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Featured Time: Does the Bible say what Time is?

Discussion in 'Science and Religion' started by SA Huguenot, Oct 14, 2019.

  1. Subduction Zone

    Subduction Zone Veteran Member

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    I think that you dropped a '2' off the start of the speed of light in air. Last I checked liquid sodium was opaque.
     
  2. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
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    My bad, i missed the word "slower", i have edited the post, thanks


    Physicists Slow Speed of Light
     
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  3. dybmh

    dybmh Terminal Optimist
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    Calling time and movement illusions is a little over-simplified, isn't it? Even if Time and Movement do not describe the metaphysical reality; Time and Movement exist, right? Advaita Hinduism would describe them as "Vyāvahārika"?

    "Vyāvahārika (vyavahara), or samvriti-saya, consisting of the empirical or pragmatical reality. It is ever changing over time, thus empirically true at a given time and context but not metaphysically true. It is "our world of experience, the phenomenal world that we handle every day when we are awake". It is the level in which both jiva (living creatures or individual souls) and Iswara are true; here, the material world is also true but this is incomplete reality"

    hyperlink >>> wikipedia.org - Advaita Vedanta

    Edit: Did you notice that Time is necessary for Vyāvahārika to be defined at all. Time is so deeply linked to reality, it is assumed to exist even in non-Dualism???

    I wonder how many other core arguments supporting Advaita Hinduism require a concept of Time?

    Example: Moksha? Freedom from the influence of Maya? Without the concept of Time and progress, no one would advance in their knowledge and understanding of Atman/Brahman. Without Time, there is no progress, there is no advancement, and the entire Advaita belief system becomes irrelevant, because, there is no progress or advancement to achieve.

    What am I missing?
     
    #103 dybmh, Oct 15, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2019
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  4. dybmh

    dybmh Terminal Optimist
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    @Aupmanyav : FWIW, I agree with virtually everything you have said about non-duality :) I just think that Time is an outlier. Time *and* Energy exist? Everything else is an illusion?
     
  5. Aupmanyav

    Aupmanyav Be your own guru

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    You sure did your home work. :D
    I do not believe in Ishwara, because that becomes another, hurts non-duality. Vyavaharika is a reality but not of the level of Paramarthika. However, Vyavaharika too cannot be ignored. I was talking about Paramarthika.
    Yes, the process of getting rid of the influence of 'maya' may take time, because it is something that happens at the Vyavaharika level. With some people it could be years, with others it could be minutes. The study and understanding took time with me but the final realization was in minutes. Now I am at peace because I have found answers to my questions - the answers are amazingly simple - IMV, that is 'Moksha' or deliverance, enlightenment or jnana - nirvana, to be in a place where there are no forests of doubts (that is the literal meaning of nirvana).
     
    #105 Aupmanyav, Oct 15, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2019
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  6. Aupmanyav

    Aupmanyav Be your own guru

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    Time is a factor of Vyavaharika. Parmarthika is free of this bondage. Action takes place in Paramarthika instantly even at a distance (Quantum entanglement - Wikipedia). Energy exists. We call it Brahman. As for your question, 'Is everything an illusion?', I will reserve my comment. Presently we/science do not know that. It is possible that existence and non-existence are just two phases of energy. Virtual particles arise from and dissipate into nothingness at will (Virtual particle - Wikipedia). 3,000 years ago, a line in RigVeda talked about that. It will be decades or centuries before we understand this, most probably not in my time. If we want instant answers, we may land up with fallacies. I leave this question to our future generations.

    sato bandhumasati niravindan hridi pratīshyākavayo manīshā ll
    Sages who searched with their heart's thought discovered the existent's kinship in the non-existent.
    Rig Veda: Rig-Veda, Book 10: HYMN CXXIX. Creation.
     
    #106 Aupmanyav, Oct 15, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2019
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  7. shmogie

    shmogie Well-Known Member

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    I wouldn´t know. The Judeo Christian God, the only God, is way, way above a method He created for humans to multiply on the earth.
     
  8. shmogie

    shmogie Well-Known Member

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    We were created as sexual beings because God created that method to populate the earth.

    Correct, no man has seen God clearly, and directly, I a not sure we ever will. When He shows up in the OT, he is light and energy, as in the burning bush Moses saw.

    We were made in Gods image because we can have compassion, emotion, make choices, erc., etc. We reflect God in our personalities and mind, not in the mortal corrupt container for these things.

    Christ was resurrected in a body, no doubt, but different from that he had before the resurrection. He arose in a glorified body, and what that means is open to debate, I don´t clearly understand it. Nevertheless, it is good, and the saved will also have glorified bodies. Does that mean that they will still have sexual organs, I don´t know.

    Nevertheless, the question is about God, since God cannot reproduce by sexual means ( unlike many of the mythical Gods), and God existed alone before the creation of all the beings in the universe, and no where is it stated that God needed sex to create these beings, He essentially spoke to create what He chose, why would He exist with an organ designed for humans to procreate ?

    Is God subject to the rules and laws of biology ? Did He have sex with Mary to create the human body of the incarnation ?

    I think the entire idea is weird. Since God could not defile himself with any being He created, and there is only one God, He having a sexual organ for procreation is bizarre.
     
  9. We Never Know

    We Never Know Well-Known Member

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    You're comparing a trained routine with knowing time.
    It's easy to test. Change everything to happen an hour earlier. Tell your cat. If it shows up an hour earlier, then it knows the concept of time, if it shows up at the regular old time, it's trained routine. However after a while it would change its trained routine to match the new time.
     
  10. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
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    Changing the time is CHANGING the time.

    Do you change your watch because you want lunch early?

    And of course all the human concept of time is learned,
     
  11. We Never Know

    We Never Know Well-Known Member

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    Lol. You wouldn't show up an hour late because you know the concept of time, your cat doesn't.
     
  12. We Never Know

    We Never Know Well-Known Member

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    On Oct 27th roll your clock back an hour. Everything(including lunch) will be an hour later compared to/since March. Your cat will have to get a new routine for the new times.
     
  13. Aupmanyav

    Aupmanyav Be your own guru

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    Just one God. That is no fun at all. Our Gods have created the universe 51 times since the last 'Great Dissolution' (Pralaya).
    Why? What is the problem? I thought Gods could do anything they wanted.
    Since we are made in his image and we have sex organs, what does your God have in that region?
    That is one of the problems with your religion. 'Sex is defiling'. In Hinduism, sex is one of the four things that are a must do for a man - Earning, Sex, Fulfilling one's duties and engaging in righteous action, and striving for understanding the nature of life (Artha, Kama, Dharma, Moksha).
     
    #113 Aupmanyav, Oct 15, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2019
  14. We Never Know

    We Never Know Well-Known Member

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    But he wants humans to multiply his way or he looks down upon their sin. IOW do it my way or it's wrong.
     
  15. Skwim

    Skwim Veteran Member

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    So what happens when something whirrs? I assume you mean it goes around. And when something goes around it moves. And when it moves it changes position.


    .

    .
     
  16. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
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    Why would a cat want to be late for dinner?
     
  17. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
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    Thats intervention in pseudo time. The earth doesn't stop for an hour because "some" countries CHANGE the time
     
  18. dybmh

    dybmh Terminal Optimist
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    How would you describe something that is consistently changing? Is it actually changing?
     
  19. Skwim

    Skwim Veteran Member

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    Yes. Change denotes becoming different, be it a different color, shape, tone, size, speed, height, weight, position, or whatever. That this "becoming different" is on-going doesn't mean there's no longer any changing. If an object only keeps going between point A and point B for a thousand years its position is still a matter of continually becoming different: changing.

    ,
     
  20. shmogie

    shmogie Well-Known Member

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    Yes, because He obviously created males and females for that exact purpose, all the parts fit and the mechanism works as intended.

    He created us, and determines what is acceptable based upon his creative purpose, and what is not.

    Whether you like it or not is irrelevant.

    You have total free will to do whatever you choose, yet we all must deal with the consequences of poor choices.

    You are free to ignore God, and do whatever you choose.
     
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