Promiscuity

[Father Heathen]

What's wrong with being "easy"?

I don't know. Something just doesn't seem right about allowing random anonymous strangers to buy your body with only a smile and a cheesy pick-up line. Surely it cannot be good for ones self-esteem, self respect, emotional health or reputation.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

I don't know. Something just doesn't seem right about allowing random anonymous strangers to buy your body with only a smile and a cheesy pick-up line. Surely it cannot be good for ones self-esteem, self respect, emotional health or reputation.

I never have and never would have a one night stand because somebody offered a smile and a cheesy pick up line.

I was once offered an apartment on the Upper West Side of Manhattan, a boob job, my debts all paid for, and shopping trips whenever I wanted if I went home with some older guy I met back when I was single. I turned him down, too. There was just ZERO connection between us, and frankly, he came off as really creepy. Super rich (one of the many businesses he owned was a limo company), but a real creep.

When I had one night stands back in the day, they came from hours and hours of lively conversation. No strings attached. And we'd carry on with our lives.

I smell snarky from a mile away. What made me "easy" was when a potential partner allowing himself or herself to drop all their guards....ALL of them...and to approach me with a real vulnerability. After a while of playing the game, I could catch on to what was real vulnerability and what was merely a charming front.

I don't disagree at all with sexual ethics and responsibility, but I base that off complete honesty and a very very very clear definition of boundaries and expectations. What I disagree with is the idea that monogamy corners the market alone on sexual ethics.

 

[Father Heathen]

What I disagree with is the idea that monogamy corners the market alone on sexual ethics.

You do realize that polyamory doesn't necessarily mean sleeping around with everyone at the drop of a hat, right? I'm not against having multiple partners, as long as everyone actually knows, trusts and respects each other. Also, imho sex without some sort of mutual, emotional bond is being cheap with ones own body.
Like I said before, regardless of my personal feelings I still feel that people should be free to do as they please as long as everyone involved are consenting adults and everyone's rights are respected.

 

[Alceste]

But those aren't the only two options.

The third option is to be in a monogamous relationship with a person because you both adore each other and want that adoration to be expressed in part through sex. You want the sex in the relationship to be an extension of that adoration and an expression of trust and sacrifice.

Plus it's cool - like your own little secret world...

Yeah, it's cool, but I'll be damned if I was gonna wait until I was 32 (when I met my perfect match) to have any sexy fun at all. When I finally found the guy I want to spend my life with I was glad we had both learned a few tricks along the way, and so was he.

My long term relationships before Wampus were fraught with hand-wringing, brow-furrowing dissatisfaction. "Is this all it is? This definitely seems to be what everybody else is doing... Maybe I'm fooling myself to think I should be feeling more than this..." That's the trouble, you don't know the love you daydreamed of as a teenager is possible until it happens to you, and sometimes it doesn't happen for a long, long time. I've got friends in their 50s - two different couples - who went through marriages, raised children, suffered for decades with people they were not compatible with before they met their perfect match. I didn't want that. I'd rather be single than "making do" in a relationship I was only 70 or 80 % into.

Fooling around with no strings attached is simple and fun, and often a kind of physical and emotional abandon happens when you know you're not going to have to keep it up for months or years on end.

But it's not for everybody. IMO, you need a pretty thick skin and you need to be able to think charitably of people even when you are feeling vulnerable. Also, you need to be able to keep your head in heated moments to avoid the pitfalls and you need to know your boundaries and be willing to communicate them. Otherwise things can get messy.

 

[Alceste]

I don't know. Something just doesn't seem right about allowing random anonymous strangers to buy your body with only a smile and a cheesy pick-up line. Surely it cannot be good for ones self-esteem, self respect, emotional health or reputation.

A guy like that could not have gotten within ten feet of me. What Heather said more accurately reflects my experience. I can spot insincerity a mile off.

In the company I keep (poets, pagans, musicians and artists) sensual indulgence isn't bad for your reputation. I am not drawn to people who would be shocked at my sexual history IRL. Knowing I could have pretty much any guy I wanted certainly wasn't bad for my self-esteem. As for self-respect, I don't know what that has to do with the number of sexual partners one has had. I know married people with no self-respect at all and complete whores with a tonne of it, and vice versa.

I think the problem is that in your mind casual sex has to be cheap and seedy and entirely male dominated. IMO, you've been watching too much pornography. In real life it does not work that way.

 

[Alceste]

You do realize that polyamory doesn't necessarily mean sleeping around with everyone at the drop of a hat, right?

You do realize that you're the only one in this thread insisting that promiscuity means "sleeping around with everyone at the drop of a hat", right? All the promiscuous lasses you're talking to are telling you a different story. We tend to be very choosy. It's just that we're not only selecting for a life-long partner. We're also selecting for temporary fun and games.

 

[no-body]

Sex and it's consequences should only be the business of the people indulging together in it. As long as it's between consensual adults, who cares. It's like wanting to know all about and judging someones bowel movements.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

You do realize that polyamory doesn't necessarily mean sleeping around with everyone at the drop of a hat, right? I'm not against having multiple partners, as long as everyone actually knows, trusts and respects each other. Also, imho sex without some sort of mutual, emotional bond is being cheap with ones own body.
Like I said before, regardless of my personal feelings I still feel that people should be free to do as they please as long as everyone involved are consenting adults and everyone's rights are respected.

I realize that. Just wanted to clarify a few things, that's all.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

You do realize that you're the only one in this thread insisting that promiscuity means "sleeping around with everyone at the drop of a hat", right? All the promiscuous lasses you're talking to are telling you a different story. We tend to be very choosy. It's just that we're not only selecting for a life-long partner. We're also selecting for temporary fun and games.

Exactly.

I've usually said many times....I may be easy, but I ain't cheap. And what it'll cost is your ego.

 

[Alceste]

Exactly.

I've usually said many times....I may be easy, but I ain't cheap. And what it'll cost is your ego.

Heh - an old friend of mine once expressed the sentiment that she thought some of my escapades were "cheap". I said there's not much difference between "cheap" and "expensive", but there's a world of difference between "cheap" and "free".

I used to let egos slide (you have to when you're dealing with poets, artists and musicians ) but BS was not tolerated.

 

[Sunstone]

I have committed the sin of lusting in my heart promiscuously.

 

[Vasilisa Jade]

Saint Tigress,

Have you had relationships in the past in which you added another person (or two or three)? If so - why aren't you still with that person?

Nope. My previous boyfriends wouldn't let me come within 5 feet of my guy friends much less let them even hug me. My previous two serious relationships ended in numero uno due to his personal laziness and extreme jealousy, and in numero dos it ended due to extreme jealousy and looming violent behavior.

Everything I am saying is theory in my head I have played through combined with previous experiences outside of serious relationships.

My bf and I have a relationship based on friendship. Being a friend is different than being a girlfriend, and we have had this discussion about how sometimes we need each other to switch the role at the appropriate times. And we do. I love how we balance that and it is an equal give and take partnership between us.

Because of this ability, both of us being laid back and having relatively thick skins, and everything else, if this ever came up and we wanted to give it a go, I am confident we would be fine whether it worked or not. Because if one of us said the safety word lol, that would be the end of it and we'd move on, together.

I'm not saying it can't happen and a relationship still be maintained, but is it a healthy relationship?

It totally depends on too many variables I think... it could be healthy or unhealthy depending.

And the third party - if they mean nothing to you emotionally, is the meaningless sexual relationship healthy for THEM?

Honestly... that's their business. One persons poison is another's treasure or something like that. lol. Some people enjoy being sex toys...

I just don't see the need. But then, to be honest, I can truly say that I have absolutely zero desire for any sexual partner other than my husband. I never have, not for one single minute.

That's awesome. Mine is just curiosity not really desire. It isn't a big deal one way or the other.

But eventually I realized that the main reason I was attracted to this guy was because he wanted ME - and it was becoming obvious that my husband didn't respect or cherish me. The desire also had a lot to do with my extreme frustration with my life and situation, and a desire to escape a lot of things.

That's true. It is awesome to feel attractive and wanted, especially when your partner doesn't make you feel that way.

Once I realized all this, I knew that sex with this guy would be nothing more than self destructive. But - it was a wake up call about the state of my marriage, which I had been denying. About a year later, I filed for divorce.

Yeah I don't condone cheating or being an apprentice to cheating. I found out a guy lied to me once. Well, I went straight to his girlfriend when i found out. I was ticked off cause he lied to me, and her. After that I told anyone that made me suspicious that I wouldn't think twice to bust their behind.

I believe that infidelity in a relationship is indicative of problems within the relationship.

Definitely, which is all the more reason I want my bf to be comfortable talking to me about these desires. There are just too many variables. It might be something easily fixed. It may be just sheer monotony and him wanting to spice things up with something different. It may be just sheer curiosity which I can understand... but whatever the case may be, I am anticipating it on his end, not because I don't trust him, but because he is human and I love both his strengths and faults, and I want us to be prepared.

But it's not for everybody. IMO, you need a pretty thick skin and you need to be able to think charitably of people even when you are feeling vulnerable. Also, you need to be able to keep your head in heated moments to avoid the pitfalls and you need to know your boundaries and be willing to communicate them. Otherwise things can get messy.

Oh my god totally. My poor first boyfriend got the brunt of it all. LOL. I learned more from that big hot mess than any other relationship.

 

[Father Heathen]

I think the problem is that in your mind casual sex has to be cheap and seedy and entirely male dominated. IMO, you've been watching too much pornography. In real life it does not work that way.

No, it's just that about all of the girls I've known who could be considered promiscuous were always with douche bags that treated them like ****. In other words they were using some random thug as an improvised dildo, while being mistreated and disrespected (and sometimes worse) in return. In essence allowing themselves to be some scumbags blowup doll. Just two people using (and in many cases even abusing) each other.

 

[no-body]

No, it's just that about all of the girls I've known who could be considered promiscuous were always with douche bags that treated them like ****. In other words they were using some random thug as an improvised dildo, while being mistreated and disrespected (and sometimes worse) in return. In essence allowing themselves to be some scumbags blowup doll. Just two people using (and in many cases even abusing) each other.

Someone with poor boundary issues choosing a bad significant other. Shocking.

 

[Alceste]

No, it's just that about all of the girls I've known who could be considered promiscuous were always with douche bags that treated them like ****. In other words they were using some random thug as an improvised dildo, while being mistreated and disrespected (and sometimes worse) in return. In essence allowing themselves to be some scumbags blowup doll. Just two people using (and in many cases even abusing) each other.

Ah, well, there are people with no self-respect making bad decisions and abusing each other in committed, monogamous relationships too. I think sometimes people are promiscuous because they are psychologically unhealthy (my ex-fiance, for example) but sometimes people are promiscuous because they just haven't met anyone they want to settle down with and sex is fun (me), or because they are genuinely polyamorous by nature (one of my closest friends).

Likewise, sometimes people stay in bad monogamous relationships because they are psychologically unhealthy. Codependent and afraid to be alone, or lacking in boundaries, self-esteem and self-respect.

I think basically people who are psychologically unhealthy demean themselves whether they are inside or outside a relationship, and people who are psychologically healthy carry themselves with dignity, responsibility and integrity no matter how many people they take to bed.

 

[Father Heathen]

Perhaps some of my attitude comes from a bit of residual fundiness from my past.

 

[Kathryn]

Sex is an incredibly intimate act. You are allowing someone total access to your body, for pete's sake. And hopefully it's not for a professional reason (vender/consumer as in a doctor/patient context or I guess prostitute/john context).

Throw in STDs, pregnancies, abortions, children, exes, emotions and needs, uncertainty about background, context, and existing and past relationships, and...well, excuse but please tell me again...

How can anything about this truly be CASUAL?

You may THINK it's casual, but that mentality can really come back and bite you in the ***.

 

[Alceste]

Perhaps some of my attitude comes from a bit of residual fundiness from my past.

If you were raised that way then I don't doubt it. Culture has a lot to do with it. The promiscuity of the Riot Grrls on the bohemian fringe in Vancouver I'm sure has a completely different character than the promiscuity of the 50s in the Bible Belt. (Not that I'm suggesting you grew up in the 50s in the Bible Belt - just an example).

I was raised in a pretty conservative city (Alberta is the Texas of the North) where women who slept with anybody for any reason other than an engagement ring risked getting a bad reputation, but I moved. In the crowd I eventually fell in with, women owned their sexuality and took pride in the open expression of it. (And the men certainly were not complaining.) A friend of mine asked "what's wrong with being a ****?" when I used the word against another woman (residue from my upbringing), and I honestly couldn't come up with an answer that didn't require "sex outside marriage is dirty" as a first premise. That revealed my own squeamishness about sex and my attachment to the sexual moral framework of a religion I never subscribed to. These things were absorbed from the conservative culture I was raised in, and rational evaluation dissolved them. And good riddance, IMO.

It's worth noting that letting go of those presumptions allowed me to really appreciate and admire other women for the first time. Can explain later if you're interested, but I gotta go to work!

 

[blackout]

I have committed the sin of lusting in my heart promiscuously.

HAHAHA! Me too!

 

[MysticSang'ha]

Sex is an incredibly intimate act. You are allowing someone total access to your body, for pete's sake. And hopefully it's not for a professional reason (vender/consumer as in a doctor/patient context or I guess prostitute/john context).

Throw in STDs, pregnancies, abortions, children, exes, emotions and needs, uncertainty about background, context, and existing and past relationships, and...well, excuse but please tell me again...

How can anything about this truly be CASUAL?

You may THINK it's casual, but that mentality can really come back and bite you in the ***.

You know, there are PLENTY of married/monogamous couples who don't invest any TLC into their intimate life. As I stated before, monogamy by no means corners the market on sexual ethics. A marriage can still produce unwanted pregnancies, neglect, and all kinds of drama.

It's why I contend that multiple partners isn't the root cause of sexual turmoil....fear and ignorance are what creates the nasties. You get an uneducated person who is fearful of his/her own sexuality (and hence does not know where to put boundaries) AND who is ignorant and afraid to communicate effectively in an intimate setting and voilà...we have liftoff to Planet Drama!

So yes, by all means, I agree that being careless is planting the seeds for disaster in sex, but promiscuity does not have a causal relationship with harm. and monogamy is not the universal solution....a solid education, consistent contemplation and self-reflection, and communication skills are paramount in lowering risk.

Those are individual pursuits, not relationship prescriptions.