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The Great Lie.

an anarchist

Your local anarchist.
I was gonna think and elaborate but I accidentally clicked post thread lol. Guess I'll leave it at that for now.
 

Quintessence

Consults with Trees
Staff member
Premium Member
So which are you wanting to leave behind?

The idea that suffering is inevitable and unavoidable?

Or the belief that suffering isn't inevitable and unavoidable?

It's a bit unclear to me.
 

an anarchist

Your local anarchist.
So which are you wanting to leave behind?

The idea that suffering is inevitable and unavoidable?

Or the belief that suffering isn't inevitable and unavoidable?

It's a bit unclear to me.
I want to leave behind the idea that suffering is inevitable and unavoidable.

Granted, this idea is not wholly unique. Christian eschatology says that eventually suffering will be a thing of the past after the events of the Book of Revelation. But I disagree with Christianity, I don't think it's factual as a whole. Yet I still believe in a possible conclusion for the universe in which suffering is a thing no more. I am left to draw my own hypothesis and conclusions on how this can be achieved. A first step is creating a philosophy which supports the idea that suffering can be eliminated. At least I think.
 

Nakosis

Non-Binary Physicalist
Premium Member
Suffering is inevitable

Above is The Great Lie.

At its core, my mission in life is to leave behind a philosophy that argues against this mindset.

Suffering I see as being somewhere you don't want to be experiencing something you don't want to experience.

I just accept life as it is and let go of wanting to be in a different place, experiencing something else.
 

an anarchist

Your local anarchist.
Why is it a lie?

Suffering is a fact that is not inevitable as its already here since day one of humanity.
Things can change. I don't know about the origins of man or the universe really, but yes, it seems suffering has always been as long as there has been life to experience it. But things are always on a constant state of flux.

just because we suffer now does not mean we have to perpetually suffer.
 

an anarchist

Your local anarchist.
:emojconfused: A “philosophy” not put to its test yet then, the one your mission it is to “leave behind”?
Oh I have years of studying I have to do before I can develop a cohesive philosophy advocating for the elimination of suffering which can hold up to scrutiny. But fret not, I am young and determined, and have dozens of religious and philosophical texts, a personal library really. So I will get to the bottom of the issue :)
And it will obviously take more than me and my generation to eliminate suffering. It has to be a multigenerational effort. I'll never claim that I alone can eliminate suffering.
 

bobhikes

Nondetermined
Premium Member
Suffering is inevitable

Above is The Great Lie.

At its core, my mission in life is to leave behind a philosophy that argues against this mindset.
After reading through I am not sure what you define as suffering. At its basic it is pain that we must endure and that will always be an eventuality unless you live in a bubble and enjoy your alone time. As long as you interact with another life form you will endure suffering. Life forms on earth at least, all have self-survival as the first priority. This instinct will eventually cause suffering for other life forms. Bacteria invade the body to survive and reproduce causing us to get sick, most people would consider that suffering.
 

an anarchist

Your local anarchist.
After reading through I am not sure what you define as suffering. At its basic it is pain that we must endure and that will always be an eventuality unless you live in a bubble and enjoy your alone time. As long as you interact with another life form you will endure suffering. Life forms on earth at least, all have self-survival as the first priority. This instinct will eventually cause suffering for other life forms. Bacteria invade the body to survive and reproduce causing us to get sick, most people would consider that suffering.
Indeed, even a vegan causes plants to suffer. But yet I posit the goal as "the elimination of suffering" and not the "elimination of human suffering". I suppose that the conclusion of suffering would require a transcendental event. Something we are currently not capable of, at least on a mass scale. To overcome the physicality of suffering is something that I think more enlightened future generations will have to address. But we are far from that point. There is so much work to do to eliminate suffering that doesn't even factor in that we suffer because we are physical and we exist. Like, we can stop having wars through force of collective will, and that would do wonders in reducing suffering. Conscious actions and decisions can be made to reduce suffering, and as we evolve and become more enlightened as a species, the way to overcome the physicality of suffering will become clear I hope.
 

SalixIncendium

अग्निविलोवनन्दः
Staff member
Premium Member
The OP is too vague. Are we talking about suffering in general or one's ability to avoid experiencing it?
 

SalixIncendium

अग्निविलोवनन्दः
Staff member
Premium Member
After reading through I am not sure what you define as suffering. At its basic it is pain that we must endure and that will always be an eventuality unless you live in a bubble and enjoy your alone time. As long as you interact with another life form you will endure suffering.
Not necessarily. It all depends how one reacts to that pain. I can choose to focus on the pain and suffer, or simply observe the pain, realize it is temporary and not a part of me, and move past it.

Life forms on earth at least, all have self-survival as the first priority. This instinct will eventually cause suffering for other life forms.
How so? How do you know these other life forms are suffering?

Bacteria invade the body to survive and reproduce causing us to get sick, most people would consider that suffering.
And others would just consider that an inconvenience...or just not consider it.
 

bobhikes

Nondetermined
Premium Member
Not necessarily. It all depends how one reacts to that pain. I can choose to focus on the pain and suffer, or simply observe the pain, realize it is temporary and not a part of me, and move past it.


How so? How do you know these other life forms are suffering?


And others would just consider that an inconvenience...or just not consider it.
I have defined what I feel is suffering, what is your definition. As to pain it I define it as something that causes distress, it does not have to be physical, it can be emotional as well. Have you seen a dog limp, or a plant shrivel its leaves, a fish trashing in a net there are many more examples. All life needs nutriment, a specific environment and has a form, when you take any of those away it strives to get it back or die. Maybe that's not suffering to some humans, but I view it as such, and with all the human charities that exist to help these life forms I do believe I am not alone.
 
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