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The Bible

Discussion in 'Christianity DIR' started by Isis, Apr 8, 2004.

  1. harold e. rice

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    The real questions that should be asked are:

    Who really wrote the bible and when was it written?

    From what cultures did the bible writers steal or borrow their Myths and stories?

    Has science proven anything in the bible to be wrong?

    Has the voices of archeology declared the so-called facts in the bible to be wrong?

    Where can the evidence be found that proves the Genesis stories to be fables?
     
  2. quick

    quick Member

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    Because, as Paul tells us in 2 Timothy 3:16-17, the Scripture is not quite like any other book:

    "All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work. "

    The key phrase is "God breathed", from the original Greek "theopneumestos". The Word is not of man, but of God. If you choose to reject this, then there are many ways to study about the uniqueness of the Word, but ultimately, you cannot see it as the Word so long as your eyes are clouded by sin. When the Holy Spirit removes those scales from your eyes, they you will see. Ask God to provide you with such grace and clarity, and then read Ephesisans or Galatians for yourself.
     
  3. Ceridwen018

    Ceridwen018 Well-Known Member

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    To say that the bible is divinely inspired because the bible says it is divinly inspired is circular reasoning, but this is no place to debate the validity of the bible. Come join the discussion under 'Religious Debates' in the thread 'How reliable is the Bible?'

    Hope to see you there soon!
     
  4. quick

    quick Member

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    Circular in a secular, logical sense, sure; but no amount of argument will convince anyone of the veracity of the Bible--only the Holy Spirit can do so, and when this occurs, no amount of argument will shake the believer in his understanding of the truth of the Bible. That is my point.
     
  5. martha dodge

    martha dodge Member

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    To Isis, it confuses me that some would say that the Bible is just a Book so it is not to be taken seriously and then turn around and live their life and base their whole philosophy on what someone wrote in a book. Charles Darwin wrote a book, its just a book of theory and yet it is taught in school today as fact. How do I know it was a book of theory? Darwin himself said so. Freud wrote a book and now men are making fortunes dispensing his theories. Psychiatry is the most unexact science on the planet. Who has been inside the human pscyhe? Hey it is just a book. If my computer goes down, I go looking for a book. If I have a question about history, I go look in a book. I wasn't there so how do I know Napoleon met his Waterloo. We can be a lot more confident in the One who made the trees, that make the paper, that make the Book, than we can about all the different ones who write them. And if Father God can make the tree surely He can see to it that His Holy Book keeps telling the truth. Not like some of the other books you read if you get my drift.
     
  6. Mr Spinkles

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    Right. So we have to scrutinize books greatly to test their validity then, do we agree? The question is, the claims in which books are supported by evidence, and by how much?

    What evidence supports such Biblical claims as say, for example, the great flood? Did the Bible tell the truth about this?
     
  7. quick

    quick Member

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    Do you own research--the great flood is mentioned in many ancient religious texts, and there is tremendous archaelogical evidence of it. Just do the research yourself online, or at a library.
     
  8. Mr Spinkles

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    quick-- I would suggest the same for you. Just make sure to read some stuff against the great flood, not just stuff that supports it.
     
  9. LCMS Sprecher

    LCMS Sprecher Member

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    I would make the point that if the Bible was false, why would so many people be trying to say it was. Why not just let it rest. If you believe it is just a book of stories, what do you care? The stories of Greek and Roman gods have never received this kind of scrutiny. By arguing the point, validity is added to the Bible. Many people don't like the Bible because it condemns many of the things seen today as being ok (i.e. homosexuality, premarital sex, living a life without concern for others) as wrong and sinful. Man is inherently sinful, so much to an extent that he will attempt to explain away his sin and try to destroy whatever that declares he sins. We as humans strive to think of ourselves as perfect and independently in control. The Bible points to our sins, but more importantly to Jesus Christ whose death gave us everlasting live. Such news would be aggressively opposed by Satan and doubt is his greatest tool. Is the Bible factually correct? Yes! Why? Because if it wasn't no one would oppose it so adamantly.
     
  10. martha dodge

    martha dodge Member

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    LCMS Sprecher, God bless you always.
     
  11. LCMS Sprecher

    LCMS Sprecher Member

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    Thank you, and Blessings to you as well.
     
  12. Ceridwen018

    Ceridwen018 Well-Known Member

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    LCMS,

    "I would make the point that if the Bible was false, why would so many people be trying to say it was. Why not just let it rest."

    Why not let anything just rest? I question because I seek the truth. I do not mean to offend in any way. Also, this is a website dedicated to relgious-inspired debate. If we all just let everything rest, we'd get pretty bored pretty quick, and Rex'd be out of a job ;)

    "The stories of Greek and Roman gods have never received this kind of scrutiny."

    This is because they have never been regarded as true by modern man. Are you implying that the bible is equal to these?

    "By arguing the point, validity is added to the Bible."

    Could you please explain to me how this is true?

    "Is the Bible factually correct? Yes! Why? Because if it wasn't no one would oppose it so adamantly."

    That doesn't make any sense to me. If the bible were factually true, it would be impossible to oppose it. The fact that it is NOT factually true, and that people still believe it is what makes other people oppose it adamantly.
     
  13. LCMS Sprecher

    LCMS Sprecher Member

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    The stories of Greek and Roman gods were seen as true to the people of that time. I personally believe that if you truly don't believe in the Bible, as many on here don't seem to, then there must be something there not to believe in. Why not just say I don't believe and leave it at that. If you oppose something then there must be something to oppose to begin with. By opposing the Bible, I believe that people are actually recognizing that there is something there in the Bible and they choose not to believe it.
     
  14. Ceridwen018

    Ceridwen018 Well-Known Member

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    LCMS,

    Of COURSE there is something in the bible, I mean, it's over 1000 pages long! No one is denying that the bible has something to say, but you are correct-- we must choose whether we agree with its message. The bible says that god exists and Jesus was his son, and I don't believe it.

    I'm still scratching my head at your logic of how denying something can actually *improve* it's validity. Could you elaborate that one for me?
     
  15. LCMS Sprecher

    LCMS Sprecher Member

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    The Bible has been backed up more than any other book probably in history. You have loads of archeological evidence to back up the fact that the places and people in the Bible really existed. Now, factually the Bible is correct. What I believe you are having a problem with is the religious aspect of the Bible. That you cannot prove by reason or scientific testing. How can you prove Jesus died for our sins and and that forgiveness actually occurred. I don't know. We don't have magical litmus paper that we can wipe of people and say, "gee Molly, your sins are forgiven Jesus must have existed!" No, some things must be apprehended by faith and faith alone which comes via the Holy Spirit in the reading of Gods Word. So literally you would have to read it, to believe it!
     
  16. harold e. rice

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    Quick wrote'

    Do you own research--the great flood is mentioned in many ancient religious texts, and there is tremendous archaelogical evidence of it. Just do the research yourself online, or at a library.

    ===================================================
    The difference is that the floor story of Mesopotamia pre-dates the Hebrew story by three thousand years.
    Most of the tales in the first five chapters of Genesis was written around 600 BC. The book of Job is older than Genesis.
     
  17. Runt

    Runt Well-Known Member

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    All that proves is that the Bible is basically a conglomeration of pagan myths that survived in one form or another throughout the ages until they were finally written down as the “Word of God”.
     
  18. dan

    dan Well-Known Member

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    Tell me, how come Cortes writes of the Incas having a tradition about a great flood that God sent to punish iniquity and a white man with a beard claiming to be the Son of God and promising to return to save His people? How did that "pagan myth" get to America before anyone who was exposed to that myth knew America existed?

    P.S. I have the answer.
     
  19. Mr Spinkles

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    Well, the bearded man could not have been Jesus....he wasn't white.
     
  20. dan

    dan Well-Known Member

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    1) Why do you say that?

    2) Define "white." The government defines Semites as "white."
     
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