Para Brahman

[Vinayaka]

There are limits, at least for me.

There are for me too. It's just that we have yet to deal with a very anti-Hindu Hindu. Still, there are those who get annoying because of the insistence and constant reminders about their particular version of Hinduism being the best. For example you seem to have dropped the 'I'm a strong atheist' line at every turn, and I for one appreciate it. For awhile there I thought you had a goal of stating it at least 3 times a day.

 

[sayak83]

Namaskaram Sayak ji



not so mush to dissagree but to refine from a Truely Hindu perspective , ...The Mahabarata is a tretise on Dharma , looking at it from a material perspective one may naturaly come to the conclusion that it is as you describe ''an epic on the philosophy of living within the context of war'' ...yet it is more than this , ....



personaly I think it is more than this , ....more than the observation although valid , ...that kingdoms expanded ''empires into states and so on. '' ....Mahabarata taken in the context of the Vedic veiw of cosmology and the creation and duration of individual planetary systems and the Knowledge that their lifespans are split into Yugas or ages , ...this knowledge sinnes a completelt different light on the reacons for war , .......Greed and Ignorance , ....we may observe increasing population and the formation of Kingdoms but this is not the prime cause , the prime cause is Adharma .




the''riddled with Human follies'' ...I agree with entirely as it was the duplicity of the Kurava King which allowed the entire position to unfold , ...thus he was the cause of the entire war , as it was his actions or lack of Dharmic understanding that brought about the entire situation , ...thus the mahabarata is a tretise on Dharma , ...Rightious action , ....but within it and which canot be egnored is the Bhagavad Gita , the conversation between Arjuna and Krsna as they stand ready to go into battle , ....this chapter is the most important as within this chapter the higer purpose of life is explained , ..our very nature of being is explained , ...thus the Mahabarata it self illustrates the ''folly'' of mankind , the dangers of Ignorance and Self Grasping , ....where as the Gita explains our ultimate nature , that we are not this body and that we are not here for self gratification , that we are here to realise our constitutional position in relation to God , this Chapter puts the true folly of human greed and ignorance into perspective , .....



in truth it is Ignorance and Greed that bring nations or kingdoms to the state of war , ...



Here it is more than a question of desperation , ....as Krsna instructs Arjuna , ..there is no question even of compassion towards ones enemys , this deed must now be done , ...Krsna explains carefully to Arjuna that the soul is eternal , what one kills is the outer shell of those who have already brought about the cause for their own demise , ...





so called schollars my try to put dates to the writing of the Mahabarata but this only adds to the false impression given that it is a literary work rather than an 'Historical Account' ..of a battle which took place at the begining of this age of Kali (some 5000 years ago) , ...I say Battle rather than War as it is a Battle of Rightiousness over ignorance rather that an instance of waring factions fighting for supremacy .

The only thing I object to is you saying a "truly Hindu perspective". As I said in my first line, it was my own way to think about the Mahabharata that I have found valuable after 25 years of reading and re-reading its many translations. I wrote it, as I thought others may find it valuable too, particularly a person who is looking from the outside and does not want to become a Vaishnava by tomorrow.

 

[Vinayaka]

Would you be OK if I write this off as potato, potaato? (Does anyone actually say potaato?)

I'm okay with differences, always have been, so yeah.

 

[sayak83]

Awesome. You'll be the man to message if I have trouble with the chemistry parts of my module on pollution, right?

Yes! Shamelessly taking 7 days off uni for it.

Yes. Actually. I run Gas Chromatography to detect pollution traces in air and exhaust all the time.

 

[Aupmanyav]

If you don't eat oats for breakfast, we can no longer be friends.

Oats. You know, in India it is considered one of the coarsest grains and is given to elephants, cows and birds (Jawar in Hindi). But with the hype of multinationals, my daughter-in-law dotes on oaty things, flakes, biscuits and what not even if they are more costly. These young people do not understand a thing.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Would you be OK if I write this off as potato, potaato? (Does anyone actually say potaato?)

The Maharshtrians sure term it as Bataata - Bataata vada, that is a ball of spiced mashed potato in gram flour and fried.

 

[Kirran]

Yes. Actually. I run Gas Chromatography to detect pollution traces in air and exhaust all the time.

Great! No extra reading required, I can just ask you stuff

Oats. You know, in India it is considered one of the coarsest grains and is given to elephants, cows and birds (Jawar in Hindi). But with the hype of multinationals, my daughter-in-law dotes on oaty things, flakes, biscuits and what not even if they are more costly. These young people do not understand a thing.

Or maybe the old people haven't cottoned on yet!

 

[Aupmanyav]

Orthodox, don't easily make a change. But an acquaintance told me that bread made of Jowar after removing the outer layer on the seed (it has to be soaked in water for that and then pounded in a mortar) is tasty. I would like to try that, but who will take the trouble of doing that for me?

Have included a photo of Bataata vada in my previous post.

 

[George-ananda]

Yes.A secular Hindu.

Yes that is good. I'm curious now what you mean by 'Secular Hindu' (because I may be one myself but I am not familiar with the term).

 

[sayak83]

Yes that is good. I'm curious now what you mean by 'Secular Hindu' (because I may be one myself but I am not familiar with the term).

It means a little bit of all these things:-

Secular
1) Not strongly associated with any specific sect (or sakha).
2) Not religious in the sense of being particularly devotional to a specific God within Hinduism.
3) Not orthodox in the sense of strictly following scriptural injunctions and rituals (being a Brahmin that can be a thing). More meditative, reflective and philosophical in outlook.
4) Politically believe India (and other countries) should be pluralistic and tolerant nation open to all religious and irreligious exploration. People should not be discriminated based in religion or caste or ethnicity.
5) Attracted by the ethical ideas of humanism

Hindu
1) Believe that the Indian Dharmic traditions have produced some of the best philosophical, ethical and metaphysical ideas of the world.
2) Believe these are relevant today and needs to be more widely disseminated and discussed and one should build new advances over them so that they remain living and growing and not well-preserved stagnant relics.
3) To that effect, I study philosophies and writings and teachings of Upanisads, Gita, Mahabharata, Nyaya, Vaisesika and classical Indian Buddhism and what I can learn from them that I can practice and get guidance from in the day-to-day life. They inform my ethics, my outlook and affect all aspects of my professional and personal life. There are ways of looking at myself and the world in there that truly provides new insight when one is stuck in whatever rut one is in.
4) One thing I learned from reading the lives of people like Gandhi, Nehru, Einstein, Mandela, Rabindranath, Vivekanada was that they absorbed knowledge from a wide variety of sources, reflected on them and turned them into something that they could act upon and inspire themselves and others. Since I hope to be a teacher, its something I seek to emulate at a modest level.
5) Ultimately behind all this is my Bengali upbringing and culture that is an inclusive melange of modernity along with traditional Sakti worship and neo_vedantic influence.

 

[Aupmanyav]

You are a typical cloud-inhabiting Hindu, if I may say so.

 

[George-ananda]

It means a little bit of all these things:-

Thank you for that explanation. I am a little unclear as to your personal beliefs as you state things as an intelligent observer of things. Do you personally believe in reincarnation (as an example of what I am getting at)?

 

[sayak83]

Thank you for that explanation. I am a little unclear as to your personal beliefs as you state things as an intelligent observer of things. Do you personally believe in reincarnation (as an example of what I am getting at)?

I don't have very strong beliefs for or against reincarnation. Krishna and Buddha says it happens (at some level) but empirical evidence is lacking. Reincarnation would be an observable pattern in the world of beings, and I will be more comfortable if its actually observed systematically before taking a stand. Against this is the very vivid memory of a very young me looking at the world finding it extraordinary familiar and somewhat of a let-down. So...

 

[George-ananda]

I don't have very strong beliefs for or against reincarnation. Krishna and Buddha says it happens (at some level) but empirical evidence is lacking. Reincarnation would be an observable pattern in the world of beings, and I will be more comfortable if its actually observed systematically before taking a stand. Against this is the very vivid memory of a very young me looking at the world finding it extraordinary familiar and somewhat of a let-down. So...

You sound more like an agnostic on the reality of spirituality beyond the physical? Am I getting the correct impression?

Also what do you think of the evidence supporting the verifiable reincarnation memories of children? But in a more general sense what do you think of the so-called paranormal evidence accumulated in various subfields...Link

To my thinking, without evidence to the contrary, scientific-materialism should rule the roost. However, I personally see too much contrary evidence.

 

[Kirran]

We're rather veering off topic, but I was interested to hear you express before, George-ananda, that you would be a scientific-materialist were it not for paranormal evidences? I became an Advaitin quite a while before accepting anything in that area based on philosophical merits alone. You seem to be in some ways similar to spiritualists in your emphases, have you had time amongst them on your journey?

On another note: sayak, can we have an Interview thread where we can just ask you questions about stuff?

 

[sayak83]

You sound more like an agnostic on the reality of spirituality beyond the physical? Am I getting the correct impression?

Also what do you think of the evidence supporting the verifiable reincarnation memories of children? But in a more general sense what do you think of the so-called paranormal evidence accumulated in various subfields...Link

To my thinking, without evidence to the contrary, scientific-materialism should rule the roost. However, I personally see too much contrary evidence.

If you want to discuss this, you should pick one or two studies that you think are particularly compelling and we should discuss them in another thread.

 

[sayak83]

On another note: sayak, can we have an Interview thread where we can just ask you questions about stuff?

On chemistry?

 

[Kirran]

On chemistry?

Oh, well, I guess I'll take it. But I had history, philosophy and religion more in mind!

I'm much more a biologist to be honest - final year of a Biotechnology degree. Hence the sub-par chemistry understanding.

 

[sayak83]

Oh, well, I guess I'll take it. But I had history, philosophy and religion more in mind!

I'm much more a biologist to be honest - final year of a Biotechnology degree. Hence the sub-par chemistry understanding.

We could have a discussion. But let's not call it an interview. Makes me want to hide under the bed.

 

[Kirran]

We could have a discussion. But let's not call it an interview. Makes me want to hide under the bed.

Yeah, that's what they call that area of the forum though