There is no free will in Islam

[FearGod]

What does my belief have to do with this thread?

It has to do, but first answer my question,
do you believe that God exists?

 

[Milton Platt]

Excuse me as I've been away for quite some time off this forum so let me say in advance, that I apologize if this subject as been discussed ad nauseum. Before I present my argument I wanted to discuss basic concepts for others when discussing the concept of free will. To have free will is to be an agent with the ability to choose the course of his or her action. Will, and subsequent courses of action depends on a rational faculty which related to a persons cognition, and as such the intellect presents various things to the will as "good" under some unique description. For example, Aaliyah thinks of walking her dog, and her intellect thinks about walking the dog as good for the health and welfare of the dog. However, when considering this we must also consider the paradigmatic of free action, such as whether to choose or not choose to do a certain action such as looking at weather etc (ex "it's raining so it may not be good to walk my dog").

Understanding this, I reflect David Hume in his book "An Enquiry Concerning Human Understanding," believes that liberty, is simply the “power of acting or of not acting, according to the determination of the will: that is, if we choose to remain at rest, we may; if we choose to move, we also may.…" We either choose to act or not act, and an agent is free so long as no external event prevents action. So in the case of Aaliyah, she may not be able to take her dog walking if its a severe rain storm outside despite her desire to take her dog for a walk. Now I do not want to get into a lengthy discussion on the hierarchal foundations of will and such but just to start at a foundation of the basic understanding of freewill and some philosophical ideas of free will.

According to Islam there is divine ordination, or pre-destination where all things are written down on a preserved tablet called "Al-Lauḥ al-Maḥfūẓ" (All that happens will happen). To be clear this is not to say that action are determined by what is written on this preserved tablet, but all actions that happen are "written on the tablet" due to God's foreknowledge of all things. But what becomes problematic for me is looking at the four stages of Taqdeer (fate). Apparently after Adam, God took two covenants, one, which all souls testify that God is their Lord and two, covenant is taken from the children of Adam through the Prophets that they will believe in Divine Oneness and follow his revelation.

Now going by the first covenant, God has already decreed from a spiritual view, which souls will go to paradise and hell. Since good action along with going by the second covenant are contingencies, how does one have absolute agency in relation to these covenants? I must concede that although I am freely typing in this thread, God knew my action and knew when I'm done, I'll close my laptop and go about my business. But what I find problematic is that from a spiritual/metaphysical point of view whatever actions I commit in this life, were already done outside time/space (I saw outside time and space based on the foreknowledge of God knowing all actions and sequences outside our time and space).

I understand the Islamic view of decree in the sense of human capability, however the problem lies in the spiritual view that all actions were already determined and that God knows the eventual destination of all humans prior to them experiencing their reward and punishment. In God's mind, I have already performed my actions, and so as I exist, I'm merely playing out those actions, so again, how do I have free will knowing this?

Many people feel that determinism is correct. This has nothing to do with a god or gods, however. It has to do with the fact that every decision we make is influenced by things such as genetics, our childhood, adolescent and adult experiences, current situation, etc. In other words, if one could go back to a point in time when a decision was being made, and every experience, every molecule, every atom in your body was in the exact same state, then you would make the exact same decision. Of course, this is not testable or falsifiable, but it is a valid consideration.

 

[Epic Beard Man]

It has to do, but first answer my question,
do you believe that God exists?

Define "God"

 

[Epic Beard Man]

Many people feel that determinism is correct. This has nothing to do with a god or gods, however. It has to do with the fact that every decision we make is influenced by things such as genetics, our childhood, adolescent and adult experiences, current situation, etc. In other words, if one could go back to a point in time when a decision was being made, and every experience, every molecule, every atom in your body was in the exact same state, then you would make the exact same decision. Of course, this is not testable or falsifiable, but it is a valid consideration.

I don't want to be rude but if you noticed I was challenging the notion of determinism in accordance to Islam and highlighted specifically some Islamic articles of faith. In Islam, God's will determines the order iof things, and if such is true, my actions are the result of a maker who has willed the order of things. Therefore, by that principles I'm not absolutely free.

 

[FearGod]

Define "God"

I asked you a question, Do you believe that God exists?
Yes or No

 

[Epic Beard Man]

I asked you a question, Do you believe that God exists?
Yes or No

I'm not trying to be difficult but often times "God" has a concrete meaning (e.g The Abrahamic God ) but do I believe there to be a single entity that is existent and necessary, that is the "Lord of the universe" yes I do,

 

[Britedream]

There is a free will in Islam:
Quran 18:29 "and say this is the truth from your lord, you have the will to believe and you have the will to disbelieve, ...."

But as with all human attributes it has a limit; sometimes we do things that we have the will not to let anyone knows about it, but sometimes people know about.

 

[Notanumber]

There is a free will in Islam:
Quran 18:29 "and say this is the truth from your lord, you have the will to believe and you have the will to disbelieve, ...."

Not really!


29. And say: "The truth is from your Lord." Then whosoever wills, let him believe, and whosoever wills, let him disbelieve. Verily, We have prepared for the Zalimun (polytheists and wrong-doers, etc.), a Fire whose walls will be surrounding them (disbelievers in the Oneness of Allah). And if they ask for help (relief, water, etc.) they will be granted water like boiling oil, that will scald their faces. Terrible the drink, and an evil Murtafaqa (dwelling, resting place, etc.)!

Noble Quran - Translation of Sura Al-Kahf

 

[Britedream]

Not really!


29. And say: "The truth is from your Lord." Then whosoever wills, let him believe, and whosoever wills, let him disbelieve. Verily, We have prepared for the Zalimun (polytheists and wrong-doers, etc.), a Fire whose walls will be surrounding them (disbelievers in the Oneness of Allah). And if they ask for help (relief, water, etc.) they will be granted water like boiling oil, that will scald their faces. Terrible the drink, and an evil Murtafaqa (dwelling, resting place, etc.)!

Noble Quran - Translation of Sura Al-Kahf

Obviously, you don't know arabic, You can't will if you don't have a will, I don't see your point of objection.
من شاء in Arabic means the one who has the will; exactly as I translated to you, the same word in the Quran.

 

[Notanumber]

Obviously, you don't know arabic, You can't will if you don't have a will, I don't see your point of objection.
من شاء in Arabic means the one who has the will; exactly as I translated to you, the same word in the Quran.

Fight the disbelievers untill there is no more Fitna and Islam established as only religion. But if the disbelievers cease fighting, let there be no hostility towards them, except against the Zalimun.

What does Zalimun mean? Zalimun is plural. Single is Zalim. Who are the zalimun or who is a Zalim?

1. Every idolater is a Zalim (2:92, 7:148, 10:106)
2. Every disbeliever is a Zalim (2:254)
3. Whoever calls himself a god is a Zalim (21:29)
4. Whoever denies any of the verses of Quran is a Zalim (29:49)
5. Whoever invents a lie against allah is a Zalim (3:94, 6:21)
6. Whoever makes false claims is a Zalim (11:31)
7. Is your friend hostile to islam? Then you are also a Zalim (9:23, 60:9)
8. Whoever follows desires rather than Quran and Sunnah is also a Zalim (2:145)
9. Whoever punishes an innocent is a Zalim (12:79)
10. Whoever violates the laws of allah is a Zalim (2:229)
11. And lastly, whoever does not judge by the Quran and sunnah is a Zalim (5:45)

So the last part of the verse: no hostility except against the Zalimun means, except against them who are idol worshippers, pagans, atheists, non-muslims. I mean everyone other than muslims can be a Zalim. Even some muslims can be Zalimun according to Quran.

Interesting to see that in this verse, today's muslims translate Fitna as persecution and Zalimina as oppressors. In this way they make it look like muslims are the victims. But there attempt shows intellectual dishonesty. To know the accurate meaning we must follow what the early scholars honestly said about these verses.

An explanation of Chapter 2 verse 193 in Quran ~ The Skeptic Mind

 

[Britedream]

Fight the disbelievers untill there is no more Fitna and Islam established as only religion. But if the disbelievers cease fighting, let there be no hostility towards them, except against the Zalimun.

What does Zalimun mean? Zalimun is plural. Single is Zalim. Who are the zalimun or who is a Zalim?

1. Every idolater is a Zalim (2:92, 7:148, 10:106)
2. Every disbeliever is a Zalim (2:254)
3. Whoever calls himself a god is a Zalim (21:29)
4. Whoever denies any of the verses of Quran is a Zalim (29:49)
5. Whoever invents a lie against allah is a Zalim (3:94, 6:21)
6. Whoever makes false claims is a Zalim (11:31)
7. Is your friend hostile to islam? Then you are also a Zalim (9:23, 60:9)
8. Whoever follows desires rather than Quran and Sunnah is also a Zalim (2:145)
9. Whoever punishes an innocent is a Zalim (12:79)
10. Whoever violates the laws of allah is a Zalim (2:229)
11. And lastly, whoever does not judge by the Quran and sunnah is a Zalim (5:45)

So the last part of the verse: no hostility except against the Zalimun means, except against them who are idol worshippers, pagans, atheists, non-muslims. I mean everyone other than muslims can be a Zalim. Even some muslims can be Zalimun according to Quran.

Interesting to see that in this verse, today's muslims translate Fitna as persecution and Zalimina as oppressors. In this way they make it look like muslims are the victims. But there attempt shows intellectual dishonesty. To know the accurate meaning we must follow what the early scholars honestly said about these verses.

An explanation of Chapter 2 verse 193 in Quran ~ The Skeptic Mind

First of all this is off topic, but I will respond to you in brief, and I apologize to OP., if you want to chat just open your thread, and we will talk.
Now for "dhulm" in your case "zulm", from which the word " zalimun" is derived which is you wrongly pronounced, as original meaning, it means to decrease as in the following Ayeh "verse" :
Quran 18:33 "Each garden yielded ˹all˺ its produce, never falling short. And We caused a river to flow between them."
So the word "dhulm" for disbelieving in God means decreasing the right that God has.
For relating to oneself, you are decreasing the right of your self that God demanded you to have. Other meaning you can depict according to the context.