Pakistani man accused of insulting Islam killed in court

[Shadow Wolf]

Are you saying Muslims are not allowed to freely? Or am I misunderstanding you?
Sorry if misunderstood

If they want me to respect their rights, they must respect my rights to speech and equally believe as I will.

 

[stvdv]

You are aware of that to draw Muhammad is against Islam, and when done it will rase anger from some but maybe not all Muslims

Exactly, Muslims should not draw Muhammad. What others do is none of their (Muslim) business.
Otherwise it would be proselytizing. Which Muslims told me, they (Muslims) should not do

 

[stvdv]

You are aware of that to draw Muhammad is against Islam, and when done it will rase anger from some but maybe not all Muslims

Would be dumm if we let "Muslims who are unable to control their anger" rule over us.
Lesson one in spiritual life = "Control your senses, especially your anger"

 

[stvdv]

is it then wrong of Muslims to say that it is wrong?

No. It's okay to say it is wrong. They obviously are ignorant, so when they explain this to us, we can explain to them, that we don't let them silence us.

 

[stvdv]

And yes some Muslims extremists did answer back in a wrong way, that I agree to too.

Extremist usually have it wrong. An important Pakistan man threatened to nuke the Netherlands over a planned drawing Muhammad context.
This is not a little bit extreme, they are crazy. And remember, this is because of how they interpret the Islam/Koran. Totally insane.

It is wrong to expect amd demand they be silenced.

And it would be even more wrong to let the Muslims get away with such disrespectful and violent threats (be silent or we nuke you).

It is wrong to protest their right to free speech.

If there is "right to free speech" then it's right to protest (in speech) "right to free speech" I guess.
The problem is that Muslim countries do not have this "right to free speech". That's why they protest against "right to free speech"
But what is horribly wrong with quite a few of them, is that they are willing to kill the whole country (nuke the Netherlands for starters) over it.

 

[stvdv]

If they want me to respect their rights, they must respect my rights to speech and equally believe as I will.

And this they will never do.

They never heard (or took serious) the saying: "Do (not do) unto others what you (do not) want others to do unto you"

 

[Revoltingest]

Some atheists say that, but I don't believe them.

You can trust me.
I wear Hawaiian shirts.

 

[Revoltingest]

I agree that free speech should be natural and good. But the strange thing is that when it comes to Islam, homosexual issues, morality, and so on, then suddenly it is not free speech anymore, so where is the line of what is ok to say and what is not ok to say?

I do not believe human beings can agree

Those things are legit subjects for free speech.
Some will be blasphemous, & that's OK.
People should be strong enuf to tolerate others
having very different beliefs. Agreement is over-rated.
It's in disagreement that things become interesting.

 

[Revoltingest]

I believe you. I also have no desire to convert others (to whatever)
Probably people who like to convert others, see this habit/desire also in others

I don't believe it's possible to convert anyone.
A change in worldview must come from within.
External influences can only provide opportunity.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I don't believe it's possible to convert anyone.
A change in worldview must come from within.
External influences can only provide opportunity.

Stop saying stuff I agree with. Were supposed to be bitter, mortal enemies, or something.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

If there is "right to free speech" then it's right to protest (in speech) "right to free speech" I guess.

In this I do believe if you value rights and expect others to respect your rights, unless someone is blatantly calling for violence and discrimination then you must not protest someone elses right. Thats called "hypocrisy." The more bitter the disagreements that are tolerated, however, the healthier and more secure society is. Amd disagreements, of course, should be civil and respect the rights of those you disagree with. Amd always resolved with words, never settled with fists or decided by cancelling. And the latter two are themselves unacceptable to even suggest or attempt to provoke.

 

[stvdv]

If there is "right to free speech" then it's right to protest (in speech) "right to free speech" I guess.

In this I do believe if you value rights and expect others to respect your rights, unless someone is blatantly calling for violence and discrimination then you must not protest someone elses right. Thats called "hypocrisy."

I think it's kind of foolish to "protest right to free speech", so someone who does this, probably is viewed a bit insane by most people. And on the other hand, any sane human will use their "right to free speech" to make it very clear, that they will never give up their earned "right to free speech".

I remember Putin giving a great speech explaining this issue very clearly:
Putin said something (off the top of my head) like: Muslims are welcome in Russia, but they should not try to sabotage our culture; they should accept our culture, not try to change it. IF they like their culture better then our culture, then I will be more than happy to escort them to their own country, where they can have their own culture.

I liked this YouTube of Putin. I think Putin gave a valuable lesson here. He was powerful, and very convincing. That is how we should be, to protect our freedom. Protest against "our right to free speech" equals sabotaging our country.

Even the Koran is very strict in this. I think they even grant you the death penalty IF you sabotage a Muslim country. Muslims understand very well, that they should not sabotage the country where they stay. So a true Muslim would never try to protest "right to free speech" in our country. IF a Muslim would sabotage our rights that means he declares war in a way, hence Putin was very strict, and I fully agreed with Putin on this.

No human should ever forget the wise phrase: "Do (not do) unto others, what you (do not) want others to do unto you". As simple as that.

 

[Piculet]

For starters, its a they.
They portrayed heavily satarized caricatures of Islamic radicals and their extremist ideology. They (several people) where butchered for practicing their rights and standing against those who get their way through fear.

Did they draw the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم? Are you sure they were ridiculing terrorism and not Islam?

 

[Piculet]

I dislike things that foster and promote misogyny, homophobia, subjugation, scientific illiteracy, and violence. This is because I value liberty, logic, equality, compassion, and justice.
But no, I'm a de facto villain simply due to being of European descent? Racist rubbish. Also, stop conflating race, religion, culture, and nationality; they're all completely different things.

The culture of the "white man" that is being spread at top speed to the rest of the world, is indeed only the "white man's" culture. Sooner than you realise, you will not just be "Liberal, logical, equal, compassionate and just" (in the sense you're able understand those words), but you will be supporting capitalism, wearing ugly clothes, listening to bad music, watching rich people on TV and thinking that the US won the second world war.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Did they draw the Prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم? Are you sure they were ridiculing terrorism and not Islam?

They drew Muhammad. I am very certain they were ridiculing extremists. Just because they did ot doesn't mean you have to or should take it personally.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I think it's kind of foolish to "protest right to free speech", so someone who does this, probably is viewed a bit insane by most people. And on the other hand, any sane human will use their "right to free speech" to make it very clear, that they will never give up their earned "right to free speech".

I remember Putin giving a great speech explaining this issue very clearly:
Putin said something (off the top of my head) like: Muslims are welcome in Russia, but they should not try to sabotage our culture; they should accept our culture, not try to change it. IF they like their culture better then our culture, then I will be more than happy to escort them to their own country, where they can have their own culture.

I liked this YouTube of Putin. I think Putin gave a valuable lesson here. He was powerful, and very convincing. That is how we should be, to protect our freedom. Protest against "our right to free speech" equals sabotaging our country.

Even the Koran is very strict in this. I think they even grant you the death penalty IF you sabotage a Muslim country. Muslims understand very well, that they should not sabotage the country where they stay. So a true Muslim would never try to protest "right to free speech" in our country. IF a Muslim would sabotage our rights that means he declares war in a way, hence Putin was very strict, and I fully agreed with Putin on this.

No human should ever forget the wise phrase: "Do (not do) unto others, what you (do not) want others to do unto you". As simple as that.

I too agree with Putin on that. People should be welcomed. They are not welcome to change our ways to turn us into the cultures they left. If they want that, they should return.

 

[Spirit of Light]

Would be dumm if we let "Muslims who are unable to control their anger" rule over us.
Lesson one in spiritual life = "Control your senses, especially your anger"

 

[Aupmanyav]

Well, guys. In today's newspaper they say that this person was an American citizen who happened to be visiting Pakistan, the country of his origin. The news paper used the words 'lured into Pakistan'. I hope you are aware of that. Sometimes we get marginal news late. He was sure a fool to return to Pakistan after what he said.

 

[Father Heathen]

The culture of the "white man" that is being spread at top speed to the rest of the world, is indeed only the "white man's" culture. Sooner than you realise, you will not just be "Liberal, logical, equal, compassionate and just" (in the sense you're able understand those words), but you will be supporting capitalism, wearing ugly clothes, listening to bad music, watching rich people on TV and thinking that the US won the second world war.

What the hell is "white man's culture"? French? German? English? Swedish? Whatever it's supposed to be, it couldn't spread if there didn't exist an interest in or demand for it. Who's to be faulted if a way of life is found to be appealing? As for "ugly clothes" and "bad music", that's a matter of personal taste, but I'm sure yours is impeccable. As for capitalism, rich people on TV, and WW2 I'm not sure what you're attempting to correlate them with.

 

[danieldemol]

. Sooner than you realise, you will not just be "Liberal, logical, equal, compassionate and just" (in the sense you're able understand those words)

We can only hope for the best

but you will be supporting capitalism,

I’m white and I don’t support capitalism.

wearing ugly clothes, listening to bad music,

If a person thinks music is in poor taste and clothes are ugly they wouldn’t use them, clearly your subjective tastes are not universally true.

watching rich people on TV

Do you only watch world vision adds and the like to the exclusion of all other TV? Getting on TV tends to attract money to people.