Societal peace: which religious scripture is best suited for this purpose?

[Indian Iconoclast]

THE OFFERING OF THE OTHER CHEEK TO BE SMITTEN REQUIRES EXEMPLARY COURAGE! THE PERPETRATORS OF THE 9/11 AND THEIR FAITH HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THAT COURAGE IS!:yes:

 

[nash8]

I have to wonder why you left out Hindus at the least, not to mention others.


In my opinion a partial exploration of this is misleading. Are there Bhuddists who would object if you claimed to be as enlightened as the Buddha?

Plus we have such images as Christ washing the feet of His disciples to demonstrate leadership through humble service.

Since Muhammad's community was faced with a thorough and complete ethnic cleansing, fending off existential threats was necessary for peace at that time, and Buddha certainly did not face persecution to rival Muhammad. However although fending off existential threat required temporal leadership, Muhammad was one of Arabia's materially poorer inhabitants, due to His constant efforts to ensure the needs of the least of His people were met.

Now it is clear that although all deserve human rights (complete human rights being a very recent construct), not all people produce deeds of equal virtue, hence the hierarchy of the Prophets being the greatest under God.


The Earth is of minuscule size compared to the universe (it is a relative state). That doesn't make the Earth small. The worth in deeds of humanity, although not small, when compared to the spiritual wealth of God is pitiful.

Did you neglect to mention that in Christianity God values us so much He sends Shephards whom even if they have 99 saved sheep, they will still endeavor to recover the 1 lost?


Compassion has never been unique to Buddhism.


"Light is good in whatsoever lamp it is burning! A rose is beautiful in whatsoever garden it may bloom! A star has the same radiance if it shines from the East or from the West. Be free from prejudice, so will you love the Sun of Truth from whatsoever point in the horizon it may shine" ~Abdul-Baha

Great post sir!!!

"Peace on earth" is a laugh and the idea that it'll come from religion is an even bigger laugh.

Oh ye of little faith...

 

[arthra]

There is a great need need to recognize the contributions to peace by the major world religions instead of attacking other religions or asking "which of the three"... emphasize what they have contributed.

To do this find models for peace in each... emphasize the saints and important figures that contributed to peace.

Some examples could be:

Khān Abdul Ghaffār Khān (1890 – 20 January 1988) (Pashto: خان عبدالغفار خان‎, Urdu: خان عبدالغفار خان‎), also known as Fakhr-e Afghān (Urdu: فخر افغان‎, lit. "pride of Afghans"),

His Holiness the Dalai Lama (1935-)

Martin Luther King

Another suggestion would be to support international bodies like the World Parliament of Religions that is going to convene in 2014:

Brussels to host the Parliament of the World

• “…teaches tolerance”
• “…is a vehicle for peace in the world,”

 

[Indian Iconoclast]

A font size 7 of support...

Thanks, Friend. :namaste

That 7 size font dear friend SageTree, was in salutation and reverence to my most admired poet whose lines from his immortal poem 'A PSALM OF LIFE' had been quoted in my post. That poem has been inspiring great sense of steadfastness and dedication with toil and resolve in the hearts its readers ever since its publication!

Our great Indian seer and thinker and Nobel Laureate poet, Sir Rabindranath Tagore, has compared that poem for its message with that of the message from Krishna to his disciple and friend Arjuna in the Mahabharata (in the Bhagawat Geeta, to shake off his feelings of apprehension of the war at hand and rise with the resolved soldier's will to fight and prevail).

I thank you for your appreciation again.

 

[Indian Iconoclast]

Sorry, but you're wrong on both counts:

The Baha'i Faith is an independant religion with its own scriptures, laws, and teachings, not a break-away from something else.

And it's not the "last" religion; there will never be a last religion!

Peace,

Bruce
s

Peace Brother Bruce!

I can not be justly held to be wrong or right on my impression! Please read my post carefully (and others' posts in future) before loading your cannon and firing your salvos!

As is apparent from your post, dear Bruce, that my impression on the Bahai faith needs for authentic information, you should be kind enough to read my post once again to concede kindly to my request made to you and write more of this faith in this thread itself.

*************************************************************************************************************************************************************************
'AI KEH NA SHANAASI KHAFI RA AZ JALI HUSHIYAAR BAASH! AI GIRAFTAAR E ABU BAKR O ALI HUSHIYAAR BAASH!' (Couplet in Persian by Muhammad Ali Baab ~ Iranian Seer and Martyr in the struggle for ushering broad-heartedness in Islam at Iran. Fore runner of Baha Ullah in this field of reform and compared to John the Baptist (the usherer of Jesus Christ).

 

[Caladan]

I'm looking at three religions and a scripture from each: Christianity and the Bible, Islam and the Quran, and Buddhism and the Lotus Sutra. Which of these three are best suited to bring peace to a society/nation?

Both the Bible and the Quran cause division; they create an "us versus them" mentality. Peace among all people cannot be achieved with that mentality. They also both create hierarchical structures: a god at the top, a messiah or prophet in the middle, lesser figures, then finally individuals. They are also based, or at least Christianity, on the idea that people are basically worthless, especially when compared to their god. Do these ideas sound like the way to peace?

On the other hand, the Lotus Sutra of Buddhism, considered by many Buddhists to be the "king of sutras" (out of about 10,000), teaches that all things are interconnected, therefore, we should practice compassion for all living things. There are no divisions among people in the Lotus Sutra. Also, there's no hierarchy: all people are equal, and all have the ability to bring out their innate Buddha-nature. This, in my opinion, seems to be a better path to peace than the previous two.

I realize some others could also be considered, but these are the three I'm wanting to compare. Any thoughts? Are there any Christians or Muslims who would disagree, and why?

Personally after reading some of the Buddhist scriptures (impossible to cover even a fraction of the Buddhist library really), with some of them I was really bored out of my mind.
If you need to be told repeatedly to feel compassion for other living creatures and be indoctrinated that it's good, OK. I already feel that way naturally. I don't think that the fact that there are entire texts dedicated to stories after stories of enlightened masters offering their flesh to a predator, living as beggers, etc. are what will make a better society.

Personally in literature such as the Hebrew Bible, Greek literature, Norse literature, and other examples I feel more passion and real human concerns being addressed in the text.
I'm moved by gutsu, fighting spirit, passion, and desire. I start to dose off and get bored very quickly by sermons of how compassionate and good we all need to be. These things usually come with instincts and experience as far as I can tell.

 

[FranklinMichaelV.3]

I guess at it's extreme Jainism would bring about a peaceful society?

 

[BruceDLimber]

As is apparent from your post, dear Bruce, that my impression on the Bahai faith needs ... authentic information; ... kindly ... write more of this faith in this thread itself.

There's much I could write, but it's not my intent to hijack this thread.

So I'll simply post two typical passages from out scriptures:

“O people of the earth!
“The first Glad-Tidings which the Mother Book hath, in this Most Great Revelation, imparted to all the peoples of the world is that the law of holy war hath been blotted out from the Book. Glorified be the All-Merciful, the Lord of grace abounding, through Whom the door of heavenly bounty hath been flung open in the face of all that are in Heaven and on earth.
“The second Glad-Tidings . . .”
--Tablets of Baha’u’llah, pp. 21-22

“Beware lest ye shed the blood of anyone. Unsheathe the sword of your tongue from the scabbard of utterance, for therewith ye can conquer the citadels of men’s hearts. We have abolished the law to wage holy war against each other. God’s mercy, hath, verily, encompassed all created things, if ye do but understand. Aid ye your Lord, the God of Mercy, with the sword of understanding. Keener indeed is it, and more finely tempered, than the sword of utterance, were ye but to reflect upon the words of your Lord. Thus have the hosts of Divine Revelation been sent down by God, the Help in Peril, the Self-Subsisting, and thus have the armies of divine inspiration been made manifest from the Source of command, as bidden by God, the All-Glorious, the Best-Beloved.”
--The Summons of the Lord of Hosts, p 23

And BTW, all Baha'is who serve in the military are strongly encouraged to apply for conscientious-objector status as noncombatants (as I myself did).

Peace,

Bruce

 

[psalmist23]

Dyanaprajna2011,

It seems you’re suggesting that people have no worth within Christianity, and yet the most important message of the gospel is that God loved us so much, and saw so much value in us, that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Christ showed us that it is impossible to have peace without him, because true peace is to know him, the Prince of Peace. Societal peace is not a real option, because all men have sinned and have fallen short of the glory of God. But despite of this, God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. He shows us much grace.

”Therefore, since we have now been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ” (Romans 5:1)

”But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us” (Romans 5:8).

 

[Ablaze]

Personally after reading some of the Buddhist scriptures (impossible to cover even a fraction of the Buddhist library really), with some of them I was really bored out of my mind.
If you need to be told repeatedly to feel compassion for other living creatures and be indoctrinated that it's good, OK. I already feel that way naturally. I don't think that the fact that there are entire texts dedicated to stories after stories of enlightened masters offering their flesh to a predator, living as beggers, etc. are what will make a better society.

Personally in literature such as the Hebrew Bible, Greek literature, Norse literature, and other examples I feel more passion and real human concerns being addressed in the text.
I'm moved by gutsu, fighting spirit, passion, and desire. I start to dose off and get bored very quickly by sermons of how compassionate and good we all need to be. These things usually come with instincts and experience as far as I can tell.

I'm curious which Buddhist scriptures and specific literature in the Hebrew Bible and in the Greek and Norse traditions you're referring to here. If it's not too much, could you provide a few references/citations?

 

[Caladan]

I'm curious which Buddhist scriptures and specific literature in the Hebrew Bible and in the Greek and Norse traditions you're referring to here. If it's not too much, could you provide a few references/citations?

You're kidding right? I read the Hebrew, Greek, and Norse literature cover to cover. I can't really arbitrarily choose the inspiring and uninspiring literary chapters, books or paragraphs I've read through the years.

 

[Ablaze]

Not kidding. One or two specific examples would suffice, and there's no need to choose arbitrarily. Just asking out of curiosity.

Similarly, I could say I've read the Buddhist literature "cover to cover," and yet I would be more than happy to provide a handful of examples of passages I do not find "boring" or "indoctrinating" for the purposes of continuing the discussion and learning from others.

It's a discussion forum after all.

 

[payak]

All can bring peace if the individual follows their teachings correctly, again my Abbott says whatever religion is working for you must be continued, do not change what is working.

 

[Caladan]

Not kidding. One or two specific examples would suffice, and there's no need to choose arbitrarily. Just asking out of curiosity.

Similarly, I could say I've read the Buddhist literature "cover to cover," and yet I would be more than happy to provide a handful of examples of passages I do not find "boring" or "indoctrinating" for the purposes of continuing the discussion and learning from others.

It's a discussion forum after all.

Since dyanaprajna2011 who started this OP and this debate did not bring any material from the three texts he discusses that I could see, I do not plan to derail this thread with selective paragraphs and quotes either. If you are really interested to get better educated with some of the literature and scriptures we discuss here, then there are probably dozens of threads which have been dedicated to quoting inspiring or uninspiring quotes from Abrahamic and Dhramic scriptures among others. All you need to do is search the forum a little.

 

[Ablaze]

Personally, when limited to the texts mentioned in the original post, I am particularly intrigued by the following excerpts from the Lotus Sutra:

The present buddhas of the ten directions,
As numerous as the sands of the Ganges River,
Revered by devas and humans,
Appear in the world and teach this Dharma
To make sentient beings feel at peace.
They know the utmost tranquility,
And although they teach various paths
With the power of skillful means,
Their teachings are actually for the buddha vehicle.
Knowing the character of sentient beings—
Their deep intentions, past acts,
Wishes, persistence, and strength,
Their keen or dull faculties—
The buddhas teach with skillful means
Using various explanations, illustrations, and words,
In accordance with the capacities of sentient beings.
Now I too reveal the path of the buddhas
Through various paths to the Dharma
To make sentient beings feel at peace.

Lotus Sutra, Chapter 2

There is no peace in the triple world,
Just like in the burning house,
Which is full of various suffering
And which is extremely terrifying.
There are always the sufferings
Of birth, old age, illness, and death.
Such fires as these burn endlessly.
The Tathāgata, who has already left
The burning house of the triple world,
Lives in tranquility
And dwells at ease in the forest.
Now this triple world is my property
And the sentient beings in it are my children.
There are now many dangers here
And I am the only one who can protect them.

Lotus Sutra, Chapter 3

This Dharma has a single flavor
Of liberation and nirvana.
I expound its meaning with the same subtle voice,
Always making the Mahayana
The subject of my illustrations.
I see everywhere, and regard all as equal.
I have no feelings of like or dislike;
For me there is no this or that.
Nor do I have either love or hate.
I have no attachments and make no distinctions,
And so always teach the Dharma equally to all.

Lotus Sutra, Chapter 5

It seems to me that in the Lotus Sutra, peace is conceived of apart from society. Perhaps this can be traced back to the symbolism of the blooming lotus. In one of the earliest discourses spoken by the Buddha, it is said:

Like a blue lotus, rising up,
unsmeared by water,
unsmeared am I by the world,
and so, brahman,
I'm awake."

Dona Sutta, Anguttara Nikaya 4.36

Emerging from mud to rest atop the surface of the pond, the lotus is in the world but not of the world, a telling image that may subtly point toward the elusive nature of societal peace.

 

[captainbryce]

On the other hand, the Lotus Sutra of Buddhism, considered by many Buddhists to be the "king of sutras" (out of about 10,000), teaches that all things are interconnected, therefore, we should practice compassion for all living things. There are no divisions among people in the Lotus Sutra. Also, there's no hierarchy: all people are equal, and all have the ability to bring out their innate Buddha-nature. This, in my opinion, seems to be a better path to peace than the previous two.

Imagine that. A Buddhist rates Buddhism as more credible than two non-Buddhist faiths! Interesting...

Any thoughts? Are there any Christians or Muslims who would disagree, and why?

Are there any Christians or Muslims who would disagree that Buddhism is the religion "best suited" to societal peace? Let's see....I'm just gonna go out on a limb here and say...YEAH, PROBABLY! :yes:

Why? Obvious reasons! They aren't "Buddhists".