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Featured Science cannot solve the final mystery

Discussion in 'Science and Religion' started by atanu, Jun 17, 2019.

  1. cladking

    cladking Well-Known Member

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  2. paarsurrey

    paarsurrey Veteran Member

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    "Why would I think easterner philosophies or religions would know more about the universe, when they gave no ideas about other galaxies?"

    It is a good question particularly if the eastern thought has not told the source of their thought. I deem mere existing of a thought is no enough. Right, please?

    Regards
     
  3. ecco

    ecco Veteran Member

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    Now you need explain how you got 500 boxes of tinker toys. Then do tell us how you got a pdp 10.

    WAIT........


    OK. I've put on my hip boots.
     
  4. gnostic

    gnostic The Lost One

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    No religions (east or west), no philosophies (east or west) and no science (east or west) BEFORE Edwin Hubble in 1919, really understood the true extent and understood the nature of the universe and of the Milky Way itself.

    Before Galileo in 1610, people can only do star gazing with just the naked eye, and what they saw of the Milky Way was just band of blurry light that take up the most space in the night sky, and because the distance from the centre of the galaxy to Earth, the ancient and medieval people didn’t know these hazy light were more stars on Milky Way’s spiral arms.

    That’s what the Buddha, Moses (if Moses existed historically), Jesus and Muhammad would see too, just a band of blurry vision of light in the knowing it was a (barred) spiral galaxy. And though Andromeda could be seen with naked eye, no one knew back then this too was another spiral galaxy.

    With telescope, Galileo was able to distinguish some more stars from the spiral arms of MW. The decades and centuries that followed, Charles Messier, John Herschel and John Dreyer, with better telescopes than Galileo’s, were able to list other objects in the sky, but misidentified galaxies as nebulas, because their telescopes weren’t powerful enough.

    So between 1610 and 1918, every astronomers thought the Milky Way was the ENTIRE UNIVERSE. And no religions, no philosophers knew any better, including the Eastern thinkers.

    It was Hubble using the Hooker Telescope in 1919, who have changed the way astronomers look at the universe.

    Andromeda Nebula became Andromeda Galaxy, and more galaxies were discovered after 1919. All astronomers after 1919 recognized that the Milky Way was one galaxy of billions, and the universe became larger than they originally thought.

    A couple of years later, Alexander Friedmann developed hypothesis in 1922 about the universe have been expanding since the universe was young, and Howard Percy Robertson (1924-25) and Georges Lemaître (1927) have independently came up with hypotheses. This expanding universe model, later became known as the “Big Bang theory” in 1948 or 49.

    The Big Bang theory is still the most dominant and accepted physical cosmology, with NASA, ESA and other astronomy programme still actively researching this model.

    We have better understanding of universe using science than any other religions and schools of thought (philosophies).

    Accepting Abrahamic religions or Eastern spiritual philosophies/religions would be like taking 100 steps backward.

    I will have to disagree with Swami about science have or need to accept Eastern spiritual thoughts, because it would be like accepting astrology.
     
  5. paarsurrey

    paarsurrey Veteran Member

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    "That’s what the Buddha, Moses (if Moses existed historically), Jesus and Muhammad would see too, just a band of blurry vision of light in the knowing it was a (barred) spiral galaxy. And though Andromeda could be seen with naked eye, no one knew back then this too was another spiral galaxy."

    The truthful Religion , Quran/Islam/Muhammad makes it very clear in the very beginning :
    [2:1]بِسۡمِ اللّٰہِ الرَّحۡمٰنِ الرَّحِیۡمِ﴿۱﴾
    In the name of Allah, the Gracious, the Merciful.
    [2:2]الٓـمّٓ ۚ﴿۲﴾
    Alif Lam Mim.
    [2:3]ذٰلِکَ الۡکِتٰبُ لَا رَیۡبَ ۚۖۛ فِیۡہِ ۚۛ ہُدًی لِّلۡمُتَّقِیۡنَ ۙ﴿۳﴾
    This is a perfect Book; there is no doubt in it; it is a guidance for the righteous,
    [2:4]الَّذِیۡنَ یُؤۡمِنُوۡنَ بِالۡغَیۡبِ وَ یُقِیۡمُوۡنَ الصَّلٰوۃَ وَ مِمَّا رَزَقۡنٰہُمۡ یُنۡفِقُوۡنَ ۙ﴿۴﴾
    Who believe in the unseen and observe Prayer, and spend out of what We have provided for them;
    [2:5]وَ الَّذِیۡنَ یُؤۡمِنُوۡنَ بِمَاۤ اُنۡزِلَ اِلَیۡکَ وَ مَاۤ اُنۡزِلَ مِنۡ قَبۡلِکَ ۚ وَ بِالۡاٰخِرَۃِ ہُمۡ یُوۡقِنُوۡنَ ؕ﴿۵﴾
    And who believe in that which has been revealed to thee, and that which was revealed before thee, and they have firm faith in what is yet to come.
    [2:6]اُولٰٓئِکَ عَلٰی ہُدًی مِّنۡ رَّبِّہِمۡ ٭ وَ اُولٰٓئِکَ ہُمُ الۡمُفۡلِحُوۡنَ ﴿۶﴾
    It is they who follow the guidance of their Lord and it is they who shall prosper.
    The Holy Quran - Chapter: 2: Al-Baqarah
    Quran concentrates to guide humanity in the ethical, moral, and spiritual and the related issues which is the domain of Religion and nowhere interferes with the Science which has its domain in the material and the physical domain. So why overburden Science with the other aspects of life that is not its domain. Right, please?

    Regards
     
  6. gnostic

    gnostic The Lost One

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    A book (Qur’an) that adopt pagan myths of jinns, beings of smokeless fire, isn’t being a “truthful religion”.

    Some passages where King Solomon can command these jinns (as well as animals, particularly birds) to fight with his army, isn’t being truthful.

    That this same king can understand the languages of animals (especially birds), and talk to them, especially that to ants, isn’t being a truthful scripture.

    That this same king can control winds and weather, Muhammad, the Qur’an and Islam aren’t being truthful.

    A book that say a human (Adam) can be created from lifeless clay and water, isn’t being truthful.


    You are correct that science isn’t religion, and religion isn’t science.

    But you have Muslims often using and promoting Quranic passages and reinterpret the contents as if they agree with science or science agree with the Qur’an, say differently.

    Christians do the same thing with the Bible.

    Neither scriptures are science textbooks, and the contents shouldn’t be treated as science, I would wholeheartedly agree.

    And yet, you have believers who do treat as science or being better than science, and that’s where I would have to disagree.
     
  7. paarsurrey

    paarsurrey Veteran Member

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    "But you have Muslims often using and promoting Quranic passages and reinterpret the contents as if they agree with science or science agree with the Qur’an, say differently."

    They might have done it incorrectly, after all they are human beings. Quran/Islam does not claim it. Right, please?

    Regards
     
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