You may have misunderstood my intention. I agree there was never a global flood. I was saying that if there were, we should expect universal erosion lines on all continents in all directions towards the oceans where a bulk of the water would have ostensibly receded -- something that we clearly don't see.
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The global flood: The sorting of fossils and sediments
- Thread starter Agnostic75
- Start date
You may have misunderstood my intention. I agree there was never a global flood. I was saying that if there were, we should expect universal erosion lines on all continents in all directions towards the oceans where a bulk of the water would have ostensibly receded -- something that we clearly don't see.
shawn001
Well-Known Member
I pretty much knew that is what you meant by the post, but wasn't totally sure. No we don't see any evidence of a global flood.
painted wolf
Grey Muzzle
We also shouldn't see clearly distinctive sedimentary layers... certainly not sedimentary layers interspersed with dry volcanic ash deposits and the like.
We also shouldn't see the progression we see in the fossil record.
wa:do
We also shouldn't see the progression we see in the fossil record.
wa:do
shawn001
Well-Known Member
It would have also put out the yellowstone super volcano and Hawaii.
It one version of the noah fllod story it rains for forty days and forty nights, in another it rains for a year.
That much water vapor in the atmophere would change the oxygen balance and create super high pressure that would flatten things. If I remeber some 900lbs per square inch.
It one version of the noah fllod story it rains for forty days and forty nights, in another it rains for a year.
That much water vapor in the atmophere would change the oxygen balance and create super high pressure that would flatten things. If I remeber some 900lbs per square inch.
JustWondering2
Just the facts Ma'am
Exactly what I said. And no there is no where near enough water or water vapour on Earth to cover all the surface. By a factor > 10 and < 100 times
shawn001
Well-Known Member
I have been studying geology for forty years including plate tectonics and volcanism.
I should however rephrase what I really meant. Not put them out per se, because they are huge hot spots under the volcanoes and yes Hawaii grew from the hot spots in the oceans, but if we were talking about water higher then everest there would be evidence they were interupted, but there isn't any of course.
outhouse
Atheistically
you brought up a point though.
if the water did cover volcano's there would be formations like those found under the sea now. There are none! anywhere on the planet other then under current ocean levels
shawn001
Well-Known Member
Dino Death Pit!
Nearly 100 million years before giant dinos like Tyrannosaurus rex ruled the world, a volcano rumbled in an ancient, marshy land. Fiery lava belched out of the crater, and ash snowed down on what is now part of the Gobi desert in China.
As it fell onto the moist earth, the ash combined with water to create a gooey mud trap, like superthick quicksand. Before long, a small dinosaur called a ceratosaur wandered into the muck on its hind legs and couldn't break free. Another meat-eating dino spied easy prey and ran toward the helpless animal. But this was no free lunch! Both predator and prey sank to their doom in the "quickmud."
This scene may have played out again and again as at least 14 dinosaurs tumbled into three different mud traps. Now, more than 160 million years later, scientists have unearthed this dino graveyardincluding fossils of the oldest known member of the tyrannosaur family. And the discovery is revealing ancient secrets from the age of the dinosaurs.
Lost in Time
Fossils have shown that the earliest dinosaurs lived about 230 million years ago and were only about the size of todays German shepherds. About 145 million years ago, massive dinos such as the four-story-tall Brachiosaurus began to stomp the Earth. But what did dinosaurs look like in between?
"The mud pits are a real discovery," says dino expert James Clark, who participated in the dig. "There are very few dinosaur fossils from this time in the middle, when the animals started transitioning into giants."
Dinosaur Pancakes
As scientists chipped away at the remains of the mud pitsnow giant blocks of rock they found one unusual creature after another. "They were stacked up like pancakes," Clark says.
Among other fossils, they uncovered a bizarre toothless meat-eater called a ceratosaur; an ancestor of the horned dinosaurssuch as Triceratopsnamed Yinlong; as well as ancient turtles, mammals, and crocodiles.
But the most incredible discovery of all is a new two-legged predator with a Mohawk-like crest on its head. Named Guanlong, Chinese for "crested dragon," it weighed just 165 pounds (74.8 kilograms). But parts of the animal's skull and a telltale ridge in its hip bone look strikingly similar to gigantic tyrannosaurs that lived about 100 million years laterincluding the 15,000-pound (6803.8-kilogram) Tyrannosaurus rex.
Digging Up Answers
Now these discoveries are helping to solve many dinosaur mysteries. You probably know that Tyrannosaurus rex had surprisingly wimpy arms and used its terrifying teeth to grab prey. But did its ancestors have more powerful arms? Yes. Guanlong's muscular limbs show that early tyrannosaurs probably snatched prey with their arms.
Ferocious Triceratops fought off enemies with its three dangerous horns and a bony frill around its neck. Did the beast's smaller ancestors have horns, too? No. "Yinlong may not have needed big horns because it was smaller and could probably flee from predators more easily," says National Geographic's dino expert Josh Smith.
And these finds are just the beginning. As the dig continues, the strange creatures of the Gobi death pits could help scientists rewrite the history of dinosaurs
Dino Death Pit -- National Geographic Kids
Nearly 100 million years before giant dinos like Tyrannosaurus rex ruled the world, a volcano rumbled in an ancient, marshy land. Fiery lava belched out of the crater, and ash snowed down on what is now part of the Gobi desert in China.
As it fell onto the moist earth, the ash combined with water to create a gooey mud trap, like superthick quicksand. Before long, a small dinosaur called a ceratosaur wandered into the muck on its hind legs and couldn't break free. Another meat-eating dino spied easy prey and ran toward the helpless animal. But this was no free lunch! Both predator and prey sank to their doom in the "quickmud."
This scene may have played out again and again as at least 14 dinosaurs tumbled into three different mud traps. Now, more than 160 million years later, scientists have unearthed this dino graveyardincluding fossils of the oldest known member of the tyrannosaur family. And the discovery is revealing ancient secrets from the age of the dinosaurs.
Lost in Time
Fossils have shown that the earliest dinosaurs lived about 230 million years ago and were only about the size of todays German shepherds. About 145 million years ago, massive dinos such as the four-story-tall Brachiosaurus began to stomp the Earth. But what did dinosaurs look like in between?
"The mud pits are a real discovery," says dino expert James Clark, who participated in the dig. "There are very few dinosaur fossils from this time in the middle, when the animals started transitioning into giants."
Dinosaur Pancakes
As scientists chipped away at the remains of the mud pitsnow giant blocks of rock they found one unusual creature after another. "They were stacked up like pancakes," Clark says.
Among other fossils, they uncovered a bizarre toothless meat-eater called a ceratosaur; an ancestor of the horned dinosaurssuch as Triceratopsnamed Yinlong; as well as ancient turtles, mammals, and crocodiles.
But the most incredible discovery of all is a new two-legged predator with a Mohawk-like crest on its head. Named Guanlong, Chinese for "crested dragon," it weighed just 165 pounds (74.8 kilograms). But parts of the animal's skull and a telltale ridge in its hip bone look strikingly similar to gigantic tyrannosaurs that lived about 100 million years laterincluding the 15,000-pound (6803.8-kilogram) Tyrannosaurus rex.
Digging Up Answers
Now these discoveries are helping to solve many dinosaur mysteries. You probably know that Tyrannosaurus rex had surprisingly wimpy arms and used its terrifying teeth to grab prey. But did its ancestors have more powerful arms? Yes. Guanlong's muscular limbs show that early tyrannosaurs probably snatched prey with their arms.
Ferocious Triceratops fought off enemies with its three dangerous horns and a bony frill around its neck. Did the beast's smaller ancestors have horns, too? No. "Yinlong may not have needed big horns because it was smaller and could probably flee from predators more easily," says National Geographic's dino expert Josh Smith.
And these finds are just the beginning. As the dig continues, the strange creatures of the Gobi death pits could help scientists rewrite the history of dinosaurs
Dino Death Pit -- National Geographic Kids
shawn001
Well-Known Member
The Valley of the Whales
There is considerable evidence which indicates that the basin of Wadi Hitan was submerged in water some 40 to 50 million years ago. At that time, the so-called Tethys Sea reached far south of the existing Mediterranean. The Tethys Sea is assumed to have retreated north and over the years deposited thick sediments of sandstone and limestone visible in rock formations in Wadi Hitan.
The Valley of the Whales
There is another even more ancient Egypt that is known to very few people. The Fayoum area contains some of the best preserved paleontological sites in the world one of which is Wadi Hitan or the Valley of Whales. This is a remote valley in the Western Desert of Egypt. At 150 kilometers southwest of Cairo, the valley is located near the Al-Katrani mountain range, a well known and valuable geological site for its rare vertebrate fossils and mega-fossils.There is considerable evidence which indicates that the basin of Wadi Hitan was submerged in water some 40 to 50 million years ago. At that time, the so-called Tethys Sea reached far south of the existing Mediterranean. The Tethys Sea is assumed to have retreated north and over the years deposited thick sediments of sandstone and limestone visible in rock formations in Wadi Hitan.
The Valley of the Whales
javajo
Well-Known Member
Is that a result of movement of tectonic plates?
Agnostic75
Well-Known Member
Edit: Deletion of duplicate post.
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javajo
Well-Known Member
Reason I asked was I was interested in whether anyone had heard of something called cataclysmic plate tectonics and if people still find the theory viable as it was in a 20yr. old book I had. It basically theorized that the continents were all one land mass at one time and the plates moved apart, but instead of over a long time it was a shorter time of great cataclysm. Theories come and go, so I just wondered. Peace.
shawn001
Well-Known Member
Yes and Agnostic, it is in with sorting of the fossil record actually because of animals living at different times in earths history. One reason why I posted the fossils of the whales in the valley of the whales in Eygpt. This was when the Tethys sea covered most of the middle east and africa.
Like the mass exitintion of the permian which happened before the dinosaurs and killed 95% of all life on earth and it evolved back to the dinosaurs then they got it and life evolved back again to more mammals and us.
Agnostic75
Well-Known Member
javajo said:
But do you have any explantions for the large amount of evidence against the global flood that I have posted in this thread?
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shawn001
Well-Known Member
"The idea of continental mobility has developed through three stages: cataclysmic theories; the concept of drift of individual continents; and plate tectonics."
Plate tectonics was proven by the navy in 1960 when they mapped the ocean floor and by Global positioning satellites now, we can measure the speed of them and even height.
I would say the geology of the earth is very important in understanding the fossil record for a lot of reasons.
javajo
Well-Known Member
Sorry, I'm not much of a science enthusiast, so I didn't read all that. I was interested in the plate tectonics ideas and whether it is possible that they moved faster due to cataclysmic events. I don't know if they abandoned that idea or not. Just something I was reading.