North Korean Nuke

[Polymath257]

OK, North Korea detonated a nuclear weapon on September 3. That seems to be a general consensus.

North Korea claims that this was a hydrogen bomb. It has made the same claim for a previous detonation, on January 6, 2016. However, the latter claim is usually dismissed because the yield of that weapon was 'only' 7-16 kilotons of TNT.

The most recent explosion has been variously estimated to be between 60 and 120 kilotons of TNT.

This makes me doubt that North Korea yet has a hydrogen bomb. The reason? Hydrogen bombs tend to have *much* larger yields (at least when first developed) around 2-3 megatons (i.e, 2000-3000 kilotons). They *can* be lower in yield, but yields of the size we see from this last North Korean explosion tend to be 'ordinary' atomic bombs that have been optimized for yield. The largest hydrogen bomb ever was 58 megatons, with 'standard' ones for the US nuclear stockpile around 2 megatons per warhead.

So, does it matter whether or not this most recent explosion was actually a hydrogen bomb? Would it change the calculation of what we need to do about it?

 

[Revoltingest]

The "hydrogen" claim appears to be bragging.
But the yield is what it is, & capability is increasing.
I for one, don't care which type of bomb kills me.
The danger is about the same.

 

[sayak83]

OK, North Korea detonated a nuclear weapon on September 3. That seems to be a general consensus.

North Korea claims that this was a hydrogen bomb. It has made the same claim for a previous detonation, on January 6, 2016. However, the latter claim is usually dismissed because the yield of that weapon was 'only' 7-16 kilotons of TNT.

The most recent explosion has been variously estimated to be between 60 and 120 kilotons of TNT.

This makes me doubt that north Korea yet has a hydrogen bomb. The reason? Hydrogen bombs tend to have *much* larger yields (at least when first developed) around 2-3 megatons (i.e, 2000-3000 kilotons). They *can* be lower in yield, but yields of the size we see from this last North Korean explosion tend to be 'ordinary' atomic bombs that have been optimized for yield. The largest hydrogen bomb ever was 58 megatons, with 'standard' ones for the US nuclear stockpile around 2 megatons per warhead.

So, does it matter whether or not this most recent explosion was actually a hydrogen bomb? Would it change the calculation of what we need to do about it?

On the bright side, a nuclear war will induce global cooling. So we would be first irradiated and then frozen instead of drowned and cooked. Maybe I will get X men powers and get to rule what's left of the world. Fingers crossed.

 

[Polymath257]

The "hydrogen" claim appears to be bragging.
But the yield is what it is, & capability is increasing.
I for one, don't care which type of bomb kills me.
The danger is about the same.

Agreed. But the likelihood of dying from an H-bomb is much higher than from a similarly placed A-bomb.

 

[BSM1]

OK, North Korea detonated a nuclear weapon on September 3. That seems to be a general consensus.

North Korea claims that this was a hydrogen bomb. It has made the same claim for a previous detonation, on January 6, 2016. However, the latter claim is usually dismissed because the yield of that weapon was 'only' 7-16 kilotons of TNT.

The most recent explosion has been variously estimated to be between 60 and 120 kilotons of TNT.

This makes me doubt that North Korea yet has a hydrogen bomb. The reason? Hydrogen bombs tend to have *much* larger yields (at least when first developed) around 2-3 megatons (i.e, 2000-3000 kilotons). They *can* be lower in yield, but yields of the size we see from this last North Korean explosion tend to be 'ordinary' atomic bombs that have been optimized for yield. The largest hydrogen bomb ever was 58 megatons, with 'standard' ones for the US nuclear stockpile around 2 megatons per warhead.

So, does it matter whether or not this most recent explosion was actually a hydrogen bomb? Would it change the calculation of what we need to do about it?

I believe that it's either a matter of time before NK is able to produce a hydrogen weapon, or Kim simply doesn't care if his weapons are atomic or nuclear.

Agreed. But the likelihood of dying from an H-bomb is much higher than from a similarly placed A-bomb.

I trust you mean in distance from ground zero.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Too me, it's not the size or power of their bombs, but the skills and diplomacy of those who have to directly deal with this issue. Trump, unfortunately, is too temperamental and too easily drawn into pointless shouting matches and biggest dick contests to handle this situation in a scrupulous manner.

 

[Revoltingest]

Agreed. But the likelihood of dying from an H-bomb is much higher than from a similarly placed A-bomb.

I was stressing fear based upon yield per bomb.
for equivalent yields, the type of bomb matters not...
.....except for differences in radioactive effects.

 

[Polymath257]

I believe that it's either a matter of time before NK is able to produce a hydrogen weapon, or Kim simply doesn't care if his weapons are atomic or nuclear.

I assume you mean hydrogen as opposed to nuclear. All Atomic and Hydrogen bombs are nuclear bombs.

I trust you mean in distance from ground zero.

Yes.

 

[sun rise]

People who I believe are astute observers have decided that Kim, being young and wanting to stay in power for his entire life, has looked around and saw what happened to other dictators in the recent past. He blames their fall at not having nukes and has decided that the best way to stay in power is to have them and a means of delivery.

How we deal with him should reflect his motivations.

 

[james dixon]

North Korea is not nor will that country ever be a threat to the USA, period. We all know this so what is the problem?

All N. Korea wants is to be recognized as a legitimate country & what’s so tuff about that?

Since all the oil/gas reserves will be sucked up and gone within 30 or so years, nuclear energy is the world’s future energy source.

The US and other countries need to offer a helping hand in building nuclear power plants for N. Korea and in exchange they export their nuclear fuel to other countries who can then build nuclear energy plants of their own.

Face it, fossil fuels are quickly becoming a thing of the past. It is time to begin the journey to a new world energy future. Nuclear will be a big player in this transition.

 

[sayak83]

I was stressing fear based upon yield per bomb.
for equivalent yields, the type of bomb matters not...
.....except for differences in radioactive effects.

I propose an assassination followed by China sponsored coup.

 

[Brickjectivity]

I propose an assassination followed by China sponsored coup.

That would incite S. Korea; and it would work against the moral claims of China's political party. It would be like admitting publicly that communism had failed.

 

[sayak83]

That would incite S. Korea; and it would work against the moral claims of China's political party. It would be like admitting publicly that communism had failed.

Nah. China would proclaim that Mao supporters have rebelled against Stalinism of the previous regime.

 

[Super Universe]

North Korea is not nor will that country ever be a threat to the USA, period. We all know this so what is the problem?

All N. Korea wants is to be recognized as a legitimate country & what’s so tuff about that?

Since all the oil/gas reserves will be sucked up and gone within 30 or so years, nuclear energy is the world’s future energy source.

The US and other countries need to offer a helping hand in building nuclear power plants for N. Korea and in exchange they export their nuclear fuel to other countries who can then build nuclear energy plants of their own.

Face it, fossil fuels are quickly becoming a thing of the past. It is time to begin the journey to a new world energy future. Nuclear will be a big player in this transition.

The problem is that they are a threat to South Korea and Japan.

All North Korea wants is to be recognized as a legitimate country? What certificate says that a country is legitimate or not? Who issues this thing? When did the US get ours? This is ridiculous. What he wants is to intimidate others and be powerful.

The oil and gas reserves will be gone in 30 years? It's longer than that, maybe 75 years, maybe even longer with the oil in North Dakota and the Canadian oil sands, but even so we will have more solar power, more wind turbines, maybe a few more dams, and biodiesel online by then.

The US and other countries need to offer a helping hand in building nuclear power plants for North Korea? This is absolutely crazy. The day after the plants were built he would kick us out of the country and start processing nuclear weapons grade material and trade some of it to Iran.

Nuclear energy will be a big player in the future? It's a big player now, in France, but I doubt it will become a big player in the US ever again.

 

[Stanyon]

Just another ugly, hairy, mole of deviant behaviour and state hooliganism by North Korea on the face of planet earth by an insane regime searching for assurances that it can continue.

 

[Jumi]

I think a country is illegitimate if it doesn't give a measure of freedom to it's citizens and doesn't kill whole families for someones mistake. The concentration camps aren't very inspiring either.

 

[Jumi]

That would incite S. Korea; and it would work against the moral claims of China's political party. It would be like admitting publicly that communism had failed.

To Chinese, North Korea is a bad joke and a failure already. I don't think anyone there really thinks they are ideological allies.

Asking people in China what they think of North Korea. People who know Chinese political thinking know this isn't just what some people on street think.

 

[Revoltingest]

I propose an assassination followed by China sponsored coup.

Assassinating me wouldn't get you.....oh, never mind.

 

[Brickjectivity]

To Chinese, North Korea is a bad joke and a failure already. I don't think anyone there really thinks they are ideological allies.

Asking people in China what they think of North Korea. People who know Chinese political thinking know this isn't just what some people on street think.

Very interesting, thanks.

By the way that led me to look at a video about Taiwan but which covered a general history of wars in the region including those with Japan:

 

[metis]

I think we're just have to get used to the idea that NK is and will likely remain a nuclear power, but at the same time make it clear that an attack on us or one of our allies will be met by force.