The term 'Anti-Semite'...

[Daniyal]

I honestly do think that there is a problem using the word 'semite' only to refer to Jewish people. I think that both Muslims and Christians deserve the same title as 'semite' too.

I personally know someone who actually uses the term "anti-semite" for things Anti-Islamic and I think it is a good thing, since using the term semite could actually do alot to bring the three Abrahamic faiths together.


Your thoughts?

 

[Mike182]

I honestly do think that there is a problem using the word 'semite' only to refer to Jewish people. I think that both Muslims and Christians deserve the same title as 'semite' too.

I personally know someone who actually uses the term "anti-semite" for things Anti-Islamic and I think it is a good thing, since using the term semite could actually do alot to bring the three Abrahamic faiths together.


Your thoughts?

words and definitions evolve and change, that's only natural. the purpose of words is to convey a message, so words are naturally bent and sculpted into meaning things they weren't necessarily meant to mean when they first originated..... in other words, i see no problem in the word "semite" being used to encumpas all abrahamic faiths, however you would have to show the advantages of doing that before it becomes widely accepted - working on the basis that the most widely held definition of a word at any time is the most correct one, because of the shared understanding of said word.

i can see confusion as a disadvantage of changing the definition of the word "semite", ie, "anti-semite" is a term being used in the middle east at the moment, to change the meaning of the word semite at the moment would cause confusion in the middle of an intense diplomatic situation... for me to accept the word "semite" as refering to all abrahamic faiths, you would need to show how the benefits outweigh the consequences, consequences like my example above, though i think others will hav ether objections.

did my rambling make any sense? :areyoucra

 

[michel]

words and definitions evolve and change, that's only natural. the purpose of words is to convey a message, so words are naturally bent and sculpted into meaning things they weren't necessarily meant to mean when they first originated..... in other words, i see no problem in the word "semite" being used to encumpas all abrahamic faiths, however you would have to show the advantages of doing that before it becomes widely accepted - working on the basis that the most widely held definition of a word at any time is the most correct one, because of the shared understanding of said word.

i can see confusion as a disadvantage of changing the definition of the word "semite", ie, "anti-semite" is a term being used in the middle east at the moment, to change the meaning of the word semite at the moment would cause confusion in the middle of an intense diplomatic situation... for me to accept the word "semite" as refering to all abrahamic faiths, you would need to show how the benefits outweigh the consequences, consequences like my example above, though i think others will hav ether objections.

did my rambling make any sense? :areyoucra

Yes! I learn something new every day: From the etymology dictionary:-
Semite 1847, "Jew, Arab, Assyrian, Aramæan," from Mod.L. Semita, from L.L. Sem "Shem," one of the three sons of Noah (Gen. x:21-30), regarded as the ancestor of the Semites (in the days when anthropology was still bound by the Bible), from Heb. Shem. Semitic (1813 of languages, 1826 of persons) is probably from Ger. semitisch (first used by Ger. historian August Schlözer, 1781), denoting the language group that includes Hebrew, Arabic, Aramaic, Assyrian, etc. In recent use often with the specific sense "Jewish," but not historically so limited. anti-Semitism 1881, from Ger. Antisemitismus, first used by Wilhelm Marr in 1880, from anti- + Semite (q.v.). Not etymologically restricted to anti-Jewish theories, actions or policies, but almost always used in this sense. Those who object to the inaccuracy of the term might try H. Adler's Judaeophobia (1882). I never realised the word was so emcompassing; like I said, I guess I learn something new every day.

 

[Mike182]

Yes! I learn something new every day: From the etymology dictionary:-
Semite 1847, "Jew, Arab, Assyrian, Aramæan," from Mod.L. Semita, from L.L. Sem "Shem," one of the three sons of Noah (Gen. x:21-30), regarded as the ancestor of the Semites (in the days when anthropology was still bound by the Bible), from Heb. Shem. Semitic (1813 of languages, 1826 of persons) is probably from Ger. semitisch (first used by Ger. historian August Schlözer, 1781), denoting the language group that includes Hebrew, Arabic, Aramaic, Assyrian, etc. In recent use often with the specific sense "Jewish," but not historically so limited. anti-Semitism 1881, from Ger. Antisemitismus, first used by Wilhelm Marr in 1880, from anti- + Semite (q.v.). Not etymologically restricted to anti-Jewish theories, actions or policies, but almost always used in this sense. Those who object to the inaccuracy of the term might try H. Adler's Judaeophobia (1882). I never realised the word was so emcompassing; like I said, I guess I learn something new every day.

i guess the meaning of the word is subject to its context

 

[jewscout]

I honestly do think that there is a problem using the word 'semite' only to refer to Jewish people. I think that both Muslims and Christians deserve the same title as 'semite' too.

I personally know someone who actually uses the term "anti-semite" for things Anti-Islamic and I think it is a good thing, since using the term semite could actually do alot to bring the three Abrahamic faiths together.


Your thoughts?

i think there is a problem when people try to confuse a term for the purposes of semantics in order that they can get away with saying things which are purposely aimed at defacing, dehumanizing, and reinforcing anti-jewish stereotypes.

antisemitism by definition has always meant hating jews...only recently has a self-serving fabrication that it means anything other than that emerged in the arab-muslim community.

and how universalizing, in someway, the term "antisemitism" is going to help the 3 abrahamic faiths makes no sense as there is a large segment of the Muslim, Jewish, and Christian populations which are, in fact, not of semitic ethnic orgins...
Take Sub-saharan black muslims, for example. Are they of the same ethnic origin as a muslim from turkey or saudi arabia or pakistan?

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Some Arabs who wish to destroy Israel have pointed out that they too are Semetic and therefore they are not anti-Semetic in their persistent hatred of the Jewish people and the Jewish state. For this reason, I often clarify exactly what I mean by anti-Semetism, even though its usage in English has a long tradition of more specifically meaning anti-Jewish.

From the mighty wiki, may it stand forever:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arabs_and_anti-Semitism
"Some argue that Arabs cannot be anti-Semitic because, they, themselves are Semites. However, Arab discrimination and hostility towards Jews is common regardless of the semantics, thus a better term for this would be "misojudaism" or Judenhass, hatred of Jews. The term "anti-Semite" was coined in Germany in 1879 by Wilhelm Marrih to refer to the anti-Jewish manifestations of the period and to give Jew-hatred a more scientific sounding name."

 

[Daniyal]

i think there is a problem when people try to confuse a term for the purposes of semantics in order that they can get away with saying things which are purposely aimed at defacing, dehumanizing, and reinforcing anti-jewish stereotypes.

antisemitism by definition has always meant hating jews...only recently has a self-serving fabrication that it means anything other than that emerged in the arab-muslim community.

and how universalizing, in someway, the term "antisemitism" is going to help the 3 abrahamic faiths makes no sense as there is a large segment of the Muslim, Jewish, and Christian populations which are, in fact, not of semitic ethnic orgins...
Take Sub-saharan black muslims, for example. Are they of the same ethnic origin as a muslim from turkey or saudi arabia or pakistan?

What about a Russian Jews and a Spanish Jews? Are they still classified as 'semite' even though they themselves don't have semitic ethnic origins?

With respect.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I honestly do think that there is a problem using the word 'semite' only to refer to Jewish people.

Of course you do ...

 

[jewscout]

What about a Russian Jews and a Spanish Jews? Are they still classified as 'semite' even though they themselves don't have semitic ethnic origins?

With respect.

ummmm that's my point...

and how universalizing, in someway, the term "antisemitism" is going to help the 3 abrahamic faiths makes no sense as there is a large segment of the Muslim, Jewish, and Christian populations which are, in fact, not of semitic ethnic orgins...

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Parse it, dilute it, distort it, redefine it, whine about it's use - anything to obscure the fact of antisemitism and take the struggle against antisemitism off the agenda: it's dishonest and repugnant.

 

[GloriaPatri]

What about a Russian Jews and a Spanish Jews? Are they still classified as 'semite' even though they themselves don't have semitic ethnic origins?

With respect.

Actually, they found that Russian Jews (actually, Ashenkazi Jews in general) have atleast one male ancestor who is of Middle Eastern descent, which would make them semitic. Also, it is generally believed that Jews emigrated to Spain during Roman times making Spanish (Sephardic) Jews semitic, also.

 

[Booko]

I honestly do think that there is a problem using the word 'semite' only to refer to Jewish people. I think that both Muslims and Christians deserve the same title as 'semite' too.

I'd be really confused if "semitic" started to be used in reference to Christians, considering the vast majority of them are not Semitic peoples. This is especially so when it comes to the term "anti-Semitic."

 

[Ody]

What about a Russian Jews and a Spanish Jews? Are they still classified as 'semite' even though they themselves don't have semitic ethnic origins?

With respect.

Thanks for the daily dose of historical 'revisionism'.

 

[GloriaPatri]

Thanks for the daily dose of historical 'revisionism'.

It has been proven by genetics. You can't refute facts.

 

[Smoke]

I know that a lot of Arab Christians and Muslims are offended by the use of the term anti-Semite to refer to bigotry against the Jews specifically.

I don't see any need to offend people needlessly, and if it would really make people happier, I'd be happy to call it "Hatred of Jews" or something along those lines, instead. I don't care about the terminology, as long as nobody tries to pretend the problem doesn't exist.

 

[jewscout]

I know that a lot of Arab Christians and Muslims are offended by the use of the term anti-Semite to refer to bigotry against the Jews specifically.

I don't see any need to offend people needlessly, and if it would really make people happier, I'd be happy to call it "Hatred of Jews" or something along those lines, instead. I don't care about the terminology, as long as nobody tries to pretend the problem doesn't exist.

however by trying to redefine the term simply to keep people from "being offended" it is handing over another tool for those who use such misdirection to continue anti-jewish hatred.

 

[Scuba Pete]

Anti-Black, anti-semetic, anti-(insertyourhatredofchoicehere): it's all bigotry. Don't let bigots redefine themselves in order to make their bigotry more palatable. OPPOSE THEM to their face, even if it gets uncomfortable. Don't stop pointing them out, even if they threaten to kick you out of their mosques, synagogues, churches or even forums. Expose the cockroaches with the light that ALL people are created equal and that no race/creed/nationality/gender/sexual orientation is better than the others.

However, be sure to never try to fight bigotry with more bigotry. That only keeps the cycle of hate and distrust alive and growing. Be prepared for people to change. Than can and will, but only if you keep their feet to the fire.

 

[TashaN]

Why the fuss?

Does it matter whether it's anti-semitic or anti-jewish?

I have no idea how the anti-semitic term would help it?

Ummm ...

I'm thinking that as alot of people hate to be called anti-semtic so the jews might be scared that the muslims would be included and by default people won't like to be called anti-semitic when they hate Muslims or Islam

 

[Ody]

It has been proven by genetics. You can't refute facts.

Historical Revisionism has become a nice way to put denying historical facts, those who deny the Holocaust tend to use the term 'Revisionism'.

 

[jewscout]

Why the fuss?

Does it matter whether it's anti-semitic or anti-jewish?

I have no idea how the anti-semitic term would help it?

because that has been the definition of the term since it was first used.

I'm thinking that as alot of people hate to be called anti-semtic so the jews might be scared that the muslims would be included and by default people won't like to be called anti-semitic when they hate Muslims or Islam

or that muslims who do hate jews like to cloud the issue w/ semantics, diverting attention to the fact that their evidence comes from classic anti-jewish propaganda lies.