osgart
Nothing my eye, Something for sure
So your God is one of Supreme sacrifice I take it.
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What are the attributes of a worthy God?
- Thread starter osgart
- Start date
That's one way of looking at it, but I see it more as (and Christianity teaches it as) self-sacrificial love, selfless love (i.e. without selfish motivation) and sharing of self in a community. The Trinity is a very mystical concept.
osgart
Nothing my eye, Something for sure
There's nothing more noble and caring then self sacrificial, selfless love for the sake of others. So I wouldn't argue against that as a worthy quality.
Bathos Logos
Active Member
It would take a lot for me to even accept that something was a "god" in the first place, honestly. Once that had been established, and the thing had been demonstrated to meet some basic definition of "god" that I could accept, only then would it even make sense to discuss what qualities it did or didn't have that would make it worthy of admiration and praise.
And what I find truly interesting is that as I sit here, thinking on what those attributes might be, I realize they are the attributes that I, myself, highly prize. For example, I don't think I could admire, or praise the actions or reactions of a God that shied away from confrontation. Though I wouldn't look to it to actively start confrontations, as this doesn't promote peace (another item of high prize on my list), I would admire the idea that it reacted to confrontation brought to its doorstep with fortitude and a cool head. I would admire it only if it always had rational and practical reasoning backing any and all prescriptions or requirements it had of people, and readily and freely gave those reasons honestly and forthrightly. I would admire it if it had the best interests of all living things in mind, and not just the best interests of human beings - if it could and would cherish and honor the perspectives of the other denizens of this planet who I feel deserve such consideration just as much as humans. In other words, it would need to be very much unlike many of the gods that have been presented by various religions in order for me to genuinely admire the way it behaved.
And what I find truly interesting is that as I sit here, thinking on what those attributes might be, I realize they are the attributes that I, myself, highly prize. For example, I don't think I could admire, or praise the actions or reactions of a God that shied away from confrontation. Though I wouldn't look to it to actively start confrontations, as this doesn't promote peace (another item of high prize on my list), I would admire the idea that it reacted to confrontation brought to its doorstep with fortitude and a cool head. I would admire it only if it always had rational and practical reasoning backing any and all prescriptions or requirements it had of people, and readily and freely gave those reasons honestly and forthrightly. I would admire it if it had the best interests of all living things in mind, and not just the best interests of human beings - if it could and would cherish and honor the perspectives of the other denizens of this planet who I feel deserve such consideration just as much as humans. In other words, it would need to be very much unlike many of the gods that have been presented by various religions in order for me to genuinely admire the way it behaved.
Sgt. Pepper
All you need is love.
To be blunt, a god worthy of my worship, admiration, and praise would have to be the polar opposite of the vengeful, unjust, barbaric, and jealous God I read about in the Old Testament and in other books of the Bible. I will never again consider a god who deliberately causes disasters and calamities, kills with impunity, and willingly allows violence and human suffering in the world a god worthy of my worship, praise, and admiration. Lastly, I'll never again consider a god who turned a blind eye to the abuse I suffered as a child a god worthy of my worship, praise, and admiration. On the contrary, I consider such a god well deserving of being shunned and rejected.
Altfish
Veteran Member
I think the only god that I could admire is one who does not demand that I worship/praise her/him.
Admiration and praise? The same as for any other entity: doing good things, being helpful, caring for others, going over and above in some positive way.
Worship? I can't think of anything that would make something worthy of worship.
osgart
Nothing my eye, Something for sure
To demand worship and praise from me, I would expect that God to be my ultimate saviour with flawless character, compassion, and every fair quality one can think of.
Altfish
Veteran Member
I still would not worship or praise any god
osgart
Nothing my eye, Something for sure
How do you define worship and praise?
I certainly wouldn't do crazy rituals, nor would I do what a lot of people consider worship to be.
To me worship is about reverence, and reverence requires for me that a God would be ideal and far above me in every character way.
I don't believe any living entity is ideal in any way, nor is anyone that far above.
God qualities:
1. does anything He wants
2. doesn't care about you or other insignificant beings
3. set up the universe and life to have something to do (boring otherwise). Now watches like looking at fish in a bowl.
4. doesn't have to watch if doesn't want to
5. created you, can destroy you
6. threatens you with fiery torture for eternity if you don't do exactly as he says
7. fears nothing (but any confrontation might result in some pain or loss, so maybe allows evil to have its way)
What has God sacrificed? Allowed son Jesus to die? It seems that humans have lost more than God in that deal, since they don't have a kind demi-God among them.
Has God sacrificed his time? Does God listen to prayers without rendering aid?
It would matter to me that an all-powerful being might want me tortured in flames for all eternity. However, nothing that I could do could stop an all-powerful God.
But doesn't that also imply that we don't have to do anything for God, since God has the ability to do everything. So, if God told Abraham to kill his son, Isaac, why would Abraham have to do that (especially since God told us not to kill)? Couldn't God merely blink an eye or wave a hand, and kill Isaac for himself? Maybe it is about watching the drama unfold (like watching TV). Are we just tools of entertainment for an all-powerful God that already knows the future?
Are we one of the creatures that God sacrificed?
It is possible that a creature could have created everything, but why does that creature have to be good and self-sacrificing?
Fear can be demanded. Respect cannot.
But how would they know how to describe an all-powerful and all-knowing being? Can human words describe the divine?
God loves exalted chosen ones above all else. He could've kept them hidden and no need to come to this world, they would be beloved by him none the less. But he brought them out of his mercy, and they suffered greatly, not through physical pain though 7th Successor of Mohammad (s) was tortured in Jail for a great part of his life, and not through any pain we really understand, but rather, the love they had for humanity and watching them turn away from God while they did not force the issue on them. And they won't force the proofs, but just show enough miracles and spent their time trying to help humans only to watch them hate God and his light. They who are of immense power, watched by God, weren't told to use their powers and become immune to suffering, being killed, imprisoned, etc. They only die if they wish, and they were mostly all killed by enemies, so that we are willing to sacrifice our lives as well for love of God and his servants.
This favor of letting his exalted gems come down to this unworthy place beneath their dignity and guide us back to God while they suffer immensely witnessing our deeds outwardly and in the unseen being witnesses to the exact unseen state of our deeds, this is a great favor by God, and his beloved exalted chosen ones, if they asked God not to let them descend, he would approve, but they cared about us and they do as God wishes, and so came to this world and were brought out of the unseen realms of beauty and majesty with God, to this world where people turn away from God for petty desires and run away from God's judgment and light "as if fleeing from a lion" (quote from Quran).
Again, for me, I don't have to worry about any of that speculation. Unless and until there is an actual entity to talk about, I just need to keep on keep'n on, being the best person I can be.