life of holiness and purity of heart and turned it into a grossly inaccurate idea of non-Jews being inherently impure or inferior to them, which wasn’t the original purpose of that teaching.

As to this claim made that Bahá’ís don’t accept other religions as is, this is wrong. We do. With this said, however, just because someone accepts that a religion teaches what it does does not necessarily mean that they agree with every single thing that religion teaches. Take for example, the Biblical idea that Jesus Christ was bodily resurrected. It is true that the Bible plainly teaches the bodily resurrection, but it does not follow that because a person acknowledges the validity of the Bible as sacred and of the person of Christ Jesus as a Divine Teacher, the person has to accept that belief wholesale. Otherwise, he or she would be a Christian themselves. Have I spoken falsely thus far?

As for the fulfillment of prophetic expectations of various religions, I leave the deep diving into those more to Bahá’ís from those specific backgrounds. I’m going to speak as a person from a devout Christian upbringing. Admittedly, when I first encountered Bahá’u’lláh’s claim to be the Return of Christ, truthfully I was very skeptical, and not just skeptical, I had felt livid. How could this man from Persia be the Second Coming of my Jesus, right?? Without even giving Him a chance to really explain Himself, I became upset with Bahá’u’lláh. But then, something led me to explore what He was talking about. What did I discover? I discovered that He meant something different by the concept of ‘Return’ than I had initially thought. By the idea of ‘Return’, Bahá’u’lláh meant that the attributes and qualities of the Spirit of Christ would manifest in a new person, Himself. It was like a lightbulb went off in my head! (“Ohhhhh. That’s what He meant.”, I said.) Everything after that began to click for me.

Accepting Bahá’u’lláh’s claims is a matter of the person’s own heart and mind. You’re absolutely right on that, CG. Though, I will say that in terms of the completeness that people of diverse backgrounds feel, it comes more from Bahá’u’lláh’s conception of religion as one harmonious whole, glimpsed through different outward forms, from different teachers, than any particular fulfillment of prophecy.
 

Sundance

pursuing the Divine Beloved
Premium Member
Some religions were wrong don't you think? I use the example of the Aztecs. They sacrificed people to their Gods. Was that true and beautiful? Maybe to them, but then the Spanish came and conquered them and brought with them their religion and forced it on the Aztecs. A religion that had a dying and rising savior, an evil spirit-being and his demons, a God that had flooded the whole world at one time and said that one day he was going to cast all people that don't believe in his son into hell. Was that religion true?

Certain ideas and practices in other religions were wrong, yes, but that comes more so from people’s own understandings.
 

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
As to this claim made that Bahá’ís don’t accept other religions as is, this is wrong. We do.
By that I meant that Baha'is don't accept their current beliefs and practices as being true. And that's where some Baha'is have said they have lost the original teachings by adding in traditions and by misinterpreting what the prophet had said. But we don't have these "original" teachings. For almost all the religions, all we have is what the followers have written down, so already those things they say could very easily been altered from what the prophet had originally said and taught.

It is true that the Bible plainly teaches the bodily resurrection,
And then we have some Baha'is denying what the gospel writers have said really happened. I don't think it's a misinterpretation to say that the gospel stories have an empty tomb and Jesus back alive and walking around. More of a misinterpretation would be that Jesus didn't come back to life. Or... why not a hoax? The gospels were written years later. Lots of legends and traditions about people seeing Jesus could have been going around, and the gospel writers went with along with it. But several Baha'is have said that the "true" resurrection of Jesus was that he rose spiritually, not physically. But how does a spiritual resurrection leave an empty tomb? One Baha'i did say that he thought the body of Jesus was taken and hidden away. But that's saying the resurrection story is fictional and what? Made up to hide the fact that his followers took the body of Jesus and hid it?

And that's just dealing with Christianity. Thrown in the other religions like Hinduism and Buddhism, then Baha'is have to find a way to make the Kalki Avatar and the Maitreya Buddha to both return as the same person and in Persia and end up in Palestine. I really doubt that's in any of their prophecies.
 

Sundance

pursuing the Divine Beloved
Premium Member
By that I meant that Baha'is don't accept their current beliefs and practices as being true. And that's where some Baha'is have said they have lost the original teachings by adding in traditions and by misinterpreting what the prophet had said. But we don't have these "original" teachings. For almost all the religions, all we have is what the followers have written down, so already those things they say could very easily been altered from what the prophet had originally said and taught.

With the first sentence, again, Bahá’ís do agree with certain things in other religions’ teachings and disagree with certain others. Other than that, I would agree with your assessment.

And then we have some Baha'is denying what the gospel writers have said really happened. I don't think it's a misinterpretation to say that the gospel stories have an empty tomb and Jesus back alive and walking around. More of a misinterpretation would be that Jesus didn't come back to life. Or... why not a hoax? The gospels were written years later. Lots of legends and traditions about people seeing Jesus could have been going around, and the gospel writers went with along with it. But several Baha'is have said that the "true" resurrection of Jesus was that he rose spiritually, not physically. But how does a spiritual resurrection leave an empty tomb? One Baha'i did say that he thought the body of Jesus was taken and hidden away. But that's saying the resurrection story is fictional and what? Made up to hide the fact that his followers took the body of Jesus and hid it?

And that's just dealing with Christianity. Thrown in the other religions like Hinduism and Buddhism, then Baha'is have to find a way to make the Kalki Avatar and the Maitreya Buddha to both return as the same person and in Persia and end up in Palestine. I really doubt that's in any of their prophecies.

When you speak of the fulfillment of prophecy in general, it’s important to remember that Bahá’ís are often metaphorical or allegorical in interpretation of prophecy. You base your critique on the idea that a literal interpretation of prophecy is inherently the correct one. That’s where the disconnect comes from.

Speaking to your issue regarding the resurrection of Jesus, Bahá’ís do disagree with how Christians see it. There’s no doubt that Christ read the story of the resurrection in the New Testament and say “Oh, it happened physically, and that’s that.” Firstly, independently of anything we’re saying as Bahá’ís, we have no independent historical evidence regarding the bodily resurrection of Jesus Christ, like we do for His Crucifixion. So, really all there is are the writings of the New Testament and the interpretations of Christians. From what it appears to me, it seems that to try to make sense of the unfortunate situation of Christ’s death, people had hoped for Jesus being physically there. I wouldn’t call that a misinterpretation of any scripture, rather an fantastical wish built upon trying to understand the reality of what happened.
 

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
Take Jews for example, some of whom had taken the Biblical idea of themselves as a chosen people way past the point of calling others to a life of holiness and purity of heart and turned it into a grossly inaccurate idea of non-Jews being inherently impure or inferior to them, which wasn’t the original purpose of that teaching.
That simply is not a teaching within Judaism. Torah, including all the 613 Commandments, was only for Jews according to Torah itself, thus non-Jews would not be held to be observant of them but should instead follow the Noachide Laws: Seven Laws of Noah - Wikipedia
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
If by "accepting", you mean, "believing", in my opinion, People cannot believe in someone that cannot see truth in Him. If a Christian does not see truth in Muhammad, then he cannot accept Muhammad, and that is not blameworthy.

I personally do not believe that will ever happen.
I never say never since nobody can know what the future holds. If we are only looking at what we see in the present it seems like it will never happen, but I believe the world ill be much different hundreds of years from now.

As a Baha'i, I believe it will happen eventually since it has been ordained by God.

“That which the Lord hath ordained as the sovereign remedy and mightiest instrument for the healing of all the world is the union of all its peoples in one universal Cause, one common Faith. This can in no wise be achieved except through the power of a skilled, an all-powerful and inspired Physician. This, verily, is the truth, and all else naught but error.”
The Summons of the Lord of Hosts, p. 91
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
I know Baha'is believe they have the truth from God for today and believe that their teachings have replaced the teachings of all the other religions. So, can a Baha'i really accept the beliefs held by people in the other religions? Especially when Baha'is believe some of those teachings and doctrine are corrupted and not true.... like the belief of some Christians that Jesus is God.
Personally, no. I do not accept teachings and doctrines that I believe are corrupted and not true, like the belief of some Christians that Jesus is God or the belief that Jesus is the only way or the belief that Jesus is going to return in the physical clouds. I go haywire over such beliefs.
So, will a Baha'i compromise some of their teachings for the sake of unity?
Some Baha'is might but I won't, because it is dishonest to do so.
Or do they expect that people in the other, "outdated" and possibly corrupted, religions to compromise some of their beliefs.
I don't expect anyone to compromise their beliefs. To each his or her own.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Certainly explains why the Bahai are so interested in other religions. I know of no other faith with such interest in what others do.
I am a Baha'i and I have no interest in other religions or what people of other faiths do. I guess I am just the exception.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Contrasting Ahmadiyya Islam with the Bahai Faith is a very informative exercise, not least because their reasons for existing are so similar.
The claims might be similar, but the evidence that backs the claims is not similar, since Ahmad has nothing to back up his claim, all he has is a claim.
By contrast, Baha'u'llah fulfilled all the Bible prophecies for the return of Christ and the Messiah of the Old Testament.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
So, what can Baha'is really do and say about the other religions? Knowing that Baha'is believe that all people must turn to this new religion in order to bring peace and unity and the "oneness" of religion?
Imo, the Baha'is really should not be saying anything about other religions, and in real life (off the forum) I don't know any Baha'is who talk about other religions. They only talk about the Baha'i Faith.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Are Baha'is doing the same with the writings of Baha'u'llah? They make them so important that they forget to be loving, respectful and accepting of other people in the other religions?
What are Christians doing with the Bible? Do they make the Bible so important that they forget to be loving, respectful and accepting of other people in the other religions?
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
I think the best thing the Bahais of world can do in this regard is to live up to the Bahai standards. Deeds, but not words alone can spread the teachings. I remember Shoghi effendi said something like this...
Yes, Shoghi Effendi sure did say that:

“Not by the force of numbers, not by the mere exposition of a set of new and noble principles, not by an organized campaign of teaching—no matter how worldwide and elaborate in its character—not even by the staunchness of our faith or the exaltation of our enthusiasm, can we ultimately hope to vindicate in the eyes of a critical and sceptical age the supreme claim of the Abhá Revelation. One thing and only one thing will unfailingly and alone secure the undoubted triumph of this sacred Cause, namely, the extent to which our own inner life and private character mirror forth in their manifold aspects the splendor of those eternal principles proclaimed by Bahá’u’lláh.” Bahá’í Administration, p. 66
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
These facts are not a gross misrepresentation of scripture. They are truthful realities of the state of so called Christianity, and religion. The scriptures agree.
These religions misrepresent scripture.
All Christians say that the 'other Christians' misrepresent scripture. ;)
 

SalixIncendium

अग्निविलोवनन्दः
Staff member
Premium Member
As a member of your faith, do you accept other religions are true or only your religion?

I accept that other religions are true to the followers of those religions. My religion is true to me.

Does your religion promote fellowship between members of other faiths or not.

My religion recognizes that I and others are of the same nature. It doesn't really speak much that I know of on "members of other faiths."

Do you ever read or study other religions within your religion.

I read and/or study other religions at my own leisure. To my knowledge, my religion isn't really interested in other religions.

Do you think religions can unite and accept each other. For example Jews accept Christ and Christians accept Muhammad. If not why not?

Accept that as what?
 

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
It’s interesting though that Buddhists put Buddha on the same kind of pedestal that Christians put Christ.
But where do Baha'is put Baha'u'llah? His teachings, you believe, are absolutely true and are the word of God for today. Which, even if the teachings of the other religions were exactly and absolutely true also, the message of Baha'u'llah has replaced them. That would make his teachings more important than the teachings of any other prophet/founder of any of the other religions. But... Baha'is don't believe the messages were exactly true in most all of those other religions.

Certain ideas and practices in other religions were wrong, yes, but that comes more so from people’s own understandings.
And I think that some of the contradictory messages are right there in the Scriptures of the other religions. Then, on top of that, Baha'is believe they were misinterpreted. Making Baha'u'llah's message, for Baha'is, way superior. Since, Baha'is believe, they are the words of God as revealed to Baha'u'llah without having to depend on what his followers remembered him saying and then writing them down years later.

I accept that other religions are true to the followers of those religions. My religion is true to me.
And, you Baha'is I'm sure know this. This is what we have. People in each religion loving, believing and becoming more spiritual because of their religion and the Scriptures of their religions and the practices of their religion. Which are very different than the beliefs and practices of the Baha'i Faith. Why would any leave a spiritual path and religion that they believe is true and is working for them and replace it with the supposedly knew and better message of the Baha'i Faith that, in some ways, and maybe in many ways, contradicts their beliefs.

You Baha'is may not think you are doing this, but, in the way you present your message, you are saying "The Baha'i Faith is here. It is the fulfillment of your religion. Come and let's all be at one with this new teaching from God." And, maybe directly or indirectly, Baha'is are saying "Your religion is outdated and maybe even filled with false beliefs and doctrines. But ours is pristine. It is the word of God for today." That's putting the Baha'i Faith and Baha'u'llah at the top of the heap. And, if what you say about him is true, then he should be. But that's the question... Is he all you say he is?
 

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
When you speak of the fulfillment of prophecy in general, it’s important to remember that Bahá’ís are often metaphorical or allegorical in interpretation of prophecy. You base your critique on the idea that a literal interpretation of prophecy is inherently the correct one. That’s where the disconnect comes from.
Which prophecies in any religion have the Promised One come, get rejected, get exiled and imprisoned, die and then say that because the world rejected him, it would go through a time of tribulations? I've asked this many times. As far as I know, not one Baha'i has given me an answer.

Just going by the NT, I think the tribulations come before Christ comes. Do you see it differently?
 
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