War Against God?

[Acim]

Well of course society requires order. Who could argue otherwise?

An anarchist?

The concern should be that laws are fair and just.

Agreed. But how these are discerned upon, will make significant difference. Thank God, it is understood to be a work in progress. Haven't quite found the perfect society yet, but we ain't giving up trying.

 

[Father Heathen]

An anarchist?

Anarchy as a political movement assumes that people can still be civil without being governed. That's still a form of order.

 

[Scuba Pete]

I agree it is arguably superior. I'd love to have that argument. Either way, you seem to be agreeing that it is based on Reason, rather than some elusive concept such as 'nature.'

Au contraire, evolution and nature are synonymous to me. It's as fixed into our genes as is breathing. That we can over ride our nature in such a negative way is a function of our sentience or ability to reason. Theology often speaks to our fears, uncertainties and doubts. It's a tool that has been used to cloud and subject our morality since it's inception. How else could wars be started in the name of the God of love? Fear, uncertainty, doubt, deception and distortion are man made devices. You won't find them or ego in nature, but you will find them in religion and politics.

"I never saw a wild thing sorry for itself. A small bird will drop frozen dead from a bough without ever having felt sorry for itself." - D. H. Lawrence

 

[Acim]

Anarchy as a political movement assumes that people can still be civil without being governed. That's still a form of order.

As a political movement that is perhaps looking for supporters, I agree. But actual anarchy would be about disorder. The more, the merrier.

 

[Acim]

Au contraire, evolution and nature are synonymous to me. It's as fixed into our genes as is breathing. That we can over ride our nature in such a negative way is a function of our sentience or ability to reason.

What do you mean by overriding our nature? Does that equate to being immoral/amoral?

Theology often speaks to our fears, uncertainties and doubts. It's a tool that has been used to cloud and subject our morality since it's inception. How else could wars be started in the name of the God of love? Fear, uncertainty, doubt, deception and distortion are man made devices. You won't find them or ego in nature, but you will find them in religion and politics.

All these things you speak of, are found in nature. Bizarre to me that you think otherwise. Is science and math found in nature?

 

[Father Heathen]

But actual anarchy would be about disorder.

Which would be about undoing rather than preserving society.

 

[Acim]

Which would be about undoing rather than preserving society.

Agreed. Perhaps that is the moral thing to do. Since civilized people are very good at being immoral, then how could it be so bad to end civilization?

 

[Scuba Pete]

What do you mean by overriding our nature? Does that equate to being immoral/amoral?

It can. I override how I breathe every time I dive. If I override too much I get a headache or could even die. It's unnatural. Killing, except to eat or defend is abhorrent in nature. Very, very few creatures kill for amusement or out of anger. The more sentient the creature, the more this occurs.

All these things you speak of, are found in nature.

The more advanced the organism, the more sentient they are. The more sentient they are, the more they can choose to be immoral.

 

[Acim]

It can. I override how I breathe every time I dive. If I override too much I get a headache or could even die. It's unnatural.

Dying (a physical death) is unnatural in the physical world?

Killing, except to eat or defend is abhorrent in nature.

Then I observe nature can be very abhorrent. Or tornadoes, hurricanes and volcanic eruptions are all unnatural.

The more advanced the organism, the more sentient they are. The more sentient they are, the more they can choose to be immoral.

Nothing wrong with choosing to be immoral, right?

 

[Grumpuss]

Well it is pretty obvious that hordes of demons walk the Earth, and that the Antichrist is flooding the world with atheism and fomenting violence.

Religious violence and the march towards the End Times accelerate. The enemies of God embrace politics to champion an an ant-religious agenda where what was previously widely considered to be bizarre deviant behavior, is now protected under the guise of political correctness.

Now isn't the time to lose hope, however. There is still time to encourage sinners to repent and do good works.

 

[skl]

Well it is pretty obvious that hordes of demons walk the Earth, and that the Antichrist is flooding the world with atheism and fomenting violence.

Religious violence and the march towards the End Times accelerate. The enemies of God embrace politics to champion an an ant-religious agenda where what was previously widely considered to be bizarre deviant behavior, is now protected under the guise of political correctness.

Now isn't the time to lose hope, however. There is still time to encourage sinners to repent and do good works.

Hello again Grumpuss. You appear to be basically saying the end of the world is nigh, and it is coming because atheists are the antichrist, politicians are corrupt and we have the usual type of wars and terrorism from people we could literally call demons around the world.

What has changed? It is impossible for atheists to be the antichrist because they acknowledge no gods anywhere, anytime, anyplace, or their associated fables, so no god to be anti about because they do not and never have existed and of course we reject the existence of them when they are quoted. I find religions are more critical of each other’s idealistic gods and always claim they have the best one.

People such as yourself have tried to predict the end of the world hundreds if not thousands of times and not even come close. If you worry too much about this pending doom and gloom and increase the stress on yourself, it may actually cut your life short and you will not see if your prediction is accurate.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

No, that's not the way I see it. Man is between the animal and the divine. To become more advanced, humans which should cultivate their divine nature; one of love and oneness with others. I also believe that the one following his divine nature will be happier than the one following his animal nature.

But we are animals. In fact, some animals are way more loving than many humans are. Also, loving everyone and desiring "oneness" with everyone doesn't necessarily lead to happiness. There's people I've known that I certainly will never love and I certainly don't desire "oneness" with a psychopath.

 

[George-ananda]

But we are animals. .

Why be 'The Darkness in the Light.'? We are divine too! a much better place. But I sense you are not feeling it now.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Why be 'The Darkness in the Light.'? We are divine too! a much better place. But I sense you are not feeling it now.

Both Darkness and Light have their place. Define "divine". To me, that's just an abstraction.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Well it is pretty obvious that hordes of demons walk the Earth, and that the Antichrist is flooding the world with atheism and fomenting violence.

Religious violence and the march towards the End Times accelerate. The enemies of God embrace politics to champion an an ant-religious agenda where what was previously widely considered to be bizarre deviant behavior, is now protected under the guise of political correctness.

Now isn't the time to lose hope, however. There is still time to encourage sinners to repent and do good works.

Im being debative on purpose, but this stook out.

You do know that The Anti- Christ knows who Christ is and willingfully turns against him while an atheist knows nothing of Christ, knows nothing about him that would make him her enemy, and knows nothing of him, to make her ruler of man and demons, right?

You do know that Atheism isnt like the plague. Unless we were born with belief in god, the statement of the anti-christ flooding atheism doesnt make sense on a logical level.

Thats like the Spirits tell me "the Anti-Spirits have summed the flood of theism accross all believers and they have turned away from the Spirits to be among the demons on earth." You know how creepy that just sounded?

 

[Grumpuss]

Im being debative on purpose, but this stook out.

You do know that The Anti- Christ knows who Christ is and willingfully turns against him while an atheist knows nothing of Christ, knows nothing about him that would make him her enemy, and knows nothing of him, to make her ruler of man and demons, right?

Respectfully, I disagree. Scripture is pretty clear that malaise and apathy will be tools employed by The Beast, as he builds power in advance of his confrontation with Jesus. False religion and heretics aren't quite the same flavor of enemy to God (it is debatable if either is a true enemy, actually), but it is undeniable both are among the many tools the Antichrist employs.

You do know that Atheism isnt like the plague. Unless we were born with belief in god, the statement of the anti-christ flooding atheism doesnt make sense on a logical level.

Of course, you're right. I meant that in a figurative sense that the world's net increase in apathy and atheism can viewed as a passive plague that the Antichrist is now taking advantage. People are not born with belief and hope in God per se, but it is a beacon that is available from an early time in development that has been measurably been diminishing over the last 2-3 decades..

If, like me you believe that the Antichrist is today present in physical form on Earth, it makes more sense, in theological terms. The signs foretold in Revelation are quite evident to more than a few scholars who share this view. Like any truly dangerous enemy, the Antichrist does not announce his presence, intentions or location, and will seek to stay off the radar while he does discord and builds his forces.

Thats like the Spirits tell me "the Anti-Spirits have summed the flood of theism accross all believers and they have turned away from the Spirits to be among the demons on earth." You know how creepy that just sounded?

Good thing I didn't say anything like that then

 

[Grumpuss]

Hello again Grumpuss. You appear to be basically saying the end of the world is nigh, and it is coming because atheists are the antichrist, politicians are corrupt and we have the usual type of wars and terrorism from people we could literally call demons around the world.

What has changed? It is impossible for atheists to be the antichrist because they acknowledge no gods anywhere, anytime, anyplace, or their associated fables, so no god to be anti about because they do not and never have existed and of course we reject the existence of them when they are quoted. I find religions are more critical of each other’s idealistic gods and always claim they have the best one.

People such as yourself have tried to predict the end of the world hundreds if not thousands of times and not even come close. If you worry too much about this pending doom and gloom and increase the stress on yourself, it may actually cut your life short and you will not see if your prediction is accurate.

Thank you, brother. I appreciate your concern.

Don't worry for my well-being. You are right: I do believe we are in the End Times. But I do not obsess about how exactly it will play out. At worst, I am a lowly foot soldier who will get the opportunity to fight in Christ's army of One-worlders, sodomites, demons and other associated horrors the Antichrist chooses to lead for the downfall of man. At best, my life will end and I will join God in Heaven for blissful eternity. Either way, the decision and mechanics of judgment are far-removed from my own responsibility. Instead, I seek to live a good and virtuous life, loving family and friends and hoping others to see the light.

If you're interested, I would be glad to share God's message with you.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

. False religion and heretics aren't quite the same flavor of enemy to God (it is debatable if either is a true enemy, actually), but it is undeniable both are among the many tools the Antichrist employs.

This is actually my point. I can see if scripture said "If you did not know of me, you are from satan" but he was very blunt when he said (paraphrasing, its 4am) "You already knew me and you turn from me." The former says you were ignorant (but what god would punished the ignorant?). The latter says you knew (in your heart--anti-christ doesnt know god like that) who I am and you chose to walk away... and for some odd reason in scripture punishes individuals for what their heart tells them. I mean, I disagree with scripture but what you said is debatable because "even though they arent the true enemy" they are still givin the kick regardless.

Good thing I didn't say anything like that then

Kehehe. Yeah. You understand my point, right?

If I said that, and my faith was dominate and very influencial in your town and country, to where your laws where govern by the spirits and ancestors and the god of abraham was pushed aside as a pagan god, wouldnt you feel kind of insulted if I told you that the Spirits have said there is an anti-spirit among you believers....and, consequently....to whomever follows against the spirits will, I dont know, drown in rich dark chocolate?

Isnt that kinda odd to place you in my belief when you have no clue what I mean by spirits, nor believe in the spirits I believe in...so basically, youre an apolytheist (if thats the correct word).

Why would the Spirits punish you for something you dont know?

I always scatch my head over that mainstream christian belief.

But you do get my point with that example, right?

(I know what you are saying is the christian teaching. That, I cant debate. Its the logic behind what you are saying that just sounds off. Not right or wrong, but logically doesnt make sense.)

 

[skl]

Thank you, brother. I appreciate your concern.

Don't worry for my well-being. You are right: I do believe we are in the End Times. But I do not obsess about how exactly it will play out. At worst, I am a lowly foot soldier who will get the opportunity to fight in Christ's army of One-worlders, sodomites, demons and other associated horrors the Antichrist chooses to lead for the downfall of man. At best, my life will end and I will join God in Heaven for blissful eternity. Either way, the decision and mechanics of judgment are far-removed from my own responsibility. Instead, I seek to live a good and virtuous life, loving family and friends and hoping others to see the light.

If you're interested, I would be glad to share God's message with you.

Thank you for your offer, I have heard the message and it so full of holes it reinforces my atheist world view. For example:

The antichrist is just a word for a concept that is designed to shock people. It is another clever part of the almighty God deception and a superstitious tool to intimidate ancient people into not opposing but accepting a religious ideology.

If God exists as this powerful creator, why do the so called antichrist events and the demonic people exist in such strong numbers? Surely an omnipotent all-knowing God could just wipe them off his shoe, so to speak.

Nothing adds up, anything or anyone that opposes this God is condemned as the work of the devil or Lucifer and classed as Satanic or the antichrist. Can you not see how the dice is loaded?

As they did in many of the world’s religions an angel existed called Lucifer fell from the grace of God and was condemned to earth, but get this, God allowed him to keep all of his powers. Why after his Eden capers as a talking conniving snake did God put him amongst the humans on earth to cause all this antichrist behaviour?

These stories are clearly defective but spectacular without any logical reasoning or evidence highlighting how manipulation of the primitive masses were instigated and maintained by the influential writers and the politics of the day. Unfortunately, people today like yourself are still susceptible to swallow these myths hook, line and sinker.

 

[Scuba Pete]

Dying (a physical death) is unnatural in the physical world?

Suicide is unusual and so can be said to be unnatural. In fact there's a Suicide Hotline to help prevent this from happening.

Then I observe nature can be very abhorrent. Or tornadoes, hurricanes and volcanic eruptions are all unnatural.

People love the mountains, but they resent the process that creates them. Our world is a violent beauty. You call it abhorrent, I call it amazing.

Nothing wrong with choosing to be immoral, right?

There is for me. I choose love.